How many attacks do I get with a Bite attack + Greatsword attack with a BAB of 7?


Advice and Rules Questions


I'm a little confused as to how a natural attack and weapon attack mesh together and I'm kinda lost on how many attacks I'm exactly getting here. I get 2 attacks with a weapon when my bab is this high and when I'm making a full attack I know I can attack and use my bite- But when they're put together like that I'm a little confused as to how many of each thing I get. Is it literally I get 2 bite attacks and then 2 sword swings making it 4 attacks total? Or am I mistaken here and I only get two sword swings and one bite? Or is it something else? Please explain this to me like I'm 5 because I feel like I'm missing something obvious here.


This is the third-party advice and rules question so probably not the best place to ask this. This should have been in the rule's forum.

To answer your question, you do not gain extra natural attacks from a high BAB. If you have a bite attack you get 1 bite attack no matter what your BAB is. There are things some feats or class abilities that may grant you more attacks with your natural weapon but BAB by itself does not.

So, you would gain your two attacks with a weapon. You can use your bite once as a secondary attack, but it will have a hefty penalty if you do so.


"You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks)." CRB pg. 182

The number of natural attacks is tied to the number of destinct body parts (unless something lets you make extra attacks with existing weapons, e.g. Haste).


The only thing having extra iterative attacks does for natural weapons is enables you to use multiple natural weapons that require use of the same limb. For example if you had a bite and a gore, you would need atleast BAB +6 to attack with both in the same round since they both are attacks using your head. Another example is if you had Claws and were to gain access to 2x Slam attacks using your arms, you would similarly require +6 BAB to use both claws and both slam attacks In One round, you could still do one attack of each or both attacks of one type without +6 BAB though.

99% of the time though having +6 or higher BAB will not change how many natural attacks you make.

If you have an animal companion that only has one natural attack, Such as a Wolf, then the Multiattack feature for Animal Companions will let them make extra natural attacks with high BAB, but that is a special exception only for animal companions.


Chell Raighn wrote:

The only thing having extra iterative attacks does for natural weapons is enables you to use multiple natural weapons that require use of the same limb. For example if you had a bite and a gore, you would need atleast BAB +6 to attack with both in the same round since they both are attacks using your head. Another example is if you had Claws and were to gain access to 2x Slam attacks using your arms, you would similarly require +6 BAB to use both claws and both slam attacks In One round, you could still do one attack of each or both attacks of one type without +6 BAB though.

99% of the time though having +6 or higher BAB will not change how many natural attacks you make.

If you have an animal companion that only has one natural attack, Such as a Wolf, then the Multiattack feature for Animal Companions will let them make extra natural attacks with high BAB, but that is a special exception only for animal companions.

I have never heard of this +6 BAB two natural weapons on the same limb rule, can you point to to the text for it?


Chell Raighn wrote:
The only thing having extra iterative attacks does for natural weapons is enables you to use multiple natural weapons that require use of the same limb. For example if you had a bite and a gore, you would need atleast BAB +6 to attack with both in the same round since they both are attacks using your head.

That's a complete fabrication on your part. No such limitation exists in the rules.


Chell Raighn wrote:

The only thing having extra iterative attacks does for natural weapons is enables you to use multiple natural weapons that require use of the same limb. For example if you had a bite and a gore, you would need atleast BAB +6 to attack with both in the same round since they both are attacks using your head. Another example is if you had Claws and were to gain access to 2x Slam attacks using your arms, you would similarly require +6 BAB to use both claws and both slam attacks In One round, you could still do one attack of each or both attacks of one type without +6 BAB though.

99% of the time though having +6 or higher BAB will not change how many natural attacks you make.

If you have an animal companion that only has one natural attack, Such as a Wolf, then the Multiattack feature for Animal Companions will let them make extra natural attacks with high BAB, but that is a special exception only for animal companions.

all of this is false.


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Big respect normally to Chell, but I will have to second that that's all wrong. You absolutely can use a gore and bite on the same turn at level 1 if you had the ability. The only hinky spot comes with claws/pincers/slams if/when they are on the same limb.

As to the OP: BAB on characters in relation to number of attacks per turn affects Iterative attacks. Iterative attacks explicitly are those made with a forged/manufactured/crafted weapon. (Technically unarmed strikes fall here too, but let's not confuse the issue) So, with your BAB at 7, you are entitled to two attacks (at +7, and +2) with your greatsword, when taking a full attack action. During this full attack action, you may also include any Natural weapon attacks you may have. However, all Natural attacks when combined with forged weapon attacks are treated as secondary natural attacks. That means you can use the bite, but only with your BAB -5 (+2, in this case). Secondary Natural weapons also only add half your Str mod on damage. These restrictions reflect the difficulty/awkwardness of combing weapon attacks with Natural weapons.

So, TLDR: Full attack with Greatsword and Bite at BAB +7 ---> one sword at +7, one sword at +2, and one bite at +2.

P.S.: For other options or confusion :p . . . . If you had multiple Natural attacks, let's say claw, bite, slam. You could do all three of those as a full attack action at level one, and each would be at full strength.


Java Man wrote:
Chell Raighn wrote:

The only thing having extra iterative attacks does for natural weapons is enables you to use multiple natural weapons that require use of the same limb. For example if you had a bite and a gore, you would need atleast BAB +6 to attack with both in the same round since they both are attacks using your head. Another example is if you had Claws and were to gain access to 2x Slam attacks using your arms, you would similarly require +6 BAB to use both claws and both slam attacks In One round, you could still do one attack of each or both attacks of one type without +6 BAB though.

