Sorry for posting again. I try not to spam up forums.
Starting 7th level wizard
Picked Improved Familiar
I know it's suboptimal, but I went with Liminal Sprite over Lirakian Azata.
I would much prefer working with a familiar that prefers wearing clothes rather than one that doesn't. (Long story short, the art of the azata is nude, and would draw unwanted and unnecessary attention from the group.)
I've looked around the forums for ways to deal with the inside/outside sleep issue. I brought a few of the solutions up with my DM, and though Rope Trick and shelter creation spells work outdoors, I'm lacking solutions for indoors, such as in a dungeon. Short of using Dimension Door to return to the entrance of a dungeon, how might a 7th level wizard bring the Outside inside?
Why not just tell your group that you've taught your friend the value of wearing clothes?
Web Shelter? The sprite could rest "in the external features" (a.k.a. the web itself) if your GM agrees.
Secure shelter doesn't have to be cast outside, you just need to find a 20'x20' area to place it.
Sturdy Tree Fort can also be cast inside and only needs a 10'x10' area - but isn't on the wizard spell list.
Subject to GM approval, there's several transportable mundane items that could be considered to be a temporary building. Such as a privacy shelter, portable sweat lodge, or even just a large tent.
Why would rope trick work for the sprite outdoors but not indoors?
Claxon wrote: Why not just tell your group that you've taught your friend the value of wearing clothes? My group is more than a bit immature. I'm the little brother of the group, though I'm the same age as all of them. I'd rather just avoid the issue entirely.
@Belafon - My DMs logic behind rope trick is that the spell simply creates another room. A room within a room does not work. Even if the spell creates a space, it still counts as "inside."
The way my DM is interpreting the curse is as follows.
Outside = Positive
Inside = Negative
So long as there is both a positive and a negative, the sprite can sleep. Since shelter spells create the negative, they allow for the sprite to sleep outside. However, rope trick still creates a negative. Therefore, it does not fix the inside a dungeon issue.
Do you have access to the Keep Watch spell?
The easiest solution is to avoid sleep entirely. If Keep Watch isn’t an option, you can use lesser restoration to remove the fatigue.
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Vaercious wrote: Claxon wrote: Why not just tell your group that you've taught your friend the value of wearing clothes? My group is more than a bit immature. I'm the little brother of the group, though I'm the same age as all of them. I'd rather just avoid the issue entirely. I realize this isn't game advice, but perhaps you ought to address whatever the root cause of the above is.
Vaercious wrote: @Belafon - My DMs logic behind rope trick is that the spell simply creates another room. A room within a room does not work. Even if the spell creates a space, it still counts as "inside."
The way my DM is interpreting the curse is as follows.
Outside = Positive
Inside = Negative
So long as there is both a positive and a negative, the sprite can sleep. Since shelter spells create the negative, they allow for the sprite to sleep outside. However, rope trick still creates a negative. Therefore, it does not fix the inside a dungeon issue.
It's up to your GM, of course, but that seems like an interpretation that's going to cause a lot of edge cases and arguments. Sekamina and Orv - the deeper levels of the Darklands - are home to huge caverns and thriving ecosystems. So your sprite could sleep anywhere in those caverns because they are both inside (Golarion) and outside (in the vegetation of the cavern)? Or they can't sleep anywhere in them because they are always "inside?" How is that different from a surface-accessible cave that has vines growing in it?
I'd go with a more literal reading of the description, just to simplify:
Quote: a loophole exists that allows them to find rest within the external features of a building. As a result, liminal sprites make their homes under eaves, porches, and staircases. It has to sleep in those external features of a building. The building itself can be under the sky, in a cavern, or constructed inside a ballroom.
Again, I get where your GM is coming from, and "under the eaves of a sturdy tree fort cast inside the castle throne room" probably isn't really what the writer was thinking. But I can just see so many arguments breaking out about what constitutes "inside" and "outside," especially if you find yourself in a megadungeon of some kind.
Belafon wrote: Vaercious wrote: @Belafon - My DMs logic behind rope trick is that the spell simply creates another room. A room within a room does not work. Even if the spell creates a space, it still counts as "inside."
The way my DM is interpreting the curse is as follows.
Outside = Positive
Inside = Negative
So long as there is both a positive and a negative, the sprite can sleep. Since shelter spells create the negative, they allow for the sprite to sleep outside. However, rope trick still creates a negative. Therefore, it does not fix the inside a dungeon issue.
It's up to your GM, of course, but that seems like an interpretation that's going to cause a lot of edge cases and arguments. Sekamina and Orv - the deeper levels of the Darklands - are home to huge caverns and thriving ecosystems. So your sprite could sleep anywhere in those caverns because they are both inside (Golarion) and outside (in the vegetation of the cavern)? Or they can't sleep anywhere in them because they are always "inside?" How is that different from a surface-accessible cave that has vines growing in it?
I'd go with a more literal reading of the description, just to simplify:
Quote: a loophole exists that allows them to find rest within the external features of a building. As a result, liminal sprites make their homes under eaves, porches, and staircases. It has to sleep in those external features of a building. The building itself can be under the sky, in a cavern, or constructed inside a ballroom.
Again, I get where your GM is coming from, and "under the eaves of a sturdy tree fort cast inside the castle throne room" probably isn't really what the writer was thinking. But I can just see so many arguments breaking out about what constitutes "inside" and "outside," especially if you find yourself in a megadungeon of some kind. I will bring this up with the DM, as well. Straight forward often means less overthinking, and considering the above defining feature would limit my headaches, I will focus my efforts on this.
Thank you, kindly.
Melkiador wrote: Do you have access to the Keep Watch spell?
The easiest solution is to avoid sleep entirely. If Keep Watch isn’t an option, you can use lesser restoration to remove the fatigue.
As my DM goes off of a "must have book to use thing" policy, I will be buying the book that this is in forthwith. This is the key I needed, and I am absolutely thankful.
Claxon wrote: Vaercious wrote: Claxon wrote: Why not just tell your group that you've taught your friend the value of wearing clothes? My group is more than a bit immature. I'm the little brother of the group, though I'm the same age as all of them. I'd rather just avoid the issue entirely. I realize this isn't game advice, but perhaps you ought to address whatever the root cause of the above is. Advice is still advice, so your comment is still appreciated. However, I've tried that, and unfortunately, it's always been this way, and despite a decade or so of effort, their opinion of me hasn't changed. They're still nice people, though, so I keep them around.
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