Premature discussion about the Psychic


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

51 to 100 of 362 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | next > last >>

3 people marked this as a favorite.

As much as I enjoyed the presentation part of know directions psychic stream over Nonats thaumaturge reveal, I am starting to get jealous lol. Thaumaturge has had every aspect of it revealed while psychic has had very little (though what was talked about is very exciting). I was getting annoyed with people who were saying it but I'm jumping on the bandwagon now


Gaulin wrote:
As much as I enjoyed the presentation part of know directions psychic stream over Nonats thaumaturge reveal, I am starting to get jealous lol. Thaumaturge has had every aspect of it revealed while psychic has had very little (though what was talked about is very exciting). I was getting annoyed with people who were saying it but I'm jumping on the bandwagon now

I think a middle ground would be optimal in the future. I like Nonat's full reveal, but I think it would be best if it was a bit more limited. Leave something to anticipate in the final product.

Full class features, 2-3 class paths and a few feats that the presenter thinks are cool. That'd be great.

So..... how about a second reveal stream, Paizo? Pretty please? :D


In a FA game, you can slap Captivator into any Cha caster and it will be incredible.

Pretty sure Sentinel will be good too (as usual). A martial dedication for extra HP might be good too if they can add something to the class with some of their feats.

Besides that, it is hard to tell which archetypes are going to work well until we get the full picture.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Karmagator wrote:

I think a middle ground would be optimal in the future. I like Nonat's full reveal, but I think it would be best if it was a bit more limited. Leave something to anticipate in the final product.

Full class features, 2-3 class paths and a few feats that the presenter thinks are cool. That'd be great.

So..... how about a second reveal stream, Paizo? Pretty please? :D

I personally really like the full reveal since for me, the hype is built by imagining what I could do with the class. Like, it's all well and good to come up with concepts for stuff, like awhile back, there was the thaum thread about flavoring exploit weakness, but now I can be like "oh, I can make a cool illusion using fencer by using the scroll thaumaturgy line with captivator dedication with the mirror implement"


5 people marked this as a favorite.
Karmagator wrote:

...

The only thing that has me kinda bummed is Tangible Dream's cantrip stuff, they're not really my cup of tea. Everything else so far has me very much excited as well!
...

Tastes are funny things. Tangible Dream is the conscious mind that I'm most excited about. :)


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Alchemic_Genius wrote:
Karmagator wrote:

I think a middle ground would be optimal in the future. I like Nonat's full reveal, but I think it would be best if it was a bit more limited. Leave something to anticipate in the final product.

Full class features, 2-3 class paths and a few feats that the presenter thinks are cool. That'd be great.

So..... how about a second reveal stream, Paizo? Pretty please? :D

I personally really like the full reveal since for me, the hype is built by imagining what I could do with the class. Like, it's all well and good to come up with concepts for stuff, like awhile back, there was the thaum thread about flavoring exploit weakness, but now I can be like "oh, I can make a cool illusion using fencer by using the scroll thaumaturgy line with captivator dedication with the mirror implement"

I totally feel you ^^


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Gisher wrote:
Karmagator wrote:

...

The only thing that has me kinda bummed is Tangible Dream's cantrip stuff, they're not really my cup of tea. Everything else so far has me very much excited as well!
...
Tastes are funny things. Tangible Dream is the conscious mind that I'm most excited about. :)

They are, aren't they ^^? I really like the idea of it as well - which is what made it one of my two most anticipated ones - but it turned out a little to defense/support-focused for me. I have a clear preference for heavy crowd control, damage output and generally messing with the enemy's stuff. Dead is the best condition to apply and all that ;).

Depending on what the final thing looks like, I might also change my mind.

I doubt I'll get ever excited over the shield stuff, but g!% d%$n is it good. Basically once per fight, for a focus point you can more or less negate a hit on your main frontliner from relative safety, often buying them another round before they need healing. It only technically has two failure conditions due to shield's one round duration, because (unless you messed up the timing) how likely is it that nobody gets attacked or all enemies miss all their attacks for an entire round? And in that case, since you have two focus points and your shield is unbroken, you can just do it again. If it didn't work again, clearly you didn't need it in the first place and all is good.

For the second one, my party and I are fundamentally incapable of creating characters without darkvision, so dancing lights' benefit doesn't look great. But depending on how the latter's "flashbang"-style amp works, it might come back into consideration, who knows?

My current favourites stay Silent Whisper (ironic, since it seems to have a decent support bend as well) and Distant Grasp. I just hope Silent Whisper got a significant upgrade in the daze department - ideally a different cantrip entirely - or I'm gonna be real sad :/. Message being ridiculously amazing might make up for it, though, especially since we are likely playing Bloodlords next. Communication and deception are key in any intrigue campaign.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Alchemic_Genius wrote:
Karmagator wrote:

I think a middle ground would be optimal in the future. I like Nonat's full reveal, but I think it would be best if it was a bit more limited. Leave something to anticipate in the final product.

