Iblydos


Lost Omens Campaign Setting General Discussion


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Pathfinder’s take on Ancient Greece, a land of hero-gods and monsters; we’ve seen one of its cities in Distant Shores, and a few more of its hero-gods at the final 1e AP backmatter - how do folks like the region? Is it somewhere you’re eager to see more of?


Honestly it's kinda meh to me. I do like the behemoth creatures that have a specific weakness to the wish spell, but other than that there's nothing about it that particularly grabs my attention with so little to go on.

To be fair however, I'm also not much of a fan of Greek mythology, so I'm sure that plays some role in biasing me against it.

Note that this will not in any way prevent me from reading everything about it should Paizo release a book on it, particularly given the quality of books they've been releasing the past 2 or 3 years.


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I love the idea of it. Can't wait to see what they make of it, Archaic/Classical/Hellenistic Greece has so much great history and myths to get inspired from. And since Iblydos is presumably an archipelago made up of many different city-states, they have so much opportunity to make each area feel unique and distinct. I think it would be particularly cool to see Amazon-like society or an island ruled by minotaurs.

Similar to my thoughts on Osirion, it would also be interesting art-wise to see it combine an Ancient Greek aesthetic with a Medieval/Renaissance state of fashion and technology.

Liberty's Edge

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SOLDIER-1st wrote:

Honestly it's kinda meh to me. I do like the behemoth creatures that have a specific weakness to the wish spell, but other than that there's nothing about it that particularly grabs my attention with so little to go on.

To be fair however, I'm also not much of a fan of Greek mythology, so I'm sure that plays some role in biasing me against it.

Note that this will not in any way prevent me from reading everything about it should Paizo release a book on it, particularly given the quality of books they've been releasing the past 2 or 3 years.

Funny thing is that I love Greek mythology and it is the exact reason I also am not really interested in this. I do not want Diet Ancient Mythic Greece.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I'd be interested in seeing what they could do with it since there have been some similar themed Greek 3pp 5e products out there recently.

Would be interesting to see if a Satyr, Minotaur or maybe playable Cyclopean ancestry would appear.
Would be probably be better if it was included with some other similar type lost civilizations or other neighboring regions perhaps

Grand Lodge

For me, it's sorta like 'The Raven Black' -- I love Classical Studies so I love Iblydos -- but it's the region that doesn't necessarily need any design from Paizo!

I mean, if they design it whole cloth from Heroic, and then Classical, Greece, well, we already have all of that. So it would be just like reading an old textbook on Classical Studies. However, if they designed Iblydos with significantly different, say, merely 'Greek Flavored' material, it's more likely to leave a really bad taste in our mouth. We the folks who love Greek Mythology and have read gazillions of books on The Heroic Age and The Dark Age and The Golden Age, whatever, well, if there's too much incongruity, we're not gonna like it.

If Paizo does Iblydos, I'll take a long look at it and may well buy it. But really, If and when I want a Classics-themed game, I don't need a damned thing from Paizo to comprehensively build Iblydos.

....To answer the OP, well, I guess 'Yes' AND 'No.'


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I will say, such a book has some potential Ancestries a lot of folks would love: minotaur, satyr, stheno, something dryad-, cyclops-, or harpy-inspired...


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
keftiu wrote:
I will say, such a book has some potential Ancestries a lot of folks would love: minotaur, satyr, stheno, something dryad-, cyclops-, or harpy-inspired...

I have a player who is using Strix with Songbird heritage to play a harpy at the moment.

As for minotaur I recently wrote a 2,255 word Minotaur ancestry. Probably not completely done with it yet, but could share.


The Raven Black wrote:
SOLDIER-1st wrote:
...
Funny thing is that I love Greek mythology and it is the exact reason I also am not really interested in this. I do not want Diet Ancient Mythic Greece.

100% this. Bland and semi there. If they make something unique with a touch here and there, sure...

But I'll be honest, (mostly american) produced theme park aproximations of cultures are plentiful, I'm sure we dont need one more.

But perhaps it is a biased opinion; I thoroughly enjoyed Mwangi expanse and it could be a similar dynamic, and I am just ignorant of parts of other cultures. So maybe it is just the perfect product. (although mythical greece with golden armour has been done to death)


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I mean, the hero-gods are already something wholly unique and not drawn from the real world; Chinostes is especially fresh, as is Iapholi.

