New Ancestries Stat Lines (Not a fight against the new stat system.)

[Ravingdork]

TriOmegaZero wrote:

graystone wrote:

TriOmegaZero wrote:

Ravingdork wrote:

So I can't even fix them to be compatible with the new updates.

What needs fixing?

Old PC's that used the old voluntary rule are illegal as the new version is different.

Illegal for what?

Illegal for any GM who wants to abide by the current rules.

Also, people generally expect my character gallery characters to be rules compliant.

[TriOmegaZero]

And if you can't tell if they are compliant or not, how will anyone else?

[Kaspyr2077]

Ravingdork wrote:

TriOmegaZero wrote:

graystone wrote:

TriOmegaZero wrote:

Ravingdork wrote:

So I can't even fix them to be compatible with the new updates.

What needs fixing?

Old PC's that used the old voluntary rule are illegal as the new version is different.

Illegal for what?

Illegal for any GM who wants to abide by the current rules.

Also, people generally expect my character gallery characters to be rules compliant.

Pretty sure PFS is the most strict authority you'll find on the legality of such matters, and they're okay with any of the rules sets, I think, so... it should be okay?

[Malk_Content]

Kaspyr2077 wrote:

Malk_Content wrote:

Uh loads of People played elves before the change. It wasn't foolish.

Lowest HP an ancestry could have, paired with a Constitution flaw, in a system where numbers are tight and combat is challenging. Elves were at a serious "staying alive" disadvantage before. It was a serious deterrent to playing an Elf. It's one thing to be okay with a character dying, but most players want to give themselves a fighting chance.

+5 movement speed more than translates to a saving 1hp per level. If being 5ft further away prevents an enemy hitting you even once, that's way more survival benefit than having +2 con.

Regardless the con flaw can be gone now if you like, or kept if you want the extra boost! Variety and options that cater to both our gameplay ideas. Which isn't something the +2/free ancestries provide.

[Gisher]

Ravingdork wrote:

One of the things that really bugs me about the removal of Voluntary Flaws is that, of the 100 or so characters I've made over the years, I have no (easy) way to know which ones used Voluntary Flaws and which ones didn't. So I can't even fix them to be compatible with the new updates.

I whipped up a little Google Sheets spreadsheet to tell you whether or not you used the voluntary flaws. You should be able to use it online or download it as an Excel file.

• Voluntary Flaws Detector

Just enter the values for the six ability scores (ignoring Apex Items) and it will calculate the net boosts for that character and use that to tell you whether you used the voluntary flaws, didn't use the voluntary flaws, or made a mistake which created an impossible character.

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If you want to modify it or make your own version, here is a quick breakdown of the procedure that I used:

All ancestries give two net ability boosts. There is also one boost for class, two for background, and then four for a total of nine net boosts to start. Then we add four more boosts every five levels.

Using the old voluntary flaws system added one boost and two flaws which reduced your initial net boosts to eight. So any character that used the voluntary flaws option would always be one boost behind those who didn't.

Therefore we can determine whether or not you used the voluntary flaws by comparing your characters' net boosts to the following list of all possible values.

Levels 1-4
No Voluntary Flaws: 9
Voluntary Flaws: 8

Levels 5-9
No Voluntary Flaws: 13
Voluntary Flaws: 12

Levels 10-14
No Voluntary Flaws: 17
Voluntary Flaws: 16

Levels 15-19
No Voluntary Flaws: 21
Voluntary Flaws: 20

Level 20
No Voluntary Flaws: 25
Voluntary Flaws: 24

The spreadsheet calculates the net boosts for each score, totals them up, and compares the total to the list above to determine whether you used the voluntary flaws, didn't use them, or made a mistake that resulted in an impossible character.

It calculates the net boosts for each score as follows:
• If a score is less than or equal to 18, then the number of net boosts was (score – 10)/2.
• If a score is greater than 18, then the number of net boosts was 4 + (score – 18).

I hope this helps a little.

[Ravingdork]

Gisher wrote:

Ravingdork wrote:

One of the things that really bugs me about the removal of Voluntary Flaws is that, of the 100 or so characters I've made over the years, I have no (easy) way to know which ones used Voluntary Flaws and which ones didn't. So I can't even fix them to be compatible with the new updates.

I whipped up a little Google Sheets spreadsheet to tell you whether or not you used the voluntary flaws. You should be able to use it online or download it as an Excel file.

Since I have so many characters, it will still take me some time to do, but this definitely helps. It's absolutely incredible to me that you would go through that level of trouble just to help someone. Thank you so much!

[elisaelli]

I like having the +++/- and fixed ++ in the ancestry pages for the same reason I like the write ups and sample names - I sadly don't live on Golarion and it's interesting to know what people might expect of my character and it aids in my characterization and roleplay of the character. I absolutely would be annoyed if paizo went the route of just saying two fixed boosts and no longer printing the other options, and I agree that mechanically the +++- is more interesting - all but one of my PCs to date has used that array. Like many others, it's not about the new options which I find great and will also utilize, it's about having the whole buffet of possibilities.

[Gortle]

Ravingdork wrote:

Gisher wrote:

Ravingdork wrote:

One of the things that really bugs me about the removal of Voluntary Flaws is that, of the 100 or so characters I've made over the years, I have no (easy) way to know which ones used Voluntary Flaws and which ones didn't. So I can't even fix them to be compatible with the new updates.

I whipped up a little Google Sheets spreadsheet to tell you whether or not you used the voluntary flaws. You should be able to use it online or download it as an Excel file.

Since I have so many characters, it will still take me some time to do, but this definitely helps. It's absolutely incredible to me that you would go through that level of trouble just to help someone. Thank you so much!

There are two backgrounds that will make these calculations out by one: Discarded Duplicate and Amnesiac.

[Ravingdork]

Gortle wrote:

Ravingdork wrote:

Gisher wrote:

Ravingdork wrote:

One of the things that really bugs me about the removal of Voluntary Flaws is that, of the 100 or so characters I've made over the years, I have no (easy) way to know which ones used Voluntary Flaws and which ones didn't. So I can't even fix them to be compatible with the new updates.

I whipped up a little Google Sheets spreadsheet to tell you whether or not you used the voluntary flaws. You should be able to use it online or download it as an Excel file.

Since I have so many characters, it will still take me some time to do, but this definitely helps. It's absolutely incredible to me that you would go through that level of trouble just to help someone. Thank you so much!

There are two backgrounds that will make these calculations out by one: Discarded Duplicate and Amnesiac.

Thanks for the heads up!