The Half-Orc with No Name


Advice


So here is a build I've always wanted to play, and I'm curious if/how it can work. And with Guns n Gears, I think this is its best chance. The idea is a Half-Orc bounty hunter who specializes in using crossbows like guns in a western. The style I'd like to use is dual wielding repeating hand crossbows to make as many ranged attacks as possible. I could see him sneaking up on a bounty, kicking down the door, using a round of shots to take out the henchmen, and then focusing on capturing the bounty alive.

My top two class picks are the ranger and gunslinger. The gunslinger seems obvious as it's built to use crossbows, but its abilities are more built around reloading often, which I won't be doing every turn. The ranger gets flurry to help with MAP and the thematic Hunt Prey to help with tracking down targets. But its crossbow feats are also more concerned with reloading every turn. Neither seem to have a way to really capitalize on using two ranged weapons.

What's the best way to see this idea realized? Is it worth it compared to other similar builds? We'll be using free archetypes, so they are an option too.


If you're focussing on dual wielding repeating crossbows, gunslinger is the way to go with paired shots. Either pick up unconventional weaponry or take advanced shooter at 6th level. Pistolero or drifter could work depending on how much you intend to be in melee.


aobst128 wrote:
If you're focussing on dual wielding repeating crossbows, gunslinger is the way to go with paired shots. Either pick up unconventional weaponry or take advanced shooter at 6th level. Pistolero or drifter could work depending on how much you intend to be in melee.

I just found the gunslinger Two-Weapon Fusillade, which lets me attack twice for one action. It's flourish, so I can only do it once. Then I can shoot two more times like normal for a total of four shots. Is there a way for me to get any more shots off in a round? And without ranger's flurry, is there a way to mitigate that MAP?


Jedi Maester wrote:
aobst128 wrote:
If you're focussing on dual wielding repeating crossbows, gunslinger is the way to go with paired shots. Either pick up unconventional weaponry or take advanced shooter at 6th level. Pistolero or drifter could work depending on how much you intend to be in melee.
I just found the gunslinger Two-Weapon Fusillade, which lets me attack twice for one action. It's flourish, so I can only do it once. Then I can shoot two more times like normal for a total of four shots. Is there a way for me to get any more shots off in a round? And without ranger's flurry, is there a way to mitigate that MAP?

Paired shots doesn't add map for the second shot and counts as 2 attacks afterwards. Mitigating map is more valuable than attacking a lot. Especially with the gunslingers proficiency. If it's just the number of attacks that matter to you, ranger is probably the best bet. There's "impossible volly" at 18th level that could potentially empty both clips of your crossbows in one round.


But overall, I think the gunslinger fits your concept more for the focus on crossbows. There's a lot of extra stuff you can get to do with your weapons aside from attacking and reloading with them with the class. Just don't pick up the reload feats and you're golden.


aobst128 wrote:
Paired shots doesn't add map for the second shot and counts as 2 attacks afterwards. Mitigating map is more valuable than attacking a lot. Especially with the gunslingers proficiency. If it's just the number of attacks that matter to you, ranger is probably the best bet. There's "impossible volly" at 18th level that could potentially empty both clips of your crossbows in one round.

Impossible volley would be awesome! But it apparently requires a volley weapon, which hand crossbows aren't. I would love a way to empty both clips in an all out manner. I need to balance attack number and MAP, but I wanted to know what the limit is.

I agree the gunslinger is the better choice. Now I just need to add in the bounty hunting aspects.


Ranger archetype could fit fairly well. There's good support for ranged attacks that the gunslinger lacks such as far shot and hunters aim plus hunt prey effectively doubles your first range increment. By 8th level, if you pick up far shot, your crossbows can shoot 240 feet away with no penalty against your hunted prey. Probably overkill but it's not called "Ranger" for nothing. There's always the "Bounty hunter" archetype that's worth looking into that also gives you hunt prey.


Jedi Maester wrote:
aobst128 wrote:
Paired shots doesn't add map for the second shot and counts as 2 attacks afterwards. Mitigating map is more valuable than attacking a lot. Especially with the gunslingers proficiency. If it's just the number of attacks that matter to you, ranger is probably the best bet. There's "impossible volly" at 18th level that could potentially empty both clips of your crossbows in one round.

Impossible volley would be awesome! But it apparently requires a volley weapon, which hand crossbows aren't. I would love a way to empty both clips in an all out manner. I need to balance attack number and MAP, but I wanted to know what the limit is.

I agree the gunslinger is the better choice. Now I just need to add in the bounty hunting aspects.

There is the Bounty Hunter archetype. The melee feats aren't that good for a gunslinger, but having the ability to shoot farther with hand crossbows and make nonlethal attacks with them sounds like good things for a bounty hunter to have.


One other minor thing to point out is that the Gunslinger's special reload action only provides one action that can be used for reload. So a repeating weapon may not behave exactly the way you are expecting.

A repeating hand crossbow has the reload reduced to 0 while it still has bolts in the clip, so the Gunslinger reload action wouldn't be needed. And when you do run out of bolts, reloading a new clip takes 3 actions - of which only 1 would be handled by the Gunslinger reload.

I'm not sure that this would be enough to sway the decision to one class or the other.


If you have access to the Drow Shootist archetype, then Fighter may be worth a look. Ranger may also like it for the proficiency increase.

Fighter starting Point-Blank then going down the Double Shot tree could be pretty good, and with Shootist you can have the improved proficiency track with a second weapon group so you have something to do if you run out of ammo. May I recommend Brawling and Iron Fists?

Ranger is great for the Flurry Edge. Add in Hunted Shot and Quick Draw and you are on your way.

I think Gunslinger is the least exciting of the classes for this, unfortunately. The useful feats come on late and you have a hard time using the class features.

At the end of the day, ranged dual wielding isn't very supported. The benefit you will get out of it is you run out of ammo slower with a second magazine. If you play Ranger, you will want that second magazine.


Thanks for all the input! I have a related question to my dilemma. I know the pistolero is meant to be the obvious choice for TWF, but how well does the sniper work? I know most build it towards one big attack, but is there anything stopping me from using it effectively with two crossbows? I'd prefer to utilize the stealth focus rather than the Charisma focus.


Jedi Maester wrote:
Thanks for all the input! I have a related question to my dilemma. I know the pistolero is meant to be the obvious choice for TWF, but how well does the sniper work? I know most build it towards one big attack, but is there anything stopping me from using it effectively with two crossbows? I'd prefer to utilize the stealth focus rather than the Charisma focus.

The big draw of the sniper is that they can reload+hide to hit their next target flatfooted with their slingers reload, and as you know, that's not an option for dual wielding repeating crossbows. Other than that, there's snipers aim, vital shot, and headshot that are still usable with one handed weapons. You could hypothetically go with a charisma sniper and pistol twirl to use vital shot to good effect.


Pistolero's Challenge with paired shots is particularly good with 2 repeating crossbows however and pistolero's retort will almost always be usable as you'll rarely be left without a loaded weapon in your hands.

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