Liberty's Edge

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keftiu wrote:
I mean, the hero-gods are already something wholly unique and not drawn from the real world; Chinostes is especially fresh, as is Iapholi.

I think they are Paizo's take on the Greek demigods. They seem to be unique in Golarion, but the concept is completely drawn from the RL Greek legends and feels to me rather shoehorned in Golarion.

Dark Archive

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Friendly reminder that Iblydos is Babhomet's place of birth ;P


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The Raven Black wrote:
keftiu wrote:
I mean, the hero-gods are already something wholly unique and not drawn from the real world; Chinostes is especially fresh, as is Iapholi.
I think they are Paizo's take on the Greek demigods. They seem to be unique in Golarion, but the concept is completely drawn from the RL Greek legends and feels to me rather shoehorned in Golarion.

I think the fact that they aren’t blood-descended from deities, can be created with cyclops prophecy-magic, and can apparently be a random lion all make them plenty distinct. You aren’t likely to see a Greek demigod who is a hero-turned-vampire worshiped by two separate, feuding cults - that’s all Golarion.

Plus, we know Arcadia has hero-gods of its own.

Dark Archive

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Yeaaaah. Dismissing Iblydos as "bland generic greek ripoff" kinda requires that you haven't actually looked into the area at all because you dismissed theme of it ^^; Its kinda like dismissing Osirion as "just egypt" (though granted I don't think paizo has done Osirion to its full potential either)

Maybe better example would be dismissing Razatlan as "just Aztecs" :p

Grand Lodge

CorvusMask wrote:
Yeaaaah. Dismissing Iblydos as "bland generic greek ripoff" kinda....

.

Huh.

I had to really think about that for a few minutes.

My first reaction was, 'Hey, I'm not dismissing Iblydos at all.' But. Um.
....Huh

I think one of the great strengths of the Paizo setting is that it's so easy to say to someone new -- as way of introducing them to the setting -- 'This area of Golarion is like this real-world-culture and that part of Golarion is inspired by that real-world-mythology.' Like (I think) everyone on The Boards here, I see that design choice as a strength. But, of course, it also has its caveats (much talked about over the years in other Threads).

Getting back to This Thread: ....I am saying (and I think the other posters who have said such similar) that in the case of Iblydos, we are such big Classical Studies fans, that we don't really want to see Paizo do more on Iblydos, because, either Paizo would have to do an obvious 'copy/paste' of Classical Studies -- which we already know very, Very well, or they would have to change it up creatively and, since we already love it as Classical Studies, we won't likely enjoy what they are do differently. ....When we want to have a Classical Studies-flavored game, we don't need Paizo's help to do it -- we'll just put Greek and Hellenistic and Roman and Etruscan (etc.) stuff in Iblydos and play.

....So, does that mean I'm being dismissive of Iblydos?!?

I honestly don't know!

I mean, the whole point of Paizo having a design platform of, 'Hey, let's make it easy for gamers to introduce our campaign setting to newcomers by making places like Osirion and Iblydos, Ustalov and Tian Xia' -- is so that it's easy on US. Vudra = India. Andoran = Patriots. Cheliax = Devil Worshippers. ....These are easy-to-understand Starting Points. Intentionally done.

Now, in the case of Iblydos, some of us don't need anything else. But I don't think that means we're being dismissive of Iblydos. (But I really did have to think about it for a few minutes. I wasn't sure.

.

Let me use the following as an example.

For me, I don't know anything about Far Eastern, or Oriental, culture, society or history. I come from a generation that was very well educated in Western European culture, society and history (including Classical Studies), but very poorly (actually completely neglected) on Oriental, African and Native Americas culture, society and history.

If someone like me wants to play in Tian Xia, I will NEED Paizo's source material. I am from the generation that was actually taught that Oriental = 'Chinaman.' I admit gross ignorance on the differences between Korean and Japanese and Chinese and Mongol and Siamese cultures and societies and histories. (I'll blow you Millennials away on Greek Mythology and European History, but-- ) So I really do need educating in those areas. Likewise, EVERYTHING I know from Egyptian Mythology comes from the 1980 Deities and Demigods book! So I need help if I want to run something in Osirion.

