SHAME ON YOU!!!!!!!


Organized Play General Discussion

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The Exchange 4/5

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If I spent a decade building up this community at the cost of 1000s of personal hours. I get on here and help lots of people, while being hounded by some because I am a VO and they need someone to argue with. I finally get wise and make a list to remind me of whom to stop engaging with because it wont go anywhere. On this list there are some women so i get told I have no respect for women. OH, there is some from that place, so I must hate all people from there. AND THAN YOU BAN ME!!!! because I dont agree with everyone on everything THAT ISNT about rules of a game we play in, SHAME ON YOU!!!! No I dont have all the facts on everything, BUT I KNOW, this didnt need to happen. this company is falling fast and hard when you kick a person out that has done A LOT to build it up and support it through thick and thin. KNOW THIS, I will let him at my table anytime and anywhere.


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I have lots of private lists that no one cares about.

But if I posted an "Enemies List" on a public forum I think people would be right to see that as an act of aggression and intimidation.

And if I reposted that list after moderators ordered me to take it down I would expect to be banned.

But maybe that's just me.

4/5 **** Venture-Lieutenant, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West

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Jeff Morse wrote:
No I dont have all the facts on everything BUT I KNOW…..

“I don’t know but I know!”

Jeff Morse wrote:
I will let him at my table anytime and anywhere.

You freely admit to not having the facts, yet insist on doing whatever the hell you want anyway… regardless of its impact on the community. Cool story, Jeff.

Horizon Hunters 4/5 5/5 **

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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

So, let me see if I understand this (because I don’t have a clue what this screed is about):

Someone (a VO, it appears) was banned from Organized Play, and now we have a person who will violate that ban and allow him to play at his tables (and I’ll be charitable here in thinking he means his public tables -running private tables, he can do whatever he wants.)

The original poster is going to violate the ban by allowing a banned player to play.

And he thinks it was a good idea to come here and post “HEY, I AM GOING TO BREAK THE RULES AND I AM GOING TO TELL EVERYONE ABOUT IT!”

I don’t know who this guy is (the original poster) or the person who was banned, but this sort of thing is probably better sorted out privately. Public stuff like this gets ugly in a hurry, and usually doesn’t work out the way the original poster planned.

Sczarni 5/5 5/55/5 ***

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Ahhhhhhh

Yeah I expect this thread to be deleted come Monday.


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Flag and move on.

Or, flag, report to community@paizo.org with "Intolerance" in the subject line. But then, move on.

The Exchange 4/5

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Gisher wrote:

I have lots of private lists that no one cares about.

But if I posted an "Enemies List" on a public forum I think people would be right to see that as an act of aggression and intimidation.

And if I reposted that list after moderators ordered me to take it down I would expect to be banned.

But maybe that's just me.

I see, more trees to look at


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Jeff Morse wrote:
Gisher wrote:

I have lots of private lists that no one cares about.

But if I posted an "Enemies List" on a public forum I think people would be right to see that as an act of aggression and intimidation.

And if I reposted that list after moderators ordered me to take it down I would expect to be banned.

But maybe that's just me.

I see, more trees to look at

I don't know what that means.

The Exchange 4/5

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Jeff Morse wrote:
If I spent a decade building up this community at the cost of 1000s of personal hours. I get on here and help lots of people, while being hounded by some because I am a VO and they need someone to argue with. I finally get wise and make a list to remind me of whom to stop engaging with because it wont go anywhere. On this list there are some women so i get told I have no respect for women. OH, there is some from that place, so I must hate all people from there. AND THAN YOU BAN ME!!!! because I dont agree with everyone on everything THAT ISNT about rules of a game we play in, SHAME ON YOU!!!! No I dont have all the facts on everything, BUT I KNOW, this didnt need to happen. this company is falling fast and hard when you kick a person out that has done A LOT to build it up and support it through thick and thin. KNOW THIS, I will let him at my table anytime and anywhere.

SIGH, anger or tears. sometimes we are given some info and we are full of feelings and dont respond in the best way. sometimes we have more feelings about something than on others.