Full class features, 2-3 class paths and a few feats that the presenter thinks are cool. That'd be great.

So..... how about a second reveal stream, Paizo? Pretty please? :D

I personally really like the full reveal since for me, the hype is built by imagining what I could do with the class. Like, it's all well and good to come up with concepts for stuff, like awhile back, there was the thaum thread about flavoring exploit weakness, but now I can be like "oh, I can make a cool illusion using fencer by using the scroll thaumaturgy line with captivator dedication with the mirror implement"

We'll likely get some version of that in about two weeks, when subscribers get their copies. Nonat has already said he would do a full overview of the book then (as he has done in the past). I wouldn't terribly mind a full reveal a la thaumaturge either ^^


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Gisher wrote:
Lollerabe wrote:
I gotta admit the psychic had zero appeal to me when it was first announced and even during the playtest. But damn it looks awesome, super flavorful and versatile. And it's seems to be a runner up for strongest dedication class 2
Now I'm curious. Which dedications do you consider to be the strongest right now?

Strongest ? Champion. The fact that you get the actual reaction and not a toned down version is insane.

Below champion but still great: Medic (my current char took it for flavor reasons, and even tho I got lack of free hand issues it's still super strong)

Blessed one

Beyond those it's very build specific I would say. But those 3 stands out as always being very impactful.

Edit: Oh and sentinel, as it is almost mandatory on certain classes if you want to optimize.
If we get acces to medium armors with the bulwark trait, that's gonna change however.
it's super boring though.


Lollerabe wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Lollerabe wrote:
I gotta admit the psychic had zero appeal to me when it was first announced and even during the playtest. But damn it looks awesome, super flavorful and versatile. And it's seems to be a runner up for strongest dedication class 2
Now I'm curious. Which dedications do you consider to be the strongest right now?

Strongest ? Champion. The fact that you get the actual reaction and not a toned down version is insane.

Below champion but still great: Medic (my current char took it for flavor reasons, and even tho I got lack of free hand issues it's still super strong)

Blessed one

Beyond those it's very build specific I would say. But those 3 stands out as always being very impactful.

Edit: Oh and sentinel, as it is almost mandatory on certain classes if you want to optimize.
If we get acces to medium armors with the bulwark trait, that's gonna change however.
it's super boring though.

I'd add rogue to that list. Regardless of whether you only pick up the dedication or go even further in, it is just so useful for literally all classes regardless of what campaign you are playing.


Lollerabe wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Lollerabe wrote:
I gotta admit the psychic had zero appeal to me when it was first announced and even during the playtest. But damn it looks awesome, super flavorful and versatile. And it's seems to be a runner up for strongest dedication class 2
Now I'm curious. Which dedications do you consider to be the strongest right now?

Strongest ? Champion. The fact that you get the actual reaction and not a toned down version is insane.

Below champion but still great: Medic (my current char took it for flavor reasons, and even tho I got lack of free hand issues it's still super strong)

Blessed one

Beyond those it's very build specific I would say. But those 3 stands out as always being very impactful.

Edit: Oh and sentinel, as it is almost mandatory on certain classes if you want to optimize.
If we get acces to medium armors with the bulwark trait, that's gonna change however.
it's super boring though.

I never really ranked archetypes, but those are all mechanically good (although I'm not interested in Champion or Blessed One for role playing reasons). Thanks for your answer.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Karmagator wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Karmagator wrote:

...

The only thing that has me kinda bummed is Tangible Dream's cantrip stuff, they're not really my cup of tea. Everything else so far has me very much excited as well!
...
Tastes are funny things. Tangible Dream is the conscious mind that I'm most excited about. :)

They are, aren't they ^^? I really like the idea of it as well - which is what made it one of my two most anticipated ones - but it turned out a little to defense/support-focused for me. I have a clear preference for heavy crowd control, damage output and generally messing with the enemy's stuff. Dead is the best condition to apply and all that ;).

Depending on what the final thing looks like, I might also change my mind.

I doubt I'll get ever excited over the shield stuff, but g*% d@!n is it good. Basically once per fight, for a focus point you can more or less negate a hit on your main frontliner from relative safety, often buying them another round before they need healing. It only technically has two failure conditions due to shield's one round duration, because (unless you messed up the timing) how likely is it that nobody gets attacked or all enemies miss all their attacks for an entire round? And in that case, since you have two focus points and your shield is unbroken, you can just do it again. If it didn't work again, clearly you didn't need it in the first place and all is good.

