Figuring out Firearms


Rules Discussion

Scarab Sages

So I've got a player starting a gunslinger and we're trying to figure out how many actions it is to load and fire. We've run into a snag.

1. Blackpowder ammo is alchemical and has the activate trait.
2. Magical ammunition has to be used the turn its activated.
3. The alchemical trait says its specifically not magical.
4. Most firearms have a reload speed higher than 0.

So how does this actually work?

Ways I can see it:

1. Alchemical ammo is non-magic ammo, so its an action to activate, an action to load, and remains on standby until fired. 3 actions to fire a Reload 1 firearm.

2. Like the above, but works like Magic Ammunition it has to be activated the same turn you want to shoot it. Same 3 actions to fire.

3. It works more or less like any other ranged weapon. If its reload 1, you spend an action to reload and you're off to the races.

AFAIK there's no Errata for it yet and the discussions I can find either focus only on magic ammunition or treat alchemical ammunition is though its magic despite the alchemical trait saying it specifically isn't magic.


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Black Powder only has one entry for both the explosive item in various quantities from 'dose' to 'keg', and the firearm ammunition.

It doesn't have an Activate trait. It has an Activate entry and that is for the explosive item. An interact action to light it up and make it go boom. Try to avoid being in the blast radius when that happens.

The firearm ammunition item is loaded and used like any other type of ammunition. It uses the Reload action and the Reload time entry of the weapon it is being used in.

So a firearm weapon with Reload 1 would take one action to load. The ammunition can stay in there indefinitely - much like the bolt in a crossbow. Then the loaded firearm can be fired using the Strike action.

Scarab Sages

breithauptclan wrote:

Black Powder only has one entry for both the explosive item in various quantities from 'dose' to 'keg', and the firearm ammunition.

It doesn't have an Activate trait. It has an Activate entry and that is for the explosive item. An interact action to light it up and make it go boom. Try to avoid being in the blast radius when that happens.

The firearm ammunition item is loaded and used like any other type of ammunition. It uses the Reload action and the Reload time entry of the weapon it is being used in.

So a firearm weapon with Reload 1 would take one action to load. The ammunition can stay in there indefinitely - much like the bolt in a crossbow. Then the loaded firearm can be fired using the Strike action.

So can Munitions Crafting make basic firearms ammunition?

https://2e.aonprd.com/Feats.aspx?ID=3158


That works, yes.

The Firearms ammunition rules specify Alchemical Crafting for basic black powder ammunition, but Munitions Crafting gives you that.

Scarab Sages

breithauptclan wrote:

That works, yes.

The Firearms ammunition rules specify Alchemical Crafting for basic black powder ammunition, but Munitions Crafting gives you that.

Thank you so much!!


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
breithauptclan wrote:

That works, yes.

The Firearms ammunition rules specify Alchemical Crafting for basic black powder ammunition, but Munitions Crafting gives you that.

Do you know how that relates to crafting magazines of firearms ammo? Trying to figure out if and how I can create special alchemical ammo (like the new Bane rounds) in a magazine.


The14th wrote:
breithauptclan wrote:

That works, yes.

The Firearms ammunition rules specify Alchemical Crafting for basic black powder ammunition, but Munitions Crafting gives you that.

Do you know how that relates to crafting magazines of firearms ammo? Trying to figure out if and how I can create special alchemical ammo (like the new Bane rounds) in a magazine.

Munitions Crafter lets you craft alchemical ammunition, but only level 1 ammunition since your advanced alchemy level doesn't advance until you take later feats.

Likewise, using that feat to craft special kinds of ammunition is possible, but it's one unit of ammunition for one batch of infused ingredients. Alchemical ammunition isn't level 0, so the exchange rate isn't one to ten like it is when crafting ordinary black powder bullets.


You could still use the Alchemical Crafting that Munitions Crafter gives and the normal crafting rules to create alchemical ammunition up to your character level as long as you have the recipe and the time and money for crafting it.

I am not sure how to create a magazine, or if the item is refillable.

I would probably run it that crafting a spare magazine would be just like crafting any other item and that it can be loaded with the proper amount of whatever ammunition you have available - whether purchased or crafted.

Horizon Hunters

The14th wrote:
breithauptclan wrote:

That works, yes.

The Firearms ammunition rules specify Alchemical Crafting for basic black powder ammunition, but Munitions Crafting gives you that.

Do you know how that relates to crafting magazines of firearms ammo? Trying to figure out if and how I can create special alchemical ammo (like the new Bane rounds) in a magazine.

You have to craft the ammo for the magazine individually. So a Long Air Repeater Magazine would need 8 pieces crafted for it, which would be at least two craft checks to craft 4 at a time (or 8 infused reagents if using Munitions Crafter). You would also still need to activate every shot before shooting or you would waste the bullet, and you pick the enemy type when you craft it, not when you shoot.

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