In this case it has grown from years of watching these boards get worse. in the early years we had lots of VOs on here helping but now hardly any because they know it will be followed by criticism. I have not always agreed with them either. I have watched so many people whom I enjoyed helping me learn leave because they just got tired. one person stuck around and if you look over his over 8000 posts will see he has done a lot to help. has he let some of his anger to finally show, yes. BUT, I think he has shown great restraint over the years. I have seen him post and than within 5 or 6 posts later others show up to tear him down because they have an issue with him. I used to spend hours every day on here reading to learn how to GM better for over 10 years. I get so frustrated seeing people go to facebook or discord because they dont like it here anymore. I always try to link back to these boards to answer questions but i feel its not worth it sometimes. I loose count of the times i get sent somewhere else when clicking a link. but there was one that kept trying even when he stepped down from being a RVC and above.
have i seen all the trees, no, but i have seen enough of the forest that this whole thing hurts.
as for my table it is moot since i only GM 1e and he stopped playing 1e.
I miss mike, john, sarah, doug, kyle and others that helped make this place better.

The Exchange 4/5

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Dancing Wind wrote:

Flag and move on.

Or, flag, report to community@paizo.org with "Intolerance" in the subject line. But then, move on.

so you will start using the new flag ability on a post that isnt. not a good idea I think. I attacked no one or any group. i expressed anger on something and my opinion to it. do you though

The Exchange 4/5

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Gisher wrote:
Jeff Morse wrote:
Gisher wrote:

I have lots of private lists that no one cares about.

But if I posted an "Enemies List" on a public forum I think people would be right to see that as an act of aggression and intimidation.

And if I reposted that list after moderators ordered me to take it down I would expect to be banned.

But maybe that's just me.

I see, more trees to look at
I don't know what that means.

yea reason i dont post so much other than being a 2 finger typer. it makes since in my head but on paper not always to others.

you provided more for me to think on. you added more trees to the forest of my forest of understanding?


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Jeff Morse wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Jeff Morse wrote:
Gisher wrote:

I have lots of private lists that no one cares about.

But if I posted an "Enemies List" on a public forum I think people would be right to see that as an act of aggression and intimidation.

And if I reposted that list after moderators ordered me to take it down I would expect to be banned.

But maybe that's just me.

I see, more trees to look at
I don't know what that means.

yea reason i dont post so much other than being a 2 finger typer. it makes since in my head but on paper not always to others.

you provided more for me to think on. you added more trees to the forest of my forest of understanding?

I understand now. I thought that might be some "Urban Dictionary" phrase that my old brain hadn't learned yet. :)

I have to say that I'm curious about how you think rules enforcement should work here. You seem to be suggesting that contributing to the Pathfinder community should be a way to earn freedom from the rules that are supposed to apply to everyone. I'm not sure how that would work in practice.

I think I've contributed a little bit to the Pathfinder community over the last decade so presumably I would have earned some "Get Out of Jail Free" cards under your system. That makes me consider all sorts of questions. For example...

∙ Which rules would I be allowed to violate without getting banned?

∙ How many times could I violate those rules without getting banned?

∙ If you did impose some restrictions on me for a rules violation, would I be allowed to ignore those restrictions without getting banned?

∙ If my violations were attacks on a person who had also "earned credit" here, would I still be free from repercussions or would their credit cancel mine out and result in my banishment?

∙ If my violations cause other people with substantial contributions to abandon the site, do I get banned when their lost "credit" exceeds my earned "credit?"

∙ If I'm allowed to violate rules that other can't, what effect do you think that would have on increasing new membership?

Grand Lodge 4/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Arizona—Phoenix

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Gisher wrote:

I have lots of private lists that no one cares about.

But if I posted an "Enemies List" on a public forum I think people would be right to see that as an act of aggression and intimidation.

And if I reposted that list after moderators ordered me to take it down I would expect to be banned.

But maybe that's just me.

I did almost this exact same thing myself. I realized that it was a mistake and removed it. There are a lot of things that I used to do that I no longer do, as they are inappropriate for the forum. Hopefully this is a lesson in what not to do.


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TriOmegaZero wrote:
Gisher wrote:

I have lots of private lists that no one cares about.

But if I posted an "Enemies List" on a public forum I think people would be right to see that as an act of aggression and intimidation.

And if I reposted that list after moderators ordered me to take it down I would expect to be banned.

But maybe that's just me.

I did almost this exact same thing myself. I realized that it was a mistake and removed it. There are a lot of things that I used to do that I no longer do, as they are inappropriate for the forum. Hopefully this is a lesson in what not to do.

I'm not sure how threatening that would have been years ago. Today, posting enemies lists is a common tactic for promoting online harassment or real-world acts of violence.

