UNITED PAIZO WORKERS

[Qstor]

"When the union's inspiration through the workers' blood shall run,
There can be no power greater anywhere beneath the sun;
Yet what force on earth is weaker than the feeble strength of one,
But the union makes us strong."

- Solidarity Forever

Good luck all! Hope Erik and Lisa realize what the correct course is!

[pennywit]

Just to jump in here. I admit I have not followed the complaints and the allegations very closely. But I hope that Paizo workers realize a union is not going to magically solve all of their issues with Paizo management.

[GameDesignerDM]

Obviously not, but it is a step in the right direction and something that is needed.

[Saedar]

No amount of profit is more important than the wellbeing of the laborers that create the things in question. All support to labor always.

#UnionizePaizo

[Mergy]

pennywit wrote:

Just to jump in here. I admit I have not followed the complaints and the allegations very closely. But I hope that Paizo workers realize a union is not going to magically solve all of their issues with Paizo management.

Right, and because it might not solve literally all of their problems, what do you want them to do instead/in addition? Do you have anything to contribute?

[knightnday]

I support the workers. I wish them all the luck in the world.

And Yoshua is correct: stay on target and ignore the noise. The amount of people coming in late to chime in without a clear understanding of what has been going on undermines any qualifications they might have in a field or subject.

[Anorak]

knightnday wrote:

I support the workers. I wish them all the luck in the world.

And Yoshua is correct: stay on target and ignore the noise. The amount of people coming in late to chime in without a clear understanding of what has been going on undermines any qualifications they might have in a field or subject.

This ^^^

Don't engage. Don;t counter-argument.

Back to cheering on the first TTRPG Industry Union!

[NicoleH]

Hello friends, stepping in again to redirect the conversation and ask your consideration for a moment.

1: "For now, what we’re calling for is voluntary recognition from Paizo management. For them to agree to sit down at the bargaining table with us and engage in good-faith negotiations. "

This is directly what the United Paizo Workers (UPW) have asked for so far.

The support card I also attached does not seem to be made by the union, but I can't point to the origin of it directly. Regardless of that, we come to this:

2: "Beginning September 16th, a united bloc of approximately 40 Paizo freelance writers, game designers, and adventure authors announced to management they would be refusing new contracts and in some cases withholding current work until improvements were made for employees. Demands included Paizo fill an HR position that was allowed to sit vacant and leave Paizo without HR for months; that non-warehouse staff be permitted to continue working from home during the pandemic, and that all non-warehouse staff are afforded the option to work remotely from outside Washington if they choose; that Paizo be fully transparent about all salary information; and that Paizo bring a full-time diversity consultant onto staff."

The issues we are debating recently in this thread are slighltly incorrect. While the union hasn't publicly called for a diversity consultant, who knows if they will? - it appears it was a coalition of individuals outside of the Paizo paid staffers.

Please be mindful and informed, and check your sources twice, heck, site them if needed, before playing a horrible game of telephone and detracting attention from the presented platforms. I encourage you all to take a few minutes today before resuming conversation to reread the blog, and twitter posts from UPW, even the support card, and take 5 minutes digestion of their contents before continuing. (you can find these again in the first post of this thread)

Thank you <3

[Scott Young]

Thank you, Nicole, for bringing actual facts and current information to the discussion, something that has been sorely lacking in many of the most vocal peoples' posts.

Paizo staff know what they need; you (we) do not. If you don't know about something, just please be quiet because you're not helping. If you just want to look smart there are dozens of other threads you can do that in.

[Tonya Woldridge]

Good morning all. I've removed posts personally attacking a former staffer, as it doesn't matter who they are or what your feelings are, hate doesn't belong here. I also removed some posts that are not focused on the topic of Paizo worker unionization - specifically a reference to union demands, cause the request right now is for recognition, though I also took others that were off-topic. I refer forum readers to look at other threads in this channel if they are unsure about some of the underlying discussions going on. I also removed posts quoting removed material. This thread is focused on showing support for the union. Keeping your posts related to that topic and minimizing quotes will help the moderation team. Thank you!