99% of the time though having +6 or higher BAB will not change how many natural attacks you make.

If you have an animal companion that only has one natural attack, Such as a Wolf, then the Multiattack feature for Animal Companions will let them make extra natural attacks with high BAB, but that is a special exception only for animal companions.

I have never heard of this +6 BAB two natural weapons on the same limb rule, can you point to to the text for it?

It’s in the exact rules text Derklord posted.

"You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks)." CRB pg. 182

By RAW, you cannot use the same limb to deliver more than one natural attack unless you have a high enough BAB to have an iterative attack.

Derklord wrote:
That's a complete fabrication on your part. No such limitation exists in the rules.

Not a fabrication, you yourself even posted the exact rules quote it is in.


^I have never heard a person interpret that line to have that meaning. It is interesting.


Chell Raighn wrote:
By RAW, you cannot use the same limb to deliver more than one natural attack unless you have a high enough BAB to have an iterative attack.

First, the head is not a limb, and we don't know what the rules consider a body part. There're a lot of stat blocks of creatures using horns on their head for gore, and a bite attack, and while stat blocks aren't evidence, in lack of anything else on the topic, it's extremely unlikely that all those are erroneous. There's also a stat block of a monster that has a gore form tusks and a bite attack, although that may come from uncheked application of a template.

Second, the BAB has absolutely no bearing on this. The word "instead", which opens the sentence you bolded, indicates a replacement, not a conditional application. The stuff about BAB 'unlocking' natural attacks is a complete fabrication on your part.


Java Man wrote:
^I have never heard a person interpret that line to have that meaning. It is interesting.

It's not interesting, it's just plain wrong. If it was so it would be used in advice forums for a decade now. And it would in bestiaries, too.


Chell Raighn wrote:
Java Man wrote:
Chell Raighn wrote:

The only thing having extra iterative attacks does for natural weapons is enables you to use multiple natural weapons that require use of the same limb. For example if you had a bite and a gore, you would need atleast BAB +6 to attack with both in the same round since they both are attacks using your head. Another example is if you had Claws and were to gain access to 2x Slam attacks using your arms, you would similarly require +6 BAB to use both claws and both slam attacks In One round, you could still do one attack of each or both attacks of one type without +6 BAB though.

99% of the time though having +6 or higher BAB will not change how many natural attacks you make.

If you have an animal companion that only has one natural attack, Such as a Wolf, then the Multiattack feature for Animal Companions will let them make extra natural attacks with high BAB, but that is a special exception only for animal companions.

I have never heard of this +6 BAB two natural weapons on the same limb rule, can you point to to the text for it?

It’s in the exact rules text Derklord posted.

"You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks)." CRB pg. 182

By RAW, you cannot use the same limb to deliver more than one natural attack unless you have a high enough BAB to have an iterative attack.

Sorry, but you are drawing the incorrect conclusion from that line of rules text. In the first sentence, it is explained that a high BAB does not grant additional natural attacks. This means, that even if you have a BAB +20, if you only have a bite attack, you're still only getting one bite. The only way to bite multiple times with the same bite is via monstrous feats or class features like on a Summoner's Eidolon.

The second sentence, as indicated by the instead, is explaining how one may do more than a single Natural weapon attack. They are granted by having the appropriate body part or limb that allows the attack, which is to say, you need a stinger to sting, a tail to slap, a tentacle to tentacle, etc. The loading up of multiple attacks on the same limb has always caused confusion because, when referring to arms and legs, there are few (if any) creatures which have multiple weapons on the same limb. This is mostly a hypothetical abstract. By comparison, there are numerous creatures with the bite/gore combo, even more with the stinger/tail slap. The only hard and fast rule we really have, is that you can't use a natural attack on the same limb you used to wield a forged weapon with.

Multiple natural attacks, one per body part/attack available, are right there in the rules. It's why low level natural attack builds can be so powerful in combat. With the right combos you can easily have 3,4, or maybe more attacks at level 1, and most/all at full Str.


Nothing about the way I understand the rule says anything about ever getting extra claw attacks. The rules are clear that you get one attack per limb or body part that can make a natural attack by default. So if you have multiple types of natural attacks on that limb/body part you have to choose which one you are using. The way I have understood the rules for years now is that the line I highlighted grants you additional use of any limb to make an attack with a different natural weapon when your BAB would have normally granted an iterative for a manufactured weapon. The line makes no sense otherwise, it is already established earlier in the natural attacks rule that you attack once per limb. In context, that instead is directly referring back to the previous sentence. In context it reads that you do not get attritional natural attacks for high BAB but instead you get additional attacks with the limbs. The only logical way that contextual reading makes any sense is to apply those additional attacks with the limbs to other natural attacks those limbs are capable of making.


Chell Raighn wrote:
The way I have understood the rules for years now is that the line I highlighted grants you additional use of any limb to make an attack with a different natural weapon when your BAB would have normally granted an iterative for a manufactured weapon.

This isn't said at all. The text literally tells you that you don't get additional attacks for high BAB, and yet you are claiming that high BAB does allow you to make more attacks. That makes no sense.

Text: "You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus."
What you make out of that: "You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus, unless you have multiple natural weapons on the same body part, in which case you can make the additional attacks form high BAB with those extra natural weapons".

That's why I call ist a fabrication - the second part is not said or implied by the rules, but rather created by you.

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