But even if someone was somehow unaware of how such things are now used, there is no excuse for reposting the list after the moderators tell them to take it down. That's just begging to be banned, even if they had a perfectly clean record up to that point.

-----

Here's my "shouldn't have posted it" story,

Back when Covid was just starting to show up I made a "Covid" alias and used it to post as if the virus was commenting. I wasn't trying to be funny in the "ha ha" sense, but dark humor is one way that I handle stress. I was told by the moderators that such posts were creating stress for others and that I should stop.

I did.

End of story.

The Exchange 4/5 5/5

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Mark Stratton wrote:

So, let me see if I understand this (because I don’t have a clue what this screed is about):

Someone (a VO, it appears) was banned from Organized Play, and now we have a person who will violate that ban and allow him to play at his tables (and I’ll be charitable here in thinking he means his public tables -running private tables, he can do whatever he wants.)

The original poster is going to violate the ban by allowing a banned player to play.

And he thinks it was a good idea to come here and post “HEY, I AM GOING TO BREAK THE RULES AND I AM GOING TO TELL EVERYONE ABOUT IT!”

I don’t know who this guy is (the original poster) or the person who was banned, but this sort of thing is probably better sorted out privately. Public stuff like this gets ugly in a hurry, and usually doesn’t work out the way the original poster planned.

This thread shouldn’t have been started at all and will be almost certainly be locked if not deleted. Objecting to the merits of the ban isn’t going to change anyone’s mind and is just going to increase the overall vitriol that has been tearing the Paizo community apart for the past few years.

Having said that, I believe this was a ban from the messageboards and other official Paizo channels/events, not a ban from Organized Play as a whole. If it was a complete ban it would be pretty ineffective to not name the person. (Even though many of us know who it was.)

Horizon Hunters 4/5 5/5 **

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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

As a way of background, I served as a VL for Indianapolis for about a year, and then as VC for a total of about 4 1/2 years, give or take. I can say without equivocation that having a title along the lines of Venture-something is no license to violate the rules. The title doesn't give you a defense to act in bad faith or to behave badly.

In fact, Venture-Officers, generally speaking, are to be brand ambassadors for Organized Play. How VOs behave, in person and on these forms, directly impact the impressions people have the Organized Play program.

Now, it is easy to get heated on these boards, and to sometimes react hastily and harshly. I'm guilty of it myself, so I don't point the finger at anyone else. And, it might happen more than once, but repetitive violations can not, and should not, be tolerated.

Now, a kind forum goer (in response to my private message to them) told me who the former VO was. I'm really sad it has come to this. The former VO DID do a *ton* for Organized Play - he was my RVC when during part of my time as Venture-Captain. I like him personally. I have disagreed with him (on these boards, in person, and in other on-line venues.) I didn't know anything about this "enemies" list (I call it that because that's what others have called it, but I never saw it for myself.) And, though I consider him a friend, I cannot condone the act of reposting a list that was specifically deleted and one which, apparently, he was told not to do.

I think this whole thing is sad and unfortunate. I do. Others may find it to be neither. He was a great volunteer and organizationally, one of the best organizers I have seen in any organization. But, there's a code of conduct that we all are obliged to follow. And if it's true that he willfully violated that, I don't know else Paizo's response could have been.

To the original poster, I will say that it's probably best for you to let this go, especially if you consider him a friend and want to respect his work and volunteer time for Organized Play. Threads like this don't honor the good work he did - they focus on the present situation, which doesn't reflect well on him, I am sorry to say. And, it doesn't reflect well on you, either.

So, my advice is to let this go and, maybe one day down the road, things will change for the better.

The Exchange 4/5

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Gisher wrote:
Jeff Morse wrote:
Gisher wrote:
Jeff Morse wrote:
Gisher wrote:

I have lots of private lists that no one cares about.

But if I posted an "Enemies List" on a public forum I think people would be right to see that as an act of aggression and intimidation.

And if I reposted that list after moderators ordered me to take it down I would expect to be banned.

But maybe that's just me.

I see, more trees to look at
I don't know what that means.

yea reason i dont post so much other than being a 2 finger typer. it makes since in my head but on paper not always to others.

you provided more for me to think on. you added more trees to the forest of my forest of understanding?

I understand now. I thought that might be some "Urban Dictionary" phrase that my old brain hadn't learned yet. :)

I have to say that I'm curious about how you think rules enforcement should work here. You seem to be suggesting that contributing to the Pathfinder community should be a way to earn freedom from the rules that are supposed to apply to everyone. I'm not sure how that would work in practice.

