So I want a walking cauldron for my witch, and I just grabbed Craft Wondrous Item, but...


Advice


Everything I see of an animated cauldron is either an enemy or something featured in PF2E?

With my current witch character, I wanted to make a Omni-Cauldron that combines a lot cool magic cauldrons into one, but to start with it being a walking one so she doesn't have to carry it. Is that even possible?

Scarab Sages

ForsakenM wrote:

Everything I see of an animated cauldron is either an enemy or something featured in PF2E?

With my current witch character, I wanted to make a Omni-Cauldron that combines a lot cool magic cauldrons into one, but to start with it being a walking one so she doesn't have to carry it. Is that even possible?

Yes but it'll get expensive as each new ability will increase what you need to achieve it. Theres a table here with rough costs of things https://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/magic-item-creation/

This specific example deals with what your asking.

Example: Lisa’s paladin has horseshoes of a zephyr and wants to hire Patrick’s wizard to add the powers of horseshoes of speed to her current horseshoes. Their GM, Jessica, decides that this is a suitable item and tells Lisa and Patrick they can proceed. The price of horseshoes of speed is 3,000 gp, increased by 50% for the multiple different abilities rule to 4,500 gp. Patrick’s wizard must spend 5 days and Lisa’s paladin must pay 2,250 gp (half the 4,500 gp price difference) to add the new property to the horseshoes, resulting in an item worth 10,500 gp (6,000 gp originally + 4,500 gp for the new property).

The big issue looking a bit more into it is you'll need your GM to decide on what is and isn't a suitable ability and rework some second edition items to 1st edition suitability as I don't think a cauldron of walking is in first ed.

So lets take your cauldron of walking, I don't think 12 GP is a reasonable price for it. It might be but I'm not familiar with second ed so it feels like magic item prices might have come down in that edition. I digress.

Cauldron of Walking: 12 GP.

Now you want to add the abilities of Cauldron of Brewing to it and your GM says yes.

Cauldron of Brewing additon: (3,000 x 1.5)/2 = 2250.

You need the spells, 2250 GP and the time to add it then you'll have a cauldron of walking and brewing worth 3,012 GP.


If you want a simple animated type object, then Craft Wondrous Item will probably suffice. Something like the walking cauldron which either follows or stays when you give a command. If you want something you can control a bit more, like tell it to go places or to stay or even give it some conditions ("Move to the kitchen when the soup boils.") then you probably would need Craft Construct.

Space saving Magic Creation Theory:
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Trying to keep it simple, I would try and figure out what spell level a cauldron that moves about 30 feet might be. I would say probably 1st-level. We can probably use (Tenser's) floating disk as the base. Obviously, animate object is a natural choice for imbuing the item, but I think the floating disk spell could suffice.

It lasts hours, it can hold 100 pounds and its liquid capacity is 2-gallons. Since a normal cauldron is 5 pounds and holds one gallon, this should be enough to imbue the cauldron (obviously your cauldron can be bigger). So let's say rather than walking, the cauldron can follow you by hovering (basically the same limitations as a floating disk, only instead of disappearing if you leave its range or try to take it more than 3 feet off the ground the floating ends and the cauldron sinks slowly to the floor). Let's say it takes a command word to make it rise and start following and another to make it stop.

I would probably evaluate the ability as a continuous effect (floating disk enchanted into the cauldron). Assuming CL 1 would be enough for the cauldron and most content. It holds 1 gallon. Water is about 8 pounds, so unless you're filling it with some super dense liquid, the 100 lb limit of a CL 1 spell would be within that range. You can go to CL 2 if you plan to have a bigger or heavier cauldron (and the bigger it is, the more liquid or mass can be inside it).
Spell level x caster level x 2,000 gp = 2,000 gp.
Divided by 2, since floating disk has an hour/level duration. = 1,000 gp.

In this case, I would have the command words just be subsumed in the continuous or use-activated cost (since it's more).

So, 1,000 gp would be a close Creation table price spellwise, but we need to look at existing items also and compare prices (as well as actual in-game effects and usefulness). I would say that the floating cauldron's usefulness is not more than 1,000, since I don't think it's better than just having an item that gives you a relatively permanent floating disk (the winking out of existence would be bad sometimes, but as a permanent item, you could likely bring it back, with only worry about breakage or loss of liquids on the disk). The cauldron is much smaller (holds only 1 gallon at normal cauldron size, but could be bigger. Obviously it could hold other items, like arrows, but likely not more than a disk itself could hold.

A magic item that created a more or less permanent (or effectively permanent) floating disk would cost you 2,000 gp to buy. The cauldron is probably worse in most cases, since it's easier to steal or run off with than a floating disk of force and can also likely be destroyed or attacked and damaged much easier (hardness notwithstanding). So I (meaning, in my opinion) would rate it about half as good on these merits.

So I would likely put it in a range of 500–600 gp for the ability to float and follow you (requiring a command word to start and stop its floating/following and with leaving the spell's normal range of 30 ft causing it to stop and require reactivation, I would gauge it (this is opinion and is just art rather than science) at about 500.