[Dave2]

The Union is one step. As I have said many times. The labor board and EEOC are an effective way to create change. Even when the Union is in place. To create change with the problem Managers you are going to need some kind of evidence to discipline that Manager (emails/multiple witnesses to the incident). If the staff does not feel comfortable with upper management doing that investigation than another avenue is the labor board and EEOC.

Having a full time HR staff is also a needed step. Having a non trained person in HR is not going to benefit anyone.

Once the Union is formed and there are issues that the Union and Management do not agree on. The labor board and EEOC can resolve the issue especially if they can afford a lawyer.

I hope the Union is recognized and Washington is strong Union state. The state I am in is not pro Union. I am member of the Union in the state. They do not do much more than inform on legislation that may in pact state agencies.

[Chemlak]

I have emailed Jeff, Erik and Lisa, and expressed my feelings as respectfully and honestly as I could, and called upon them to voluntarily recognise UPW.

I've seen some antagonism and comments that make it clear that some people perceive Management and the Union to be in opposition to one another, and while I am aware that it is possible for that to happen over some issues, the overall impact that a good union and an honest company management can achieve is exceptionally advantageous to everyone involved. That is the position UPW are looking to get to - working with the Execs to make Paizo stronger and better.

I cannot applaud the decision to create UPW enough, and I have high hopes for the future.

[thejeff]

Chemlak wrote:

I have emailed Jeff, Erik and Lisa, and expressed my feelings as respectfully and honestly as I could, and called upon them to voluntarily recognise UPW.

I've seen some antagonism and comments that make it clear that some people perceive Management and the Union to be in opposition to one another, and while I am aware that it is possible for that to happen over some issues, the overall impact that a good union and an honest company management can achieve is exceptionally advantageous to everyone involved. That is the position UPW are looking to get to - working with the Execs to make Paizo stronger and better.

I cannot applaud the decision to create UPW enough, and I have high hopes for the future.

Seems to me that for this to have gotten as far as it did, Management and the workforce are already in opposition, otherwise there wouldn't be the incentive to take the difficult and risky step of trying to unionize.

Voluntarily recognizing the union, rather than forcing the election process, would be a good step to reduce that opposition.

[David knott 242]

The only way it would make sense to skip the election process would be if they can already document that a majority of the employees eligible to join the union support it -- and I suspect that they may be able to do that. Otherwise, the lack of such an election could be used against the union in the future.

[Rooch]

I support Paizo and the products they're putting out. I've put over 800$ into Paizo for PF2e. I don't know that the union is going to help along that path and since this is backed by the Communication Workers of America I'm skeptical how "organic" this is. I'd hate to see a quality ruleset and company bogged down by a big time national union taking their shot at the game space.

[thejeff]

David knott 242 wrote:

The only way it would make sense to skip the election process would be if they can already document that a majority of the employees eligible to join the union support it -- and I suspect that they may be able to do that. Otherwise, the lack of such an election could be used against the union in the future.

My understanding is that they have cards signed by a majority. That is itself a formal part of the process - you can't even apply for an election without 30% card check.

Obviously, that's a claim and it's reasonable to ask them to verify it, which they'd need to do to the NLRB anyway.

I don't think there's any legal way to use the lack of election against them if Paizo chooses to recognize them, though it might come up in less formal ways. Election and recognition by the company are the two formal, legal processes for establishing a union.

[Leg o' Lamb]

David knott 242 wrote:

The only way it would make sense to skip the election process would be if they can already document that a majority of the employees eligible to join the union support it -- and I suspect that they may be able to do that. Otherwise, the lack of such an election could be used against the union in the future.

Paizo management either recognizes the union, or they force a vote. A lack of an election can not be used against them as that would mean recognition, and thus no need for a vote to happen.

[Leg o' Lamb]

Zakith wrote:

I support Paizo and the products they're putting out. I've put over 800$ into Paizo for PF2e. I don't know that the union is going to help along that path and since this is backed by the Communication Workers of America I'm skeptical how "organic" this is. I'd hate to see a quality ruleset and company bogged down by a big time national union taking their shot at the game space.