I think I've contributed a little bit to the Pathfinder community over the last decade so presumably I would have earned some "Get Out of Jail Free" cards under your system. That makes me consider all sorts of questions. For example...

∙ Which rules would I be allowed to violate without getting banned?

∙ How many times could I violate those rules without getting banned?

∙ If you did impose some restrictions on me for a rules violation, would I be allowed to ignore those restrictions without getting banned?

∙ If my violations were attacks on a person who had also "earned credit" here, would I still be free from repercussions or would their credit cancel mine out and result in my banishment?

∙ If my violations cause other people with substantial contributions to abandon the site, do I get banned when their lost "credit" exceeds my earned "credit?"

∙ If I'm...

I have no answers because dont think there is any. you make good points

The Exchange 4/5

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Mark Stratton wrote:

As a way of background, I served as a VL for Indianapolis for about a year, and then as VC for a total of about 4 1/2 years, give or take. I can say without equivocation that having a title along the lines of Venture-something is no license to violate the rules. The title doesn't give you a defense to act in bad faith or to behave badly.

In fact, Venture-Officers, generally speaking, are to be brand ambassadors for Organized Play. How VOs behave, in person and on these forms, directly impact the impressions people have the Organized Play program.

Now, it is easy to get heated on these boards, and to sometimes react hastily and harshly. I'm guilty of it myself, so I don't point the finger at anyone else. And, it might happen more than once, but repetitive violations can not, and should not, be tolerated.

Now, a kind forum goer (in response to my private message to them) told me who the former VO was. I'm really sad it has come to this. The former VO DID do a *ton* for Organized Play - he was my RVC when during part of my time as Venture-Captain. I like him personally. I have disagreed with him (on these boards, in person, and in other on-line venues.) I didn't know anything about this "enemies" list (I call it that because that's what others have called it, but I never saw it for myself.) And, though I consider him a friend, I cannot condone the act of reposting a list that was specifically deleted and one which, apparently, he was told not to do.

I think this whole thing is sad and unfortunate. I do. Others may find it to be neither. He was a great volunteer and organizationally, one of the best organizers I have seen in any organization. But, there's a code of conduct that we all are obliged to follow. And if it's true that he willfully violated that, I don't know else Paizo's response could have been.

To the original poster, I will say that it's probably best for you to let this go, especially if you consider him a friend and want to respect his work and volunteer time...

I do remember you. your words are heard. THANK YOU.


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Jeff Morse wrote:
I have no answers because dont think there is any. you make good points

Thank you, but I can't really take credit for those questions. All I did was list out the issues that I imagined the moderators had to actually address in the case of this person.

-Repeated rules violations of varying kinds over the years.

-Posting the list which caused enough concern that some members left and others were considering leaving.

-Reposting the list against instructions.

To be honest, it kind of looks to me as if the moderators might actually have been granting leniency based on that person's contributions and that person took previous acts of mercy as an invitation to escalate.

-----

Reading through your posts, it's clear to me that your anger is a response to the loss, not only of that person, but of the past social environment that they remind you of. There's a lot of the five stages of grief spread out through your posts. That's a very understandable human response to a situation like this.

But I suspect that you also know that person pushed things way too far and that a forum where rules only apply to some wouldn't be someplace you would want to participate in.

Mark Stratton is correct that time is a necessary element to resolve such inner conflicts. Good luck to you.

Paizo Employee 3/5 * Director of Community

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Removed some posts that were personally harassing, and quotes, as we'd like to keep this civil to all. Not locking the thread, as there are stages of loss/grief to work through for some, but am watching it closely and will shut it down if it goes sideways. Thanks!

Silver Crusade

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It started sideways.

The Exchange 4/5

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Tonya Woldridge wrote:
Removed some posts that were personally harassing, and quotes, as we'd like to keep this civil to all. Not locking the thread, as there are stages of loss/grief to work through for some, but am watching it closely and will shut it down if it goes sideways. Thanks!

Thank you Tonya, Im Ok. thank you for letting me vent. maybe be good if take it away after all. Thank all for helping me talk this out.


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I don't have much to say about this, since I don't want to speak ill of the banned and I respect the efforts that have been made to deescalate and calm things down a little.