Possibly the GM might require it to be a masterwork item (tool) to otherwise indicate fine craftsmanship or better materials than a normal cauldron, so add 50 gp to the base 1 gp cost and I'd estimate 551. You can round up or down to 550 or 650 if you like, but should probably take that 1 gp on the end just for posterity.

This is a little better than a walking cauldron, since it floats and avoids difficult terrain, but since we aren't really sure what a walking pot costs (12 gp is definitely not it), I'd say that seems fair.

The you add the other abilities to it, like a cauldron of brewing. It would just cost you 1,500 (half 3.000 gp.) You would not add 150% to the new abilities cost, since the cauldron is not an item that takes up a magic item slot.

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In total, if you were to make a floating cauldron of brewing, it would cost you 251–301ish gp + 1,500 gp to craft (Price 3,551+). Assuming you were to agree with my evaluation of a floating cauldron, you can disagree on the price or value there but unless it's by 500+ gp, the method works. Obviously if you want a bigger (heavier) cauldron, which might hold more liquid and mass, it would need a higher CL for its floating disk aspect and that might increase the price by 2,000 gp per CL (1,000 gp in cost per CL).

Senko wrote:
Cauldron of Brewing additon: (3,000 x 1.5)/2 = 2250.

I don't believe you add the 150% in the case of the cauldron. The example you gave is for an item that takes a magic item slot (the horse's feet or hooves slot). The cauldron is not such an item.

Multiple different abilities wrote:
Multiple Different Abilities: Abilities such as an attack roll bonus or saving throw bonus and a spell-like function are not similar, and their values are simply added together to determine the cost. For items that take up a space on a character’s body, each additional power not only has no discount but instead has a 50% increase in price.

The bolded part would be used for the cauldron. The italicized part would be for adding to an item that uses a magic item slot.


ForsakenM wrote:
... With my current witch character, I wanted to make a Omni-Cauldron that combines a lot cool magic cauldrons into one, but to start with it being a walking one so she doesn't have to carry it. Is that even possible?

"cauldron" search on AoN

as pointed out there are two themes, and they can be combined.
1) Wondrous item - it's a magic item rather than an animated object per se. I'd just talk to your GM and have him approve a Handy Haversack in the shape of a cauldron, easy peasy. As a custom Home Game item you strap it on your back and use it like a haversack. If you want to brew with it I'd add Cauldron of Brewing to the item which will actually increase the haversack cost(as it's slightly cheaper and thus becomes #2 on the list).
You could use floating disk or a spell and have it follow you about. Unseen Servant is another option but weight is severely limited.
2) Craft construct to make it a construct/golem. Pricey but it can fight back.

see Estimating Magic Item Gold Piece Values
Review Multiple Similar and Multiple Different Abilities.

combining cauldrons can get pricey as each added effect is more than simply additive. So I would keep it limited to keep costs down.


PF1 is gold based whereas PF2 is silver based, so costs are *10 for PF1. PF2 is a rather different game than PF1 so I'd try to translate the base spell into PF1 and then price it.

PF2 walking cauldron 12gp=120PF2sp -->1200PF1gp, carries 2 bulk(=20 potions{1.4#(usual) to 20#(iron flask, flasks)}, or 2 longswords{8#}), movement is not tactical(can't carry stuff for combat use). It is similar to Unseen Servant, Mount, or Floating Disk with a non-combat use restriction.
Invested means it is 1 of 10 items, so it is similar to taking up a body slot. Another restriction.


In a top down comparison look;
1-mundane) a (war trained) guard dog $25 with saddlebags $2 is about as practical and way cheaper. Can carry about the same weight, probably have to spend a move to call and a std to access items and it'll provoke, no magic item body slot(MIBS), usable in combat. It has less HPs (no hardness) and you have to feed it but it can attack, dodge, etc.

2-magic) a Handy Haversack [none] $2000 is better. More portable weight, move actn access that doesn't provoke, no MIBS, usable in combat. It is a good item and OGL.

so $900-1800 seems a fair range in pricing from a comparative look.

Since you can give it simple commands, the carried weight isn't much, and it's not fast, I'd use Unseen servant 1@1 (has the most favorable command set) with command 1/hr = $1800. I avoided the use activated & continuous cost by requiring a command per hour, the spell takes verbal commands. IMO non combat is 50% discount but if you could access stuff as a standard that provokes 25%. No body slot is *2 but the spell is external to the caster and can't attack or defend so I don't think this applies and IS a big cost impact. So a WAG for a PF1 Walking Cauldron is $1350.
Personally I'd go for the Handy (wearable) Cauldron at $2000 as I initially suggested.

Liberty's Edge

About stacking multiple abilities on the same cauldron:

As it is a customized item, I would consider whether the abilities can be used simultaneously or not before applying the multiplier. If the added ability will not work when any other abilities are in use I will lower the multiplier.

Then there is the multiplier because the cauldron doesn't use a body slot. I would consider if:
- the cauldron has combat utility or not;
- the actual size of the cauldron.
If the cauldron has no combat use and is large (not the game definition, simply an RL large cauldron) I will not apply the modifier.
It matters little if an item uses a body slot when I can always stow it away before entering a dangerous area.

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