For the second one, my party and I are fundamentally incapable of creating characters without darkvision, so dancing lights' benefit doesn't look great. But depending on how the latter's "flashbang"-style amp works, it might come back into consideration, who knows?

My current favourites stay Silent Whisper (ironic, since it seems to have a decent support bend as well) and Distant Grasp. I just hope Silent Whisper got a significant upgrade in the daze department - ideally a different cantrip entirely - or I'm gonna be real sad :/. Message being...

My first interest is in Psychic multiclass on an Investigator so I'm probably weighing abilities differently than you are. But I'm also intrigued by the imaginary weapon psi cantrip that Tangible Dream gets. I really like that sort of thing.


4 people marked this as a favorite.

So, we got Psychics… how long until we get playable Lashunta, a major psychic Ancestry? Here’s hoping Gatewalkers is a sign of things to come.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Gisher wrote:
My first interest is in Psychic multiclass on an Investigator so I'm probably weighing abilities differently than you are. But I'm also intrigued by the imaginary weapon psi cantrip that Tangible Dream gets. I really like that sort of thing.

Flavour is definitely something none of the stuff so far lacks ^^. And what is basically mind-controlled force weapons is definitely up there.

For the investigator, I'd highly recommend either things that only take one action - message and shield should be awesome - or force a saving throw. The Devise a Strategem roll will come up bad sooner or later and nothing feels worse at that moment than not having an alternative.

Depending on how Dancing Blade from Distant Grasp works and if that will be available via the archetype, it could be really cool as well ^^.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Karmagator wrote:
Gisher wrote:
My first interest is in Psychic multiclass on an Investigator so I'm probably weighing abilities differently than you are. But I'm also intrigued by the imaginary weapon psi cantrip that Tangible Dream gets. I really like that sort of thing.

Flavour is definitely something none of the stuff so far lacks ^^. And what is basically mind-controlled force weapons is definitely up there.

For the investigator, I'd highly recommend either things that only take one action - message and shield should be awesome - or force a saving throw. The Devise a Strategem roll will come up bad sooner or later and nothing feels worse at that moment than not having an alternative.
...

That is my plan.

I love cantrips so I'm really excited about this multiclass.

Being able to select two psi cantrips (with Psi Development), add two common occult cantrips (with Cantrip Expansion), and use ancestry feats to poach cantrips from other spell lists (through Ancestral Mind) could give this multiclass a better array of combat cantrips than any other spellcasting multiclass.

And using Int for all of them is soooo good for an Investigator.

Edit:
I'm especially interested in the possibility of using Ancestral Mind with the Fey-Touched Gnome heritage. The heritage lets you pick any Primal cantrip and change it once a day. So it's basically a prepared cantrip slot. And Ancestral Mind in the playtest would let you cast it as a psychic, Occult spell using Int. That's a lot of flexibility, especially because the Primal list has so many good combat cantrips.


4 people marked this as a favorite.
keftiu wrote:
So, we got Psychics… how long until we get playable Lashunta, a major psychic Ancestry? Here’s hoping Gatewalkers is a sign of things to come.

Now that psychic casting is a thing again, I'd love to see some creatures with innate psychic spells return. Like a lot of the creatures in the PF1 Occult Bestiary.


Gisher wrote:
keftiu wrote:
So, we got Psychics… how long until we get playable Lashunta, a major psychic Ancestry? Here’s hoping Gatewalkers is a sign of things to come.
Now that psychic casting is a thing again, I'd love to see some creatures with innate psychic spells return. Like a lot of the creatures in the PF1 Occult Bestiary.

There are bound to be a few in the cryptid section of DA. Maybe even one of the templates.


Karmagator wrote:
Gisher wrote:
keftiu wrote:
So, we got Psychics… how long until we get playable Lashunta, a major psychic Ancestry? Here’s hoping Gatewalkers is a sign of things to come.
Now that psychic casting is a thing again, I'd love to see some creatures with innate psychic spells return. Like a lot of the creatures in the PF1 Occult Bestiary.
There are bound to be a few in the cryptid section of DA. Maybe even one of the templates.

I'm pretty sure the cryptid section is only templates rather than specific creatures, based on what they said at PaizoCon. A concrete bestiary-style entry doesn't really make sense for something that's going to be an in-world cryptid, when cryptids from are world regularly get started as regular monsters.