It's organic.

[David knott 242]

Leg o' Lamb wrote:

David knott 242 wrote:

The only way it would make sense to skip the election process would be if they can already document that a majority of the employees eligible to join the union support it -- and I suspect that they may be able to do that. Otherwise, the lack of such an election could be used against the union in the future.

Paizo management either recognizes the union, or they force a vote. A lack of an election can not be used against them as that would mean recognition, and thus no need for a vote to happen.

If those are their only choices, they would definitely want to gauge the level of support for the union before they recognize it. A 30% card check would be enough to force an election, but a 50+% card check would be enough to render the election unnecessary, especially if they have no reason to believe coercion on the part of the union organizers was involved.

But given the apparent level of support for the union among their employees, the current situation at the company, and the importance of their public image, it would be corporate suicide for Paizo management to take any unnecessary anti-union actions.

[Leg o' Lamb]

David knott 242 wrote:

Leg o' Lamb wrote:

David knott 242 wrote:

The only way it would make sense to skip the election process would be if they can already document that a majority of the employees eligible to join the union support it -- and I suspect that they may be able to do that. Otherwise, the lack of such an election could be used against the union in the future.

Paizo management either recognizes the union, or they force a vote. A lack of an election can not be used against them as that would mean recognition, and thus no need for a vote to happen.

If those are their only choices, they would definitely want to gauge the level of support for the union before they recognize it. A 30% card check would be enough to force an election, but a 50+% card check would be enough to render the election unnecessary, especially if they have no reason to believe coercion on the part of the union organizers was involved.

But given the apparent level of support for the union among their employees, the current situation at the company, and the importance of their public image, it would be corporate suicide for Paizo management to take any unnecessary anti-union actions.

In a perfect world? Yes.

Nothing will render an election as unnecessary. Signing a card and actually voting yes are two different things; especially if management pushes out the election by 6-8 weeks. This gives management enough time to have individual meetings with every employee not listed on the initial twitter thread. And then to go after the others. By the time the election rolls around, maybe enough employees heard enough or the right horror stories about the company going under or how this will have a negative impact on their employment that that person votes no. Secret ballot so no one knows how the others voted.

Never assume a company will ever do the "right thing". No matter how obvious you think it is, it rarely happens. Would I like to see voluntary recognition? Yes I would. Do I think it will happen? No.

[Rooch]

Paizo basically can't say anything against the unionization efforts publicly otherwise they get into "unfair labor practices" territory and they can't even comment on the unions campaign. I'd never work for a Union and if my work ever became unionized I'd find new employment. Every single union that I've seen takes dues from members to pay people who don't work and negotiate for themselves not for me. It turns most places into a seniority based environment based on cronyism and not about competency.

Every place I've ever seen unions had the unions being a bunch of bullies to everyone else in the workplace. The best thing you can do for your pay check and career is avoid being part of a union and if someone doesn't pay you enough go immediately to find a new job where they do. The only place a union might make sense is a trade union where you're actually getting training, but for office workers... You're just being taken for dues. Just another tax to pay every 2 weeks.

[Cori Marie]

Hey Rooch, do you enjoy a 40 hour work week? Do you enjoy weekends off? Do you enjoy overtime pay? Those were all things gotten for you by Unions.

[Leg o' Lamb]

Cori Marie wrote:

Hey Rooch, do you enjoy a 40 hour work week? Do you enjoy weekends off? Do you enjoy overtime pay? Those were all things gotten for you by Unions.

Damn straight.

[Yoshua]

Cori Marie wrote:

Hey Rooch, do you enjoy a 40 hour work week? Do you enjoy weekends off? Do you enjoy overtime pay? Those were all things gotten for you by Unions.

I've actively not responded to so many posts. But Cori Marie?

/clap

Yes. This.

Anyone who complains about unions out loud doesn't understand that the normal worklife we 'enjoy' today is only possible because of union work.

Even if you don't work for, or pay into a union? If you are employed you benefit from the groundwork those organizations did to normalize the 40 hour work week. At minimum.

