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Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

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Double-posting to acknowledge an earlier error.

In my previous post, I suggested that Vudra was a bit on the small side? Well, see the other comment I made about "still trying to wrap my brain around Golarion geography" because I got that one totally wrong. Vudra is apparently approximate the size of Avistan.

Now, it still needs a good Aberrant rulebook to support it, but that's the sort of thing that could pretty easily happen in the same block, especially if accompanied by a Vudra-locale AP that went heavy on the aberrants. I still think they might want to nail down Casmaron a bit netter before they jump in on Vudra, but I'll admit that at the scale we're talking about here, that's less important than I was thinking it was. So... Vudra is also a distinct possibility for 2025.


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Why would Arcadia require a nautical book? Most of the folks on that continent are from there, with foreign colonists very rare.

We've also got several aquatic Ancestries in PF2 now (Azarketi, the coming Athamarus and Merfolk), which I think would've gone into an undersea book if one was planned.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Clearly if Casmoran is still too nebulous we can settle for separate kelesh and vudra books.

... I just really want Vudra content.


keftiu wrote:

Why would Arcadia require a nautical book? Most of the folks on that continent are from there, with foreign colonists very rare.

We've also got several aquatic Ancestries in PF2 now (Azarketi, the coming Athamarus and Merfolk), which I think would've gone into an undersea book if one was planned.

Basically every way of connecting existing content to Arcadia talks about the long, dangerous overseas voyages necessary to get there... and the fact that we've been racking up undersea ancestries (and the existence of the Firebrands book) is one of the reasons that I'm expecting we'll see an oceanic adventures book of some sort soonish. It's kind of like how including centaurs and minotaurs makes Iblydos more likely rather than less.

Honestly, on Arcadia it's more of a gut reaction thing. I feel like it really wants a few more bricks... and I feel like "aquatic adventures" is a reasonable brick to support it. Possibly at one remove? Like, aquatic adventures opens up a Lost Omens book that can have a few more Arcadia references in it. Hey - the word "guessing" is in the title for a reason.


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Sanityfaerie wrote:
Basically every way of connecting existing content to Arcadia talks about the long, dangerous overseas voyages necessary to get there... and the fact that we've been racking up undersea ancestries (and the existence of the Firebrands book) is one of the reasons that I'm expecting we'll see an oceanic adventures book of some sort soonish. It's kind of like how including centaurs and minotaurs makes Iblydos more likely rather than less.

Another potential brick, but they are actively working on a ship combat subsystem for Starfinder 2e. Given the turbulent reception all iterations of those systems have been received so far, I would expect they will be putting a LOT of effort into making it as interesting as possible.

Given the similar mechanical underpinnings of both games, they can probably expend a little more effort after that is finished to file the serial numbers off for use in Pathfinder. Might even be something to the idea of running overlapping playtests for both game versions, to get complimentary feedback from different slightly player bases and system assumptions.


keftiu wrote:
NerdOver9000 wrote:
The-Magic-Sword wrote:


Maybe they're talking about Starfinder 2e being compatible and ORC? What with the word "Gap"

It will be nice for tech fabs, we're already planning on introducibg a lot of it to our PF game as JRPG style magitech.

That's the thing I'm most excited about with the two systems being compatible. I'd love to craft a time hopping Chrono Trigger style campaign, hopping between times and picking up party members as we go. I doubt we'll ever see official support for it, but I can dream...
I mean, there was a Society special about jumping between the two fairly recently, so it's not completely off the table officially...

A link to the source pls?

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

Fate in the Future and Perils of the Past are complimentary specials.


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AnimatedPaper wrote:
Given the similar mechanical underpinnings of both games, they can probably expend a little more effort after that is finished to file the serial numbers off for use in Pathfinder. Might even be something to the idea of running overlapping playtests for both game versions, to get complimentary feedback from different slightly player bases and system assumptions.

To expand on this guess, I don't expect to see a Pathfinder class playtest at all for the 2024 - 2025 season. I would assume any extra resources that would go to that will be used up by the Starfinder playtest. I think we might see something like a ship combat system or a similar, serial number filed off subsystem playtest, so that the Pathfinder team can do some of the lifting without losing ground on their own design targets.


AnimatedPaper wrote:
AnimatedPaper wrote:
Given the similar mechanical underpinnings of both games, they can probably expend a little more effort after that is finished to file the serial numbers off for use in Pathfinder. Might even be something to the idea of running overlapping playtests for both game versions, to get complimentary feedback from different slightly player bases and system assumptions.
To expand on this guess, I don't expect to see a Pathfinder class playtest at all for the 2024 - 2025 season. I would assume any extra resources that would go to that will be used up by the Starfinder playtest. I think we might see something like a ship combat system or a similar, serial number filed off subsystem playtest, so that the Pathfinder team can do some of the lifting without losing ground on their own design targets.

I could see this pointing to some kind of naval book in a weird way. Testing something like a sailing subsystem that could be rejiggered to work with spaceships. Some things are likely to be the same, since elevation isn't something really represented on the kinds of maps that folks play on.


