Math Fun: Lvl 20 Thaumaturge + Magus MC + Ranger MC Damage (Free Archetype)


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Ok, so, I was throwing some numbers on a spreadsheet and just trying to push as much damage off the top of my head for a Thaumaturge. I am not assuming this is the highest damage you can get with any character or anything. Again, this is just using stuff I knew of already and didn't have to research deep into and I got some pretty crazy results. Just wanted to make sure my math was right and to see if anyone knows of anything that could push it further. This is all theoretical and assumes a perfect setup for a critical hit.

These are the elected feats/abilities that contribute:
Ranger Dedication
Gravity Weapon
Magus Dedication
Spellstrike
Striker's Scroll
Tome Implement to Crit Fish

This is our gear and abilities contributing to damage:

Strength (Maxed at 22 using STR Apex Item) = 6 (flat damage)
1-Handed 1d6 Weapon w/ Major Striking Rune and Deadly d10 = 4d6 + 3d10 (avg. 30.5, max. 54
Esoteric Vulnerability (Lvl 20 Minimum) = 12 (flat damage)
Implement's Empowerment (per damage die) = 2 (flat damage)
Greater Weapon Specialization = 6 (flat damage)
Gravity Weapon (per damage die) = 2 (flat damage)
Lvl 10 Disintegrate Scroll = 20d10 (avg. 110, max. 200 - assuming failed save, thus critical failed save)

Alright, so the deadly d10 is what is going to make the math a bit tricky to formulate but here is what I have:

(2*(Weapon Damage[4d6] + Strength[6] + Implement's Empowerment[8] + Greater Weapon Specialization[6] + Gravity Weapon[8] + Disintegrate[20d10]))+ Esoteric Vulnerability[12] + Implement's Empowerment[6] + Deadly d10[3d10] + Gravity Weapon[6]

So, you might wonder why Implement's Empowerment and Gravity Weapon are calculated twice in the formula and in different locations. This is because they scale with weapon damage die, and since Deadly d10 is adding additional improved damage die AFTER doubling damage, these 2 need to be calculated again outside of the doubling.

Alright, so after all that, here is the plug-and-chug numbers for the average and max damage:

Average: (2*(14+6+8+6+8+110))+12+6+16.5+6 = 344.5 TOTAL
Max: (2*(24+6+8+6+8+200))+12+6+30+6 = 558 TOTAL


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A pick will net you more damage. 9d10 > 8d6 +3d10. Plus the extra damage from pick specialization.

So weapon damage would be 57.5 average with a max of 98. Assuming pick specialization.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
aobst128 wrote:
A pick will net you more damage. 9d10 > 8d6 +3d10. Plus the extra damage from pick specialization.

Generally, yes. However, if you calculate the extra Implement's Empowerment and Gravity Weapon damage for the extra number of weapon dice the deadly weapon gives, you the deadly weapon edges out the fatal weapon (pick) though the pick is still on top for max damage by about the same amount. The difference between deadly and fatal starts to become a bit negligible with this detail. Fatal is probably easier to calculate as though....

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
aobst128 wrote:
So weapon damage would be 57.5 average with a max of 98. Assuming pick specialization.

Oh, shoot, I missed that detail. Yeah, that definitely probably puts pick ahead of everything. No wonder Mios is wielding one.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
John R. wrote:
aobst128 wrote:
A pick will net you more damage. 9d10 > 8d6 +3d10. Plus the extra damage from pick specialization.
Generally, yes. However, if you calculate the extra Implement's Empowerment and Gravity Weapon damage for the extra number of weapon dice the deadly weapon gives, you the deadly weapon edges out the fatal weapon (pick) though the pick is still on top for max damage by about the same amount. The difference between deadly and fatal starts to become a bit negligible with this detail. Fatal is probably easier to calculate as though....

Deadly dice do not count as weapon dice for calculations. Just the base amount of dice from your striking runes are counted.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
aobst128 wrote:
John R. wrote:
aobst128 wrote:
A pick will net you more damage. 9d10 > 8d6 +3d10. Plus the extra damage from pick specialization.
Generally, yes. However, if you calculate the extra Implement's Empowerment and Gravity Weapon damage for the extra number of weapon dice the deadly weapon gives, you the deadly weapon edges out the fatal weapon (pick) though the pick is still on top for max damage by about the same amount. The difference between deadly and fatal starts to become a bit negligible with this detail. Fatal is probably easier to calculate as though....
Deadly dice do not count as weapon dice for calculations. Just the base amount of dice from your striking runes are counted.

Ah, ok. I did not know that. I just assumed based on reading it literally. That pretty much makes this all pointless compared to all the other ways people have calculated high damage builds.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
John R. wrote:
aobst128 wrote:
John R. wrote:
aobst128 wrote:
A pick will net you more damage. 9d10 > 8d6 +3d10. Plus the extra damage from pick specialization.
Generally, yes. However, if you calculate the extra Implement's Empowerment and Gravity Weapon damage for the extra number of weapon dice the deadly weapon gives, you the deadly weapon edges out the fatal weapon (pick) though the pick is still on top for max damage by about the same amount. The difference between deadly and fatal starts to become a bit negligible with this detail. Fatal is probably easier to calculate as though....
Deadly dice do not count as weapon dice for calculations. Just the base amount of dice from your striking runes are counted.
Ah, ok. I did not know that. I just assumed based on reading it literally. That pretty much makes this all pointless compared to all the other ways people have calculated high damage builds.

Possibly, but spellstrike is still a cool option for tome that I hadn't thought of. Scroll striker could be used in conjunction with scroll esoterica too to get free scrolls.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
aobst128 wrote:
John R. wrote:
aobst128 wrote:
John R. wrote:
aobst128 wrote:
A pick will net you more damage. 9d10 > 8d6 +3d10. Plus the extra damage from pick specialization.
Generally, yes. However, if you calculate the extra Implement's Empowerment and Gravity Weapon damage for the extra number of weapon dice the deadly weapon gives, you the deadly weapon edges out the fatal weapon (pick) though the pick is still on top for max damage by about the same amount. The difference between deadly and fatal starts to become a bit negligible with this detail. Fatal is probably easier to calculate as though....
Deadly dice do not count as weapon dice for calculations. Just the base amount of dice from your striking runes are counted.
Ah, ok. I did not know that. I just assumed based on reading it literally. That pretty much makes this all pointless compared to all the other ways people have calculated high damage builds.
Possibly, but spellstrike is still a cool option for tome that I hadn't thought of. Scroll striker could be used in conjunction with scroll esoterica too to get free scrolls.

Oh yes, of course, no question about it.


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Tome thaumaturge past 9th level might be the best multiclass spellstriker. Not as accurate as a fighter but you can pocket a crit like an investigator more flexibility. Gives me flashbacks to warlock/champions back in 5e that could pocket incredible crits.

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