[Elegos]

Lets go further- do you enjoy being paid legal currency, rather company scrip? Do you enjoy your employer having a duty to provide relevant safety equipment for your profession, as well as a duty of care to ensure a safe working environment?

Cause those are all things that labour unions ensured for you. Those rules are written in the blood of workers that corporations literally attempted to murder for unionising.

And that last sentence isn't hyperbole. I'm being very literal.

[Dave2]

Many credit the 40 hour work week starting with Henry Ford 1937 who thought workers would be more productive with 40 hour week instead of 48. Then Union was negotiating with GM about working conditions and had sit in strike. To strengthen this idea Franklin Rosevelt did the fair labor standards act in 1938 which strengthen it.

[Leg o' Lamb]

Elegos wrote:

Lets go further- do you enjoy being paid legal currency, rather company scrip? Do you enjoy your employer having a duty to provide relevant safety equipment for your profession, as well as a duty of care to ensure a safe working environment?

Cause those are all things that labour unions ensured for you. Those rules are written in the blood of workers that corporations literally attempted to murder for unionising.

And that last sentence isn't hyperbole. I'm being very literal.

Damn right they bled.

[thejeff]

Dave2 wrote:

Many credit the 40 hour work week starting with Henry Ford 1937 who thought workers would be more productive with 40 hour week instead of 48. Then Union was negotiating with GM about working conditions and had sit in strike. To strengthen this idea Franklin Rosevelt did the fair labor standards act in 1938 which strengthen it.

Many do, but unions had been fighting for the 8 hour day for decades before Ford decided workers would be more productive that way. Any such decisions need to be seen as part of the labor strife during that period. While Ford remained staunchly anti-Union for decades longer it's possible to see this as a concession to dampen union organizing among his workers.

Taking a very large employer like that to a 40 hour week and making it work certainly helped the fight, but it wasn't out of the blue.

[NicoleH]

Day 2 blog from United Paizo Workers

Discussion what can you do now? What news sources have discussed this so far?
As well as What Happens Now

Please consider checking this out: Day 2: Steel Your Resolve UPW

[Dave2]

Also the fair labor and standards act by Rosevelt. This is what made it more uniform and enforcement possible. There are many states that do not have a strong Union and enjoy 40 hours week, overtime, and days off thanks to the fair labor and standards act as well as the Unions which Rosevelt supported the idea. So without the Union the fair labor and standards act may never have happened. Without the fair labor and standards act Unions and workers would lack legal protection from working more than 40 without overtime.

So I do hope Washington is strong Union state for Paizo Union.

[Anorak]

Big News from Jason, Senior PF & SF Developer

Twitter Thread

"Well, about a month ago, about 40 of Paizo’s most reliable, prolific, and skilled freelancers simply stopped working. In official parlance, this is called “concerted action.” In layman’s terms, it’s a strike without a union."

Now, this group of freelancers had a specific list of demands. They wanted Paizo to hire a diversity officer, for example, and investigate recent terminations. But yesterday, they updated their demands: they’ll all come back to work if Paizo recognizes United Paizo Workers.

[Davor Firetusk]

I hope this works out well. I'm neither pro nor antiunion. From a governance perspective Profit sharing type arrangements have always made somewhat more sense to me (though they can still be gamed). My spouse is a union member and I benefit from that contract. I am not though we work in a similar field. On a personal level at the moment I am benefitting greatly from my spouse's union negotiations (and I empirically recognize they general benefit they provide). In fact if I were to switch to her employer I would see about a 20% compensation increase. And yet I haven't because I dislike the working conditions the union has negotiated to. They've basically gone purely after money over the years, but it has come at the expense of other things (like more employees for a more distributed workload). I'm certainly glad to see that freelancers seem to be included in the effort because leaving them out would almost certainly have led to more problems with a 2-tier type employee system. Similar to the ridiculous problem the highly effective MLB players union creates by negotiating indirectly minor league working conditions (minor leaguers are not union members).
My encouragement is to think carefully about what you want long term, and figure out what the tradeoffs might end up being.