QuidEst wrote:
Karmagator wrote:
Gisher wrote:
keftiu wrote:
So, we got Psychics… how long until we get playable Lashunta, a major psychic Ancestry? Here’s hoping Gatewalkers is a sign of things to come.
Now that psychic casting is a thing again, I'd love to see some creatures with innate psychic spells return. Like a lot of the creatures in the PF1 Occult Bestiary.
There are bound to be a few in the cryptid section of DA. Maybe even one of the templates.
I'm pretty sure the cryptid section is only templates rather than specific creatures, based on what they said at PaizoCon. A concrete bestiary-style entry doesn't really make sense for something that's going to be an in-world cryptid, when cryptids from are world regularly get started as regular monsters.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that. So yeah, maybe in a different part XD


3 people marked this as a favorite.

I can already tell that Parallel Breakthrough (nick a cantrip and amp from a different concious mind) will be one of my favourite feats. There are 15 to pick from, there is bound to be something good in there somewhere :D


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Ezekieru wrote:
keftiu wrote:
Has anything been shown of the Multiclass Archetype?

Yeah, the whole thing got leaked due to scrolling from NoNat1s. Just to give a breakdown here:

Psychic Dedication (2nd): Requires either 14 INT or 14 CHA. You do not have a subconscious mind. You cast like a psychic, but your thought components are simple intentions. Pick a conscious mind, get the standard psi cantrip for it, with the normal benefits of it and the ability to amp it, but gain no other benefits for the conscious mind. You either gain a Focus Pool of 1 Point, or increase the number of Focus Points by 1. You Refocus via meditating about your new powers. Trained in occult spellcasting/spell DC. Your key ability score for psychic spellcasting is whichever required KAS you used to get the dedication (so either INT or CHA).

Basic Thoughtform (4th): 1st or 2nd level feat.

Basic Psychic Spellcasting (4th): Basic spellcasting benefits, pick from occult spell list or your granted spells from your conscious mind.

Advanced Thoughtform (6th): Pick a psychic feat, your psychic level is 1/2 your character level.

PSI Development (6th): Gain another psi cantrip from your conscious mind, either the other standard psi cantrip you didn't pick before, or the unique surface psi cantrip for your conscious mind. Gain their normal benefits and their ability to amp it. Increase your Focus Pool by 1 Point.

Expert Psychic Spellcasting (12th): Expert spellcasting benefits.

Master Psychic Spellcasting (12th): Master spellcasting benefits. And before you ask, yes, it says Feat 12. It's likely an editing mistake already marked for errata. It should probably be 18th level like everyone else's master spellcasting benefits feat.

It would be kind of neat if Paizo would errata the Sorcerer archetype to let them pick spells from their bloodline like how Psychic archetype can pick spells from their conscious mind.


4 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ventnor wrote:
Ezekieru wrote:
keftiu wrote:
Has anything been shown of the Multiclass Archetype?

Yeah, the whole thing got leaked due to scrolling from NoNat1s. Just to give a breakdown here:

Psychic Dedication (2nd): Requires either 14 INT or 14 CHA. You do not have a subconscious mind. You cast like a psychic, but your thought components are simple intentions. Pick a conscious mind, get the standard psi cantrip for it, with the normal benefits of it and the ability to amp it, but gain no other benefits for the conscious mind. You either gain a Focus Pool of 1 Point, or increase the number of Focus Points by 1. You Refocus via meditating about your new powers. Trained in occult spellcasting/spell DC. Your key ability score for psychic spellcasting is whichever required KAS you used to get the dedication (so either INT or CHA).

Basic Thoughtform (4th): 1st or 2nd level feat.

Basic Psychic Spellcasting (4th): Basic spellcasting benefits, pick from occult spell list or your granted spells from your conscious mind.

Advanced Thoughtform (6th): Pick a psychic feat, your psychic level is 1/2 your character level.

PSI Development (6th): Gain another psi cantrip from your conscious mind, either the other standard psi cantrip you didn't pick before, or the unique surface psi cantrip for your conscious mind. Gain their normal benefits and their ability to amp it. Increase your Focus Pool by 1 Point.

Expert Psychic Spellcasting (12th): Expert spellcasting benefits.

Master Psychic Spellcasting (12th): Master spellcasting benefits. And before you ask, yes, it says Feat 12. It's likely an editing mistake already marked for errata. It should probably be 18th level like everyone else's master spellcasting benefits feat.

It would be kind of neat if Paizo would errata the Sorcerer archetype to let them pick spells from their bloodline like how Psychic archetype can pick spells from their conscious mind.

Great news, they errataed that already. Way back in the first printing!