What I will say is that there are people who will be very kind and pleasant to those they like and very cruel and unpleasant to those they don't. I am willing to believe that Mark and the OP knew a different version of the banned poster than I was allowed to see. By the same token, it is important to understand that those of us the banned user didn't like--and, yes, put on his hatelist--were put in a very uncomfortable position by all of this. Because of the user's position of importance and respect, I had mostly given up on our problems with them ever being acknowledged when the ban finally went through.

4/5 **** Venture-Lieutenant, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West

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Tonya Woldridge wrote:
Removed some posts that were personally harassing, and quotes, as we'd like to keep this civil to all. Not locking the thread, as there are stages of loss/grief to work through for some, but am watching it closely and will shut it down if it goes sideways. Thanks!

Yes let's accommodate an emotional safe space for someone posting misinformation, straw-man arguments, and openly saying they'll break OPF directives.

Sarcasm aside, it would be nice to give equivalent support to the people who were (and are) speaking out about these ongoing issues. Seems like many voices were not heard for a long time.

Sovereign Court 5/5 5/5 ** Regional Venture-Coordinator, Great Lakes

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Make sure you run him through PFS2 3-16.

Horizon Hunters 4/5 5/5 **

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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Brent Bowser wrote:

Make sure you run him through PFS2 3-16.

I don’t get the reference?

The Exchange 4/5

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Mark Stratton wrote:
Brent Bowser wrote:

Make sure you run him through PFS2 3-16.

I don’t get the reference?

I didnt either. my roommate told me is new one written by "some guy named Brent". In the end though I dont GM 2E. I am having the problem I think a lot had with 1E form 3.5. plus my mew meds keep me a little fuzzy. I am playing 2E but death is a companion to offten

Horizon Hunters 4/5 5/5 **

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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Brent Bowser wrote:

Make sure you run him through PFS2 3-16.

OMG. NOW I get the reference. HAH!

Liberty's Edge 5/5 5/5 ** Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Martinsville

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The overall situation is disappointing. I am just not sure what to post after that as (with everything else) anything I say or do could be that one thing that puts my own status on shaky ground. Even saying that particular subjects are political or inherently divisive seems to dredge up all matter of issues that have little to nothing to do with the game we actually are here to discuss and play.

I hope to keep playing the game and getting new players interested and involved. I just hate being on eggshells all the time.

3/5 ** Venture-Agent, Massachusetts—Boston Metro

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Well this was a twist I wasn't expecting.

Also it's not that hard to be a jerk. I know I'm prone to it from time to time. I know I can irritate, confuse, and aggravate people but at the very least I try to improve myself in this department. Some of you are like consequences are some mysterious thing that shouldn't exist.

Edit:
Also I should clarify. I'm an obnoxiously loud person which can still cause issues.

Silver Crusade

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thaX wrote:
I just hate being on eggshells all the time.

Maybe some introspection on why you’re on eggshells?

Horizon Hunters 4/5 5/5 **

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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
thaX wrote:
The overall situation is disappointing. I am just not sure what to post after that as (with everything else) anything I say or do could be that one thing that puts my own status on shaky ground..

Then perhaps it’s best to say nothing.

Grand Archive 4/5 5/55/5 *

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thaX wrote:
...I am just not sure what to post after that...

Maybe nothing?

Fun Fact!
\/ \/ \/
Not posting is always an option.

Liberty's Edge 5/5 5/5 ** Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Martinsville

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Saying nothing is an option, and that was something I was seriously considering before posting, though it is difficult to keep silent sometimes. I just see some of these situations and begin to wonder if I can keep playing the game without causing some offense to someone without knowing it.

Just a disappointing situation overall.

Sczarni 5/5 5/55/5 ***

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I mean that's just life.

Whether you're at work, or meeting with your tax preparer, or you're at the gym, or gaming with your peers, it's usually just best to stay on topic and do what you're there to do.

Just because you share a hobby with a handful of other people doesn't mean everyone at the table is going to feel the same way about politics, religion, or cilantro.

Shadow Lodge 4/5

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DOWN WITH CILANTRO!

1/5 5/5

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I'm cilantro-agnostic, is there a place for me here?

Sczarni 5/5 5/55/5 ***

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TOZ wrote:
DOWN WITH CILANTRO!

Flagged

Silver Crusade

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Nefreet wrote:
TOZ wrote:
DOWN WITH CILANTRO!
Flagged

But it tastes like soap ;_;

Dark Archive 4/5 ** Venture-Agent, Finland—Tampere

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Nefreet wrote:

I mean that's just life.