But I don't need any help (inspiration?) from Paizo on Iblydos.

Just like a gamer friend of mine with a Masters Degree in Eastern Studies, who has lived in various parts of The Orient, who knows a few Eastern languages, who teaches Eastern philosophy, etc. probably doesn't need Paizo to help him or her design a campaign in Tian Xia. And, very possibly, may even roll his or her eyes at some of Paizo's Tian source material, may even be dismissive of it, only seeing errors and inconsistencies and problems.

Does that mean we are "dismissive" of Iblydos and Tian Xia, respectively?

Huh.

- - -

Anyway,
Was this post waaay too long?
sorry


keftiu wrote:
The Raven Black wrote:
keftiu wrote:
I mean, the hero-gods are already something wholly unique and not drawn from the real world; Chinostes is especially fresh, as is Iapholi.
I think they are Paizo's take on the Greek demigods. They seem to be unique in Golarion, but the concept is completely drawn from the RL Greek legends and feels to me rather shoehorned in Golarion.

I think the fact that they aren’t blood-descended from deities, can be created with cyclops prophecy-magic, and can apparently be a random lion all make them plenty distinct. You aren’t likely to see a Greek demigod who is a hero-turned-vampire worshiped by two separate, feuding cults - that’s all Golarion.

Plus, we know Arcadia has hero-gods of its own.

Well, this piques my curiosity. Besides Distant Shores, where else has this lore appeared?


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Per Astra wrote:
keftiu wrote:
The Raven Black wrote:
keftiu wrote:
I mean, the hero-gods are already something wholly unique and not drawn from the real world; Chinostes is especially fresh, as is Iapholi.
I think they are Paizo's take on the Greek demigods. They seem to be unique in Golarion, but the concept is completely drawn from the RL Greek legends and feels to me rather shoehorned in Golarion.

I think the fact that they aren’t blood-descended from deities, can be created with cyclops prophecy-magic, and can apparently be a random lion all make them plenty distinct. You aren’t likely to see a Greek demigod who is a hero-turned-vampire worshiped by two separate, feuding cults - that’s all Golarion.

Plus, we know Arcadia has hero-gods of its own.

Well, this piques my curiosity. Besides Distant Shores, where else has this lore appeared?

There’s a very fun listing of a few other hero-gods in the back of the final volume of Tyrant’s Grasp, I believe!

Paizo Employee Starfinder Senior Developer

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Per Astra wrote:
keftiu wrote:
The Raven Black wrote:
keftiu wrote:
I mean, the hero-gods are already something wholly unique and not drawn from the real world; Chinostes is especially fresh, as is Iapholi.
I think they are Paizo's take on the Greek demigods. They seem to be unique in Golarion, but the concept is completely drawn from the RL Greek legends and feels to me rather shoehorned in Golarion.

I think the fact that they aren’t blood-descended from deities, can be created with cyclops prophecy-magic, and can apparently be a random lion all make them plenty distinct. You aren’t likely to see a Greek demigod who is a hero-turned-vampire worshiped by two separate, feuding cults - that’s all Golarion.

Plus, we know Arcadia has hero-gods of its own.

Well, this piques my curiosity. Besides Distant Shores, where else has this lore appeared?

I wrote two additional pages about Iblydan hero-gods in the back of Pathfinder #144: Midwives to Death, which was an extended article where many developers each got two pages to write about whatever topic they wanted in this final Adventure Path volume for Pathfinder's first edition.


Thanks to you both--I'm looking forward to reading these!


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Coming back to this thread to say that I'd love for some of the hero-gods to officially come over into 2e; while it's easy enough to homebrew, Book of the Dead being imminent has me wanting to make a character devoted to Chinostes, who I adore.

2e has been really good about making real-world inspired reasons feel more distinct than just a pop culture coat of paint; the Mwangi Expanse is clearly leaning on West Africa, but so much of it is original fantasy. We've seen a pretty classic (and relatively shallow) take on Greek myth via 5e's Theros adaptation - but Iblydos isn't in a Classical setting, and has super unique neighbors to deal with.

Rules for becoming a hero-god (since we know other regions of Golarion have them) would be a blast, too. It might make for a nice angle on 2e Mythic stuff, or perhaps offer a slightly lower-powered alternative.

EDIT: Do we know where Iblydos is on this map?