Jokes aside, that has always been an option for a sorcerer multiclass.
Basic sorcerer spellcasting wrote:


...add a spell of the appropriate spell level to your repertoire: a common spell of your bloodline’s tradition, one of your bloodline’s granted spells, or another spell you have learned or discovered


I wonder exactly how dancing blade works.....do runes affect it? Can I use a two handed weapon? Does it do set damage or the weapons damage? I wanna guess it limits to one handed weapons or has set damage bc the idea of swinging a major striking rune greatsword on a sustain after casually blapping with a with an amped telekinetic projectile that gets an additional 20 damage from unleash seems a little nuts


1 person marked this as a favorite.
WWHsmackdown wrote:
I wonder exactly how dancing blade works.....do runes affect it? Can I use a two handed weapon? Does it do set damage or the weapons damage? I wanna guess it limits to one handed weapons or has set damage bc the idea of swinging a major striking rune greatsword on a sustain after casually blapping with a with an amped telekinetic projectile that gets an additional 20 damage from unleash seems a little nuts

The limit being a one-handed weapon seems highly likely, yeah. Depending on what kind of spell or ability it actually is, it could later upgrade to a two-handed one, but I doubt that. Otherwise, I'd guess it is just a regular weapon with whatever you put on it. Plus X attack modifier runes might not work, though.

But apart from that, the actual process of delivering the thing into your unfortunate foe's anatomy could be a million different things. Reflex save to dodge the weapon. Basically 2e spiritual weapon with extra steps. Dancing but actually useful, with an attack roll based on your spell attack modifier. That, but you actually have to share MAP with it. Or you don't share MAP and you have to spend an action to sustain it each turn.

There is a lot of range here XD


4 people marked this as a favorite.

As nice as reveals are where hosts talk about new things coming up, the clarity of actually seeing the text goes a looong way in determining how everything works (and therefore how to build your character/what concepts will match the mechanics of the class, etc.)


4 people marked this as a favorite.

Ezekieru has been even more of a champion this time and brought us a gift of additional spoilers.


9 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Really intrigued by psychic bullet telekinesis. It sounds fun if it works... anything like it sounds. Again, the lack of details hurts, but only making me more interested.

... Don't want to get too into it, but being chosen to share preview info for a Paizo product and then paywalling some of that preview feels, uh, a little sketchy to me.


So some things we can infer from what we have seen so far:

(1) The psychic dedication mentions "thought components" in relation to the subconscious mind, so custom spell components still seem to be around. The universal name probably means that they now only have different flavour, the mechanics are the same. Which would make sense, as the drawbacks look to be gone, which were the only mechanical difference.

(2) Each conscious mind still gets 2 regular occult cantrips and one unique one at the start, called surface psi cantrips. The deeper psi cantrip is also still around, but is now a level 9 class feature instead of a feat. Nice.

(3) Custom Unleash Psyche actions that provide different benefits seem to be essentially gone, there is only the original one now. Minus the crippling downside, thankfully. Something to that effect was mentioned at PaizoCon, if I remember correctly. Those look like they have been replaced with free action metamagic-esk feats that do something on top of it.


Squiggit wrote:

Really intrigued by psychic bullet telekinesis. It sounds fun if it works... anything like it sounds. Again, the lack of details hurts, but only making me more interested.

... Don't want to get too into it, but being chosen to share preview info for a Paizo product and then paywalling some of that preview feels, uh, a little sketchy to me.

The lack of details is more of a case of them overcorrecting over their perceived previous mistakes, I think. I don't know how they usually operate, but I'm guessing that this kind of podcast after the stream is completely normal for them, this isn't some kind of unique thing. Then podcasts go how podcasts go, so some more - and honestly minor - stuff fell off the tree.

I'd say we should file this under "no harm, no foul" and not read too much into it.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Just one more week and we can get a full rundown


WWHsmackdown wrote:
Just one more week and we can get a full rundown

Hopefully ^^. Regardless of how chaotic Nonat's stream might run, we should get at least the class features, which would already satisfy me a lot. And if we are really lucky, he is actually preparing a deep dive, as he already has the book.

Arghhhh, the anticipation. To quote the DoW Aspiring Champion "IT IS A GOOD PAIN!". The 40k psyker concept would make a very fun psychic, now that I think of it.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Karmagator wrote:
WWHsmackdown wrote:
Just one more week and we can get a full rundown

Hopefully ^^. Regardless of how chaotic Nonat's stream might run, we should get at least the class features, which would already satisfy me a lot. And if we are really lucky, he is actually preparing a deep dive, as he already has the book.

Arghhhh, the anticipation. To quote the DoW Aspiring Champion "IT IS A GOOD PAIN!". The 40k psyker concept would make a very fun psychic, now that I think of it.