Whether you're at work, or meeting with your tax preparer, or you're at the gym, or gaming with your peers, it's usually just best to stay on topic and do what you're there to do.

Just because you share a hobby with a handful of other people doesn't mean everyone at the table is going to feel the same way about politics, religion, or cilantro.

I have 0 context for what this thread is about(I have no clue who got banned and when), but regarding yer and thaX's conversation, I did have weird experience at my gig job where one person asked from me if I wanted to switch shifts because they apparently wanted to be in same shifts with their friends. Well I agreed and went to the new shift location where it turns out... Well uh, my new shift partner started the four hour workshift by commenting on "I'm happy you switched place with that immigrant(actual word used was bit more rude)"(note: I'm not sure person I switched with was even an immigrant so extra prejudice. Hmm I wonder why the first person wanted to switch places with me :P), then after following short tirade about immigrants, the old lady spent rest of four hours trying to analyse my IQ and guess what is my parents' work because I speak fast :'D

People often talk about like if modern attitude is "You can't say anything in fear of offending other people" and while I can believe people overreacting sometimes, I also get feeling people saying that haven't had to deal with that type of situations :'D It's uh, really unpleasant, awkward and plain weird.

Silver Crusade

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In my experience it’s rarely “I don’t want to offend people” and more “I don’t want to face consequences for my behavior and don’t want to change it.”

Sczarni 5/5 5/55/5 ***

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But let's be honest, sometimes it's “I don’t want to face consequences for my good behavior”, too.

We live in a society where people in power have biases and phobias, and sometimes being vocal about them impacts you negatively.

That's not the case with the original topic of this thread, and I don't know what thaX's situation is, but it deserves to be mentioned.

3/5 ** Venture-Agent, Massachusetts—Boston Metro

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thaX wrote:

Saying nothing is an option, and that was something I was seriously considering before posting, though it is difficult to keep silent sometimes. I just see some of these situations and begin to wonder if I can keep playing the game without causing some offense to someone without knowing it.

Just a disappointing situation overall.

But everyone was annoyed at you for being transphobic. It's not like you weren't told you were being transphobic but you kept on digging a hole for yourself.

And I'm not calling for you to be banned. I'm not calling you a horrible person. All I'm saying is maybe just stop when people tell you are doing something hurtful.

5/5 5/55/55/5

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The stress is from the whole landmine esque situation of "whats going to happen when someone with a different worldview sees my words/actions through their lens." If that's not how you see the world there is often little if any correlation between how you think something should be taken and how some people will take something. Whether/how much someone is worried about the consequences or someone's hurt feelings varies, but I don't know anyone that likes working with unknown unknowns.

I realize the irony of saying that in a role playing forum, but we generally don't have elves and space rats notifying people when they're doing it wrong.

Sometimes the way people see and talk about things is so far apart attempting communication just becomes an exercise in futility. At that point not talking to some people isn't a good option, but might be the least bad one.

Horizon Hunters 4/5 5/5 **

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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
MadScientistWorking wrote:
thaX wrote:

Saying nothing is an option, and that was something I was seriously considering before posting, though it is difficult to keep silent sometimes. I just see some of these situations and begin to wonder if I can keep playing the game without causing some offense to someone without knowing it.

Just a disappointing situation overall.

But everyone was annoyed at you for being transphobic. It's not like you weren't told you were being transphobic but you kept on digging a hole for yourself.

And I'm not calling for you to be banned. I'm not calling you a horrible person. All I'm saying is maybe just stop when people tell you are doing something hurtful.

Hold on - did ThaX say something transphobic? That’s how I’m reading your message but I think I missed something.

Grand Archive 4/5 ***

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Mark Stratton wrote:
MadScientistWorking wrote:
thaX wrote:

Saying nothing is an option, and that was something I was seriously considering before posting, though it is difficult to keep silent sometimes. I just see some of these situations and begin to wonder if I can keep playing the game without causing some offense to someone without knowing it.

Just a disappointing situation overall.

But everyone was annoyed at you for being transphobic. It's not like you weren't told you were being transphobic but you kept on digging a hole for yourself.

And I'm not calling for you to be banned. I'm not calling you a horrible person. All I'm saying is maybe just stop when people tell you are doing something hurtful.

Hold on - did ThaX say something transphobic? That’s how I’m reading your message but I think I missed something.

I think this was a reference to another thread.

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