Blast The Pain Away


Rules Discussion


Looking to begin a new campaign and a player had a good question. Regarding the Kineticist's Elemental Blast - one of the elemental types is Vitality for Wood. Vitality descriptor says it can heal living creatures, and damage undead.

So with that being said, could my player use a Vitality elemental blast to heal an ally?


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Damage doesn't heal and healing doesn't damage.

A Wood Kineticist cannot use vitality damage to heal allies any more than a Spirit Instinct Barbarian can.

You need Vitality Healing effects to heal living creatures. Not Vitality Damage.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

No.

Damage is damage and healing is healing.

Vitality damage damages undead and does nothing to the living.
Vitality healing heals the living and does nothing to the undead.

Some things, like the Heal spell, call put being able to do both.

Grand Lodge

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Wood kineticist do get healing options, though.

Fresh Produce is of limited use in combat, but is better than focus spell healing between fights--once per 10 minutes per target and doesn't require refocusing.

(It's a little weird in that it's almost strictly worse than Ocean's Balm at 1st level, but scales better.)


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A shame. It'd be funny to see a Ki Strike monk use flurry of blows to punch a party member back to health using vitality damage strikes.


Flurry of blows won't Work either because the kinetic blast is Not a a unarmed Strike or Monk Action


Tactical Drongo wrote:

Flurry of blows won't Work either because the kinetic blast is Not a a unarmed Strike or Monk Action

Kineticist not needed. Ki Strike will add 1d6 positive/vitality damage to the Monk's attacks.

It still won't heal anyone... But that wasn't the point.


Finoan wrote:
Tactical Drongo wrote:

Flurry of blows won't Work either because the kinetic blast is Not a a unarmed Strike or Monk Action

Kineticist not needed. Ki Strike will add 1d6 positive/vitality damage to the Monk's attacks.

It still won't heal anyone... But that wasn't the point.

and Even if it did, the normal hit damage from FoB would happen at the same time so he prob would not gain but lose hp.


Thread Necromancy, engage. Apologies if it's bad form.

The GM of my PFS group, as well as his mentor, is absolutely positively convinced that you can 'attack' someone with the Kineticist's Wood Elemental Blast and heal them with it. I know this doesn't work, if for no other reason that it's RIDICULOUSLY stupidly overpowered.

I understand 'healing doesn't damage and damage doesn't heal', but I am apparently incapable of explaining that to someone else. Could I pretty please get some specific rule quotes, or something from the devs, that *absolutely* dispels this misconception?


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Foxfire Inferno wrote:

Thread Necromancy, engage. Apologies if it's bad form.

The GM of my PFS group, as well as his mentor, is absolutely positively convinced that you can 'attack' someone with the Kineticist's Wood Elemental Blast and heal them with it. I know this doesn't work, if for no other reason that it's RIDICULOUSLY stupidly overpowered.

I understand 'healing doesn't damage and damage doesn't heal', but I am apparently incapable of explaining that to someone else. Could I pretty please get some specific rule quotes, or something from the devs, that *absolutely* dispels this misconception?

just report them in the PFS board. Let their heirarchy handle it. Don't name names in public though. Get in touch with one of their higher ups in PM


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Foxfire Inferno wrote:
I understand 'healing doesn't damage and damage doesn't heal', but I am apparently incapable of explaining that to someone else. Could I pretty please get some specific rule quotes, or something from the devs, that *absolutely* dispels this misconception?

Baarogue is correct, there should be someone reasonable up the hierarchy. And it's the default (and the only I guess) method to resolve such disputes in PFS when they are serious.

Also I can't give you anything more than just 'look in the text, there's nothing at all like that in it'. But still:
"When you take damage, you reduce your current Hit Points by a number equal to the damage dealt. Some spells, items, and other effects, as well as simply resting, can heal creatures. When you’re healed, you regain Hit Points equal to the amount healed, up to your maximum Hit Points."
PC1 p.410 "Hit Points"

"Two special types of energy damage specifically target the living and the undead. Vitality damage harms only undead creatures, withering undead bodies and disrupting incorporeal undead. Void damage saps life, damaging only living creatures."
PC1 p.409 "Energy Damage"

"The element determines the damage die, damage type, and range (for a ranged blast). A damage type other than a physical damage type adds its trait to the blast. <...> • Wood 1d8 bludgeoning or vitality, 30 feet
Critical Success The target takes double damage.
Success The target takes full damage."
RoE, p.16, "ELEMENTAL BLAST"

If they could show you anything there that says damage can become healing, that's would be interesting.
And then you get an awesome power to make miracles in the game to do anything you want, even if you aren't the GM. Just because it's written nowhere that you can't.

Grand Lodge

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Foxfire Inferno wrote:

Thread Necromancy, engage. Apologies if it's bad form.

The GM of my PFS group, as well as his mentor, is absolutely positively convinced that you can 'attack' someone with the Kineticist's Wood Elemental Blast and heal them with it. I know this doesn't work, if for no other reason that it's RIDICULOUSLY stupidly overpowered.

I understand 'healing doesn't damage and damage doesn't heal', but I am apparently incapable of explaining that to someone else. Could I pretty please get some specific rule quotes, or something from the devs, that *absolutely* dispels this misconception?

Why would wood kineticists have Fresh Produce (which is already very good out of combat healing) at all if elemental blast did its job so much better for free?

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