Psykers were the touchstone that helped me reconcile charisma as a possible casting stat for psychic in 2e. Before, I really only considered it an int thing.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

From Rules Lawyer's preview, we can see that the psychic itself is 22 pages, which is 3 more pages than even the thaumaturge. And that class was already beefy. Those amps and cantrips really eat space XD


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Karmagator wrote:
From Rules Lawyer's preview, we can see that the psychic itself is 22 pages, which is 3 more pages than even the thaumaturge. And that class was already beefy. Those amps and cantrips really eat space XD

Six conscious minds and four subconscious minds is a lot of options to cover.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Gisher wrote:
Karmagator wrote:
From Rules Lawyer's preview, we can see that the psychic itself is 22 pages, which is 3 more pages than even the thaumaturge. And that class was already beefy. Those amps and cantrips really eat space XD
Six conscious minds and four subconscious minds is a lot of options to cover.

I just checked and psychic is actually the second largest class, after the summoner who has 1 page more. At least in the "as published" category.

But yeah, the conscious minds alone must be huge. For every single one, you will have a little overview block with spells and stuff. Then 3 cantrips, each with an amp and at least one of them completely new.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

The Rules Lawyer just posted his full overview of the Psychic.

The class features alone take up more pages than any CRB class in its entirety XD


7 people marked this as a favorite.

I'm WAY more interested in psychic now then during playtest. It looks interesting, satisfying, and powerful enough.

One could say I'm psyched.


Organising some thoughts.. wall of rambling incoming... sorry XD

Gathered Lore - I thought this one would be kinda lame. Boy was I wrong. One action during Unleash and you have prepared to aid any ally within 30 feet and you can roll Occultism for everything. For a reaction, you can basically give high bonuses to attack rolls at range by handing out fortune cookie sayings. Very "fear is the mindkiller" and "if it bleeds, we can kill it" XD. The level 10 feat seems like a bit of a downgraded version of the Emotional Acceptance one, however, at least for your usual purposes.

The Wandering Reverie level 10 feat Dream Guise looks interesting, if somewhat niche in many situations. That one will produce rules discussions for sure.

Wow, the psy cantrips now go all the way down. On top of your 3 regular cantrips, you get 2 empowered ones and one unique one (surface) at first level and another two at later levels (called deeper and deepest XD). All the cantrips!

Distant Grasp (Telekinesis) looks amazing and flavourful as expected. The range on everything certainly befits the name! The granted first level spell lets you yeet enemies around a lot for a very disposable resource, though it predicatably targets Fortitude. Mage Hand benefits are ok, but the base amp could do come in really handy (heh) for kiting enemies. The 4th level heightened version is sadly a waste of space, as most Disarm stuff. 60 feet base range on Telekinetic Projectile is awesome, this makes very useful despite being a spell attack roll. The amp is just icing on the cake, damage and spacing control in one package, yum ^^. Not 100% on Telekinetic Rend without thinking on it further, but the reliability of hitting multiple targets at significant range without the fear of hitting allies sounds promising. Hot damn, Vector Screen! Just wow on every part of this, enemy archers are never going to have fun again! Dancing Blade isn't as spicy, but still offers some nice possibilities with its amps and when you want to play turret mode. Anyway, I'm pretty sure what one strong candidate for my conscious mind is going to be ^^

Infinite Eye looks like a great option for people who want to spec heavily into support/utility and information superiority. Again, love the range upgrades! The psychic really does its best to avoid ever needing Reach Spell :D. Guidance can be real clutch. Glimpse Weakness is aggressively alright, but it's only one action. That means somewhat less than on other classes, though, given the psyche actions exist. Omnidirectional Scan looks like a much better use of that one action as well, an easy sink for your focus points as well, no questions asked. Those benefits are no joke, even if the duration on some of them is very short. Learning what you have to target on the boss without making a check? Yes please. Foresee the Path looks good as well, trading your third action plus allies' reaction for severely hampering enemy movement and potentially spellcasting. I've no idea how the Psychic's perception progression looks like, though, so it might be worse than it looks. Still, good boss killer with that amp in tow. All in all, not my cup of tea, but that action economy is tasty.

Uh, Mindshift looks cool. Will is generally the best save to target and mental damage is generally great as well. I'll have to see what you can do it on, though.

Oscillating Wave looks flavourful and makes for a great blaster caster (finally!), but I have the same concerns as before, for now. Cold and fire are generally not great damage types against many different enemy types and having both together isn't ideal depending on your opposition. I have the feeling that these players will be in the situation of "ok, I can do damage this time" a little too often for comfort, as the enemy is immune to one and you have to alternate, meaning you literally waste every second spell. Produce Flame dealing more damage in melee is.. not ideal either, as you are a 6HP no armour caster, aka melee is assisted suicide. Orbital range on Ray of Frost is really funny, and the amp damage plus increased chunkiness isn't bad either. Thermal Stasis is alright, saves a bit of money on resistance rings. Enthropic Wheel is a fun little minigame for additional damage at very little cost - reaction economy on casters isn't usually competitive. I can see some people getting annoyed with tracking the motes, but eh, it's fine. Redistribute Potential has... potential, but is extremely limited due to the area restrictions (two adjacent squares or two two 10ft bursts when amped). Damage is meh, but the conditions are very convenient - this one looks like one you really only want to use amped. At the end of the day, cool idea, but the damage types and the whole Produce Flame thing are a turn off for me.