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keftiu wrote:

Coming back to this thread to say that I'd love for some of the hero-gods to officially come over into 2e; while it's easy enough to homebrew, Book of the Dead being imminent has me wanting to make a character devoted to Chinostes, who I adore.

2e has been really good about making real-world inspired reasons feel more distinct than just a pop culture coat of paint; the Mwangi Expanse is clearly leaning on West Africa, but so much of it is original fantasy. We've seen a pretty classic (and relatively shallow) take on Greek myth via 5e's Theros adaptation - but Iblydos isn't in a Classical setting, and has super unique neighbors to deal with.

Rules for becoming a hero-god (since we know other regions of Golarion have them) would be a blast, too. It might make for a nice angle on 2e Mythic stuff, or perhaps offer a slightly lower-powered alternative.

EDIT: Do we know where Iblydos is on this map?

I agree with all of this! Would love to see the return of the hero gods. Weren't Hero-gods also present in Arcadia?

I think Iblydos is the islands below that big desert in Casmaron


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The Painted Oryx wrote:
Would love to see the return of the hero gods. Weren't Hero-gods also present in Arcadia?

Arcadia used to have some (seemingly empowered by what was functionally a smaller, weaker Starstone chunk) who fought for independence in Innazpa from ancient Razatlan and reshaped the land to found Xopatl. They all died out or ascended back in the Age of Anguish, thousands of years before Golarion's present day, and are revered today as saints.

I swear, a third spot beyond Iblydos and Arcadia was recently established as having hero-gods, but I can't for the life of me remember were.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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Iblydos is indeed the string of islands close to the center of the map south of the big desert.

The hero gods aren't gonna be coming back before we figure out when and (more importantly and significantly) IF we have something akin to mythic in 2nd edition. Once we make that decision (yes or no) we can go ahead with Iblydos in detail, but until we make that decision it's not really all that responsible to do much more with the region since we won't know what rules we should use to support it. We have some cool Iblydos ideas in the works for when that decision's made, but until then there's plenty of other stories to tell and places to explore.


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James Jacobs wrote:

Iblydos is indeed the string of islands close to the center of the map south of the big desert.

The hero gods aren't gonna be coming back before we figure out when and (more importantly and significantly) IF we have something akin to mythic in 2nd edition. Once we make that decision (yes or no) we can go ahead with Iblydos in detail, but until we make that decision it's not really all that responsible to do much more with the region since we won't know what rules we should use to support it. We have some cool Iblydos ideas in the works for when that decision's made, but until then there's plenty of other stories to tell and places to explore.

Appreciate the reply, James! Always nice to have a little hope and expectations management rolled together, and to see you posting.

Liberty's Edge

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keftiu wrote:
The Painted Oryx wrote:
Would love to see the return of the hero gods. Weren't Hero-gods also present in Arcadia?

Arcadia used to have some (seemingly empowered by what was functionally a smaller, weaker Starstone chunk) who fought for independence in Innazpa from ancient Razatlan and reshaped the land to found Xopatl. They all died out or ascended back in the Age of Anguish, thousands of years before Golarion's present day, and are revered today as saints.

I swear, a third spot beyond Iblydos and Arcadia was recently established as having hero-gods, but I can't for the life of me remember were.

Vudra ?

From 60ft under according to pathfinderwiki : "the region of Vudra known as the Divine Garden.

The Divine Garden's soil is considered sacred ground, where deities and hero-gods descend to walk among mortals."


The Raven Black wrote:
keftiu wrote:
The Painted Oryx wrote:
Would love to see the return of the hero gods. Weren't Hero-gods also present in Arcadia?

Arcadia used to have some (seemingly empowered by what was functionally a smaller, weaker Starstone chunk) who fought for independence in Innazpa from ancient Razatlan and reshaped the land to found Xopatl. They all died out or ascended back in the Age of Anguish, thousands of years before Golarion's present day, and are revered today as saints.

I swear, a third spot beyond Iblydos and Arcadia was recently established as having hero-gods, but I can't for the life of me remember were.

Vudra ?

From 60ft under according to pathfinderwiki : "the region of Vudra known as the Divine Garden.

The Divine Garden's soil is considered sacred ground, where deities and hero-gods descend to walk among mortals."

That’s it, thank you!

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