Another idea about CON


Kineticist Class


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

A lot of the suggestions I have seen about adding Con stuff to the class feel like attribute substations that don’t really feel connected to what the attribute does in the game.

What if the way to link burn, overflow, and Con in the game is to pull con down to its root and look at the holding breath, suffocation mechanic?

I don’t think the class should be holding its breath the whole time it is has an element gathered, but if there was a timer that worked like that, and overflow double hastened, then Constitution would matter to the class in a way that really felt like constitution. Maybe it is too much to have another counter to track, but if instead of suffocating you got fatigued as soon as the timer went to 0, and then from fatigued to exhausted if it happened again, it feels like it would fit the narrative people are pushing for wanting more Con in the class?

I am sure the developers have some better way to implement it than I am going to work out, but integrating breath and breathing into the class would thematically be very cool.


I'd rather have the class have nothing to do with Con than bring in a burn like mechanic that's required. I'd like con to do more for the class but not is it means we also have t have burn.


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I think the problem with using the drowning rules for this is that it's a thing that involves tracking "how many turns" which isn't a normal combat activity. It's doable, but it's bookkeeping.

I think you're right in that thematically Constitution needs to have something to do with "opening your internal gate to gather an element," since this is specifically the thing that's hard on your body to do. As it stands "gather power" is kind of an action tax like drawing a weapon but you do it over and over again. I wonder if we couldn't let the kineticist do more with "Gather Power" on account that they're tough, but they're limited (by said toughness) in how much they can do. It really feels like "keeping your gate open longer than you absolutely have to" is the thing the Kineticist would want to do that also puts stress on their bodies.

I imagine something like "Gather for one action, overflow for two actions, reaction to retain your element with a con-based roll and crit failing this is painful."


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

If the burn out was that you just had to re-gather your element to avoid burning out, it would be less restrictive than the playtest as far as overflow abilities. Having to regather once every 10 or so activities or actions isn't too bad.


The real problem is that it's currently impossible (I believe) to base a check on Constitution. We've turned everything into a skills check (like "can you lift the heavy thing" is an Athletics check not a Strength check) so we'd need to invent something else. If there was a single skill that was based on Constitution we could make a skills check for "are you tough enough to do [whatever] with your internal gate" but alas.


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PossibleCabbage wrote:
The real problem is that it's currently impossible (I believe) to base a check on Constitution. We've turned everything into a skills check (like "can you lift the heavy thing" is an Athletics check not a Strength check) so we'd need to invent something else. If there was a single skill that was based on Constitution we could make a skills check for "are you tough enough to do [whatever] with your internal gate" but alas.

Fortitude save.


Dubious Scholar wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
The real problem is that it's currently impossible (I believe) to base a check on Constitution. We've turned everything into a skills check (like "can you lift the heavy thing" is an Athletics check not a Strength check) so we'd need to invent something else. If there was a single skill that was based on Constitution we could make a skills check for "are you tough enough to do [whatever] with your internal gate" but alas.
Fortitude save.

That runs into issues where you have the absolute best fortitude save in the game and certain things you can activate (e.g. Stone Shield) increase it even further. More the latter than the former, but I guess it could work.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Maybe gathering elements was a fortitude check against your level DC. Not a save, so it doesn’t get juggernaut. CF:1 element point. Failure: 2, success: 3, CS: 4. Overflow actions use an element.
By default, you could only ever have 4, and you can only gather 1 type of element with the action. A Later feat would let you gather different ones together.

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