[part 2 in a bit]


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Karmagator wrote:

The Rules Lawyer just posted his full overview of the Psychic.

The class features alone take up more pages than any CRB class in its entirety XD

This is the second preview to show the Psychic Dedication page, and both show the Master Spellcasting feat as 12th level. That has to be a typo.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

[part 2]

Ok, now my most anticipated one, Silent Whisper aka the classic telepath. Kinda goes into the same niche as Infinite Eye, as you would expect. Daze is sadly still a thing, though now with premium range, so it isn't all bad. The amped damage is nice, though you can't ever take advantage of the penalty to will saves, as it is only until the end of their next turn. Bummer, but could be worse. Message we already knew about, but still. What an amazing ability, amped or not. Forbidden Thought is much improved from the playtest version and a decent situational tool when amped. The base version is odd, though, as it is really only normal cantrip damage and even then only when they do something specific. Why not just... cast a cantrip at them that does the same thing without the extra steps? Sure it targets will and is d6s per level, but still. The enemy doesn't really lose anything in any scenario - at worst, they take the normal damage and still get the action off, just as if you had just cast any other cantrip. There is an RP aspect in here, but that can get lost fairly easily, as it has little force behind it. Shatter Mind is unimpressive as any of its aoe cantrip brethren, but that amp is real spicy. Too bad the stupefied condition only lasts until the start of your next turn, so once again you likely don't get a direct benefit. The party is gonna love that though. Contagious Idea is a mixed bag. Temp HP of 5 to two targets at level 10 is unlikely to make a difference unless you cast this every round, which is very poor use of your actions. Discount fear or (sort of) better Demoralize on two targets as a cantrip, though? Gimme that. The amp is the opposite - 10+ temp HP on three targets actually has a chance to give give your frontline another round (and maybe soak some collateral damage from the rest), but a third target for frightened doesn't sound great for a focus point. Sadly you can't mix them - two temp HP boys and 1 frightened enemy would sound good. Overall, still a good contender for my conscious mind, though Distant Grasp looks to be more my style at this point.

Tangible Dream. It has the look of a defensive support and area denial specialist. Dancing Lights looks really weak. Illumination without giving away your own position is nice as long as you don't have darkvision, but it isn't exactly stellar. What really bugs me is the amp. Tiny aoe and they get a save at the start of every turn. It also targets Fort and is sustained. On the upside, it still works once when they succeed and the range is very convenient. Still, you quickly get spells that make this somewhat obsolete - a quick search throws up Fear the Sun (2nd) and hypnotic pattern (3rd) - and that is something I heavily dislike. Shield we knew, solid defensive option and will save the frontline on many occasions. Imaginary weapon is... odd. A melee spell attack roll... so hit chance is very quickly not great and you have to be in melee - again, assisted suicide - which the damage really doesn't make up for. The crit effect is impressive, but yeah, crit on a spell attack roll. The amp does great damage and gives two no-MAP attacks, but given that you can only attack targets within your reach, meaning your squishy butt is necessarily in melee with two enemies this seems an incredibly poor choice of resources and positioning, instead of, you know, running away. Might be worth a shot as a hail mary in case you can't run, but that's it. Astral Rain - good range, low damage (that doesn't benefit from Unleash either), but could work well as an area denial tool in fights with limited space, especially when amped. Not amazing and spells can do better, but not terrible either. Hologram Cage - now that's some potentially amazing area denial and allows you to control engagements with multiple enemy types or groups. Heavy action cost, but even the unamped version is good and lasts without sustain. The amp gives even more options and acts as a cheap wall-type spell, good stuff. Overall, Dancing Lights is mediocre at best and Imaginary Weapon is just bad imo, but the subclass still works well in its niche.