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Luis Loza has previously said that ship rules might take the place of a year's class playtest, if such a thing existed.


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keftiu wrote:
Luis Loza has previously said that ship rules might take the place of a year's class playtest, if such a thing existed.

I would love a naval warfare/ ship rules playtest because currently thiers just not enough rules to do naval combat plus ship hp needs to be massively increased to be able to stand up to more than one canons worth of damage.

and bieng able to do a proper pirate campaign is something I want!


I think there will be some book with ninja and samurai added. Maybe not as a class but as a archtype?


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If those aren’t in the upcoming Tian Xia books, I wouldn’t expect them at all.

Liberty's Edge

AnimatedPaper wrote:
If those aren’t in the upcoming Tian Xia books, I wouldn’t expect them at all.

Indeed. If the mechanisms are not there, it likely means Paizo feels the current rules adequately cover them.

Of course, samurai and ninja were already in the setting in PF1, so they will still be there in PF2. Just maybe not with specific rules.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

While I don’t know that this is something we have been building towards, it occurs to me that with the development of Starfinder 2E, a Dark Tapestry and Dominion of the Black book for Pathfinder would be a great way to add some synergy between the two settings. The Dark Tapestry section would have all the cosmic horror/cthulhu mythos goodies. While the Dominion of the Black section would have alien space terror goodies. As a Pathfinder book it would be more closely themed towards the fantasy side of cosmic entities and alien visitations in the dark of night. But the book could point to Starfinder for those looking for stronger Science Fiction elements.


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Perpdepog wrote:
AnimatedPaper wrote:
AnimatedPaper wrote:
Given the similar mechanical underpinnings of both games, they can probably expend a little more effort after that is finished to file the serial numbers off for use in Pathfinder. Might even be something to the idea of running overlapping playtests for both game versions, to get complimentary feedback from different slightly player bases and system assumptions.
To expand on this guess, I don't expect to see a Pathfinder class playtest at all for the 2024 - 2025 season. I would assume any extra resources that would go to that will be used up by the Starfinder playtest. I think we might see something like a ship combat system or a similar, serial number filed off subsystem playtest, so that the Pathfinder team can do some of the lifting without losing ground on their own design targets.
I could see this pointing to some kind of naval book in a weird way. Testing something like a sailing subsystem that could be rejiggered to work with spaceships. Some things are likely to be the same, since elevation isn't something really represented on the kinds of maps that folks play on.

I'm down for a nautical ship / air ship playtest that sets up a high seas rule book for island hopping campaigns. Getting a book to set up a One Piece campaign AND slyly help playtest SF2e star ship roles at the same time would be a great use of a playtest


I have no interest in nautical ship-to-ship combat as a subsystem. But I do have to acknowledge that I am also at a loss in how to run such a battle *without* a subsystem. Ultimately I would rather see a "new classes" playtest rather than "ship combat playtest" as the former is way more applicable to most campaigns (as long as we don't see a return of the dreaded "Rare" tag) whereas the latter is fairly...water/ocean/river dependant. Ok ok, sandships are cool. Aaaand airships. But still...


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Saga Lands
Irrisen, Lands of the Linnorm Kings, New Thassilon, Realm of the Mammoth Lords, Varisia

1. In 2E Shoanti Totemism changed to being called Shoanti Animism.
2. Animist is a soon to be released class.
3. The Path of Aganhei is a direct route between the Saga Land and Tian Xia.
4. The Saga Lands have a minority population of Tians. Having the Tian peoples better described allows the minority populations in the Saga Lands to have appropriate background information.
5. Quest of the Frozen Flame Adventure Path fills in information on the Realm of the Mammoth Lords
6. Seven Dooms for Sandpoint Adventure Path fills in current information for Sandpoint.
7. Mythic rules help to ensure accuracy for the mythic personalities in the region, such as Runelords and Baba Yaga.
8. Stasian Technology, Winter Touched Human Heritage, Viking Archetype, and the Linnorm dragons help prepare us for Irrisen and Lands of the Linnorm Kings.
9. The Stolen Fate Adventure Path and the Harrow Deck help prepare us for Varisia the nation and Varisians the people.
10. Many of the Fey elements are already available. And Howl of the Wild fills in the missing pieces for the Land of the Linnorm King’s Beastkin and Werecreature traditions.
11. The adventure Rusthenge gives us a 1st level adventure in the Sagalands that can serve as an introduction to the area.
12. The Saga Lands make for a great jumping off point into Arcadia since the two have direct ties.

I do hope we get a Character Guide though. I would have loved to have had a Character Guide of the Mwangi Expanse and the Impossible Lands.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

On a different note, the recently announced adventure Prey for Death serves double duty as a building block. On one hand it helps fill in information of the Red Mantis Assassins and by extension Mediogalti Island, which helps prepare us for a High Seas book. And on the other hand, information on the Red Mantis Assassins helps build towards an intrigue/spies/espionage book. Which, I would guess we need an intrigue/spies/espionage book before going to the Shining Kingdoms, the Golden Road, and a big chunk of Casmaron.

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