Unbound Step, another one from the completely new ones. Certainly a strange one, not something we have really seen too much of in 2e. Phase bolt has the low-ish standard range, low damage and is an attack roll, but the reduced circumstance bonus to AC makes it situationally useful. Except with this conscious mind, you also reduce that bonus by 1 for the rest of your party, which the martials (especially ranged ones who have to content with constant lesser cover) are going to be very grateful for. And then the amp just straight up hates constructs and shields, tough sadly the "the teleporting allowed" is only on a crit, which is difficult even with the enemy being flat-footed. Not bad, I must say, offensive support is a cool concept. Warp step is great for getting the hell out of any situation, even without all the stuff you get with Unbound Step. With it, is is just awesome. With this, you are always in a great position to really ruin someone's day. Distortion lens seems really, really situational, though you might get additional mileage out of it if your parts uses a lot of one-handed ranged or thrown weapons. The amp I can see working with some creative Stepping, but that needs further thinking on on my part. Not particularly impressed, though. Ghostly Shift is cool, if somewhat limited. All res never hurt anyone, but having to both sustain and move to get the amp benefit means you really need to plan around this. Still, in the right hand s and the right situation, this can be very powerful and crucial. Tesseract Tunnel is strange. It is sustained, but the effects only last until the start of your next turn. Are you supposed to be able to create new tunnels with a new Stride? Anyway, again, this is positioning gold. If you have a group that is good at tactical combat, this opens some really precious doors (pun fully intended). Overall, extremely odd, but in the right hands and in the right group, this has some serious potential.

[looks like part 3 is in order... but not today XD]


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Gisher wrote:
Karmagator wrote:

The Rules Lawyer just posted his full overview of the Psychic.

The class features alone take up more pages than any CRB class in its entirety XD

This is the second preview to show the Psychic Dedication page, and both show the Master Spellcasting feat as 12th level. That has to be a typo.

It's the same version of the document, so that is to be expected. But yeah, 100% a typo, no question.


On first viewing of the, the offensive feats and amps in particular aren't great. After that, there are some really cool ones, though!


I gotta say I'm not impressed. The chassis is typical caster, the feats are bad, cantrip amps are interesting but poachable by better classes and none of what they can do is worth losing another spell slot.


Karmagator wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Karmagator wrote:

The Rules Lawyer just posted his full overview of the Psychic.

The class features alone take up more pages than any CRB class in its entirety XD

This is the second preview to show the Psychic Dedication page, and both show the Master Spellcasting feat as 12th level. That has to be a typo.
It's the same version of the document, so that is to be expected. But yeah, 100% a typo, no question.

With the first preview I had thought that perhaps they had received an earlier, incorrect version of the pdf by mistake.

Scarab Sages

Hmmmm, interested in the psychic that makes weapons of force. . . There is something there.


The class looks decent, but the MCing into it is just so strong, you gain too much in the dedication, Wizards and Sorcerers will love to steal Message, Shield or Guidance per example.

The imaginary weapon damage is good, like really good, if you can get reach spell it gets even better as now the targets don't need to be adjacent of each other but up to 30ft away from you. Magus can also steal this to spellstrike btw, the damage is better than flame ray and you can spellstrike swipe/whirlwind with it if you want.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I'm loving what we saw, but I'm very confused that the Psychic still does not get access to Effortless Concentration. If any caster in the game should have it, it is Psychic.

They did not lie when they said Oscillating Wave was similar to FFXIV Black Mage. I'm seeing tons of ways to stay on your desired damage type for extended periods of time. Probably the first subclass I will try to crack.

Kyrone wrote:
The class looks decent, but the MCing into it is just so strong, you gain too much in the dedication, Wizards and Sorcerers will love to steal Message, Shield or Guidance per example.

Yeah, being able to poach up to 3 cantrips feels a bit wrong.


3 people marked this as a favorite.

I wonder if lacking Effortless Concentration is a flavor thing, since it says "You maintain a spell with hardly a thought" but absolutely everything the Psychic does is with a thought and only a thought. Since your whole shtick is that you turn your thoughts into power.


PossibleCabbage wrote:
I wonder if lacking Effortless Concentration is a flavor thing, since it says "You maintain a spell with hardly a thought" but absolutely everything the Psychic does is with a thought and only a thought. Since your whole shtick is that you turn your thoughts into power.

If any class has to be good at something that normally requires a thought, I would say that that would be Psychic.

Even if that's the case, I don't see why they don't have their own version of it as they have their own version of Counterspell (Something like having the feat at level 14 but limiting it to Psychic cantrips, Amped cantrips and the additional spells from your concious mind). Sustaining seems pretty integral for a lot of possible Psychic builds. Hardly a dealbreaker to me that they don't have it, I just find it really weird.


roquepo wrote:
Yeah, being able to poach up to 3 cantrips feels a bit wrong.

I'm not seeing three.

• The dedication gets you one psi cantrip at level 2.
• Psi Development get you a second psi cantrip at level 6.

That's two.

If you count taking Cantrip Expansion for regular cantrips, that's four.

Either way I don't see where you get three.

51 to 100 of 362 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | next > last >>
Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder Second Edition / General Discussion / Premature discussion about the Psychic All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.