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Holy snikey. My first post was in August 2007. WHEN DID I GET OLD?!?Jesus no, that would mean Ashiel.I'm now fully expecting Mikaze to return.Early 2010s Paizo forum gang reunion tour!
Mine looks like September 2006. Depends! Depends for everyone!
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I , in my ignorance , believe Paizo should offer the jobs back to Sara and Diego and make a public apology while working to improve the condition of their employees . In relation to JP, if the accusations are not true, Paizo must take the necessary legal measures. This woman's statements are hurting the company. Another thing, I would very much like to hear the position of LIsa Stevens. A woman I've admired since the days of White Wolf.
This would be a nice thing to do, but would you really consider going back to the company that fired and underpaid you? I would not. And I did not. When Covid hit I was working for a Russian company and they fired every single Polish employee in an office in Warsaw they had (for a ridiculous reason). Half a year later a manager from the company reached out to us and asked if we want to be hired back. I still find it distasteful.
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I will just say that over the years Diego and Sara have been an invaluable part of my experience in dealing with Paizo
To a lot of you this doesn't sound like the Paizo you know and love so you want to extend the benefit of the doubt. It doesn't sound like the Paizo I know and love either. And I have in the past given them that benefit. I don't want to feel this way about a place that has sparked so much joy. But enough is enough. I dont think Jessica is a liar. I know Crystal isn't. This behavior towards their creators is simply unacceptable.
Jeff Alvarez isn't Paizo.
The rank and file designers and developers are. This community is. And they deserve better than this.
I have seen #PaizoAccountability on twitter and I would like to copy and paste that statement of demands here to echo my agreement with it:
- you need to hire a third party whistleblower/arbitration company
- Sara Marie's wrongful termination needs to be investigated by that company
- executives need to be held accountable and investigated
- executives need to enter good faith negotiations with their employees
- salaries need to be posted and raised, some employee incomes are below the median livable income.
I , in my ignorance , believe Paizo should offer the jobs back to Sara and Diego and make a public apology while working to improve the condition of their employees . In relation to JP, if the accusations are not true, Paizo must take the necessary legal measures. This woman's statements are hurting the company. Another thing, I would very much like to hear the position of LIsa Stevens. A woman I've admired since the days of White Wolf.
Sadly, that would be an admission of wrongdoing and, according to experience, it is a sure way to make things worse in media scandals.
If there was wrongdoing, let's hope the affected parts be compensated adequately and the responsible parties sanctioned accordingly. Otherwise, let's hope that everything gets cleared out.
Humbly,
Yawar
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- Sara Marie's wrongful termination needs to be investigated by that company
Do we actually know that the termination was "wrongful"? I don't think we do? So until we know the assumption that the termination was "wrongful" is just a speculation. A wild and totally made up example here: what if Sara was under such a pressure recently that she did something totally unprofessional on a whim, like, say, she spit her manager in the face? I am not saying that she did and I certainly don't believe that but the fact is that we don't know what happened and we might never know. If she kicked Jeff in the crotch would her termination still be "wrongful"?
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I'm now fully expecting Mikaze to return.
I'm here, too! And watching things. I don't have anything useful to say that hasn't already been said, but I stand with Sara, Diego and Crystal.
Don’t play with me heart, Comrade Bag-that-looks-like-another-bag-but-for-legal-and-copyright-reasons-is-not- that-bag.
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Don’t play with me heart, Comrade Bag-that-looks-like-another-bag-but-for-legal-and-copyright-reasons-is-not- that-bag.I'm now fully expecting Mikaze to return.
I'm here, too! And watching things. I don't have anything useful to say that hasn't already been said, but I stand with Sara, Diego and Crystal.
Oh that's an accurate description, Gorbacz was a coeurl, I'm a displacer beast.
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Don’t play with me heart, Comrade Bag-that-looks-like-another-bag-but-for-legal-and-copyright-reasons-is-not- that-bag.I'm now fully expecting Mikaze to return.
I'm here, too! And watching things. I don't have anything useful to say that hasn't already been said, but I stand with Sara, Diego and Crystal.
As non humanoid rights fan, I'm actually sad I never met Mikaze on forums so that would be bit of "holy crap what" moment for me if that happened
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I keep waiting for Sara or Diego to come in and lock this thread.
Oh wait.
Don’t play with me heart, Comrade Bag-that-looks-like-another-bag-but-for-legal-and-copyright-reasons-is-not- that-bag.I'm now fully expecting Mikaze to return.
I'm here, too! And watching things. I don't have anything useful to say that hasn't already been said, but I stand with Sara, Diego and Crystal.
Did something happen with Mikaze? I've stuck fairly firmly to the PbP forum with this account until now.
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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Do we actually know that the termination was "wrongful"? I don't think we do? So until we know the assumption that the termination was "wrongful" is just a speculation. A wild and totally made up example here: what if Sara was under such a pressure recently that she did something totally unprofessional on a whim, like, say, she spit her manager in the face? I am not saying that she did and I certainly don't believe that but the fact is that we don't know what happened and we might never know. If she kicked Jeff in the crotch would her termination still be "wrongful"?
- Sara Marie's wrongful termination needs to be investigated by that company
To be fair, we don't know. It's possible Sara did something to bring this on herself. Usually, your number two won't follow you out the door in a situation like that, but who knows. And yet, even if she did something that justified the termination, all signs point to the decision being not thought out with no considerations given to the timing or ramifications. Clearly, someone thought she was disposable and not part of what makes Paizo special. I strongly disagree.
Sure, I'm giving Sara the benefit of the doubt, but I don't think that assumption is unwarranted given her extensive history at Paizo and the many, many interactions I and others have had with her over the years. She deserved better. And given her proximity to the actual customers with whom she worked, we are rightfully pissed off.
Put another way, the kind of person who spits in the face of their manager is not the kind of person who holds a position for a decade and is beloved by the customers with whom they interact.
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I've been here, as a customer and a fan, since before the public beta of PF1E. I've watched a lot of fantastic, creative, and highly ethical talent work for Paizo... and then sadly leave. Some of what I've read from these various accounts I've previously known about, or were hinted about. It isn't all new to me, but the breath and depth of it was.
I can only speak for myself, but I will no longer purchase any Paizo product, or any product sold through Paizo's storefront, until significant tangible steps are taken to seriously investigate and address these severe inequalities and abuses by management. Until then, I cannot in good conscience continue to contribute to Paizo's revenue.
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Did something happen with Mikaze? I've stuck fairly firmly to the PbP forum with this account until now.Don’t play with me heart, Comrade Bag-that-looks-like-another-bag-but-for-legal-and-copyright-reasons-is-not- that-bag.I'm now fully expecting Mikaze to return.
I'm here, too! And watching things. I don't have anything useful to say that hasn't already been said, but I stand with Sara, Diego and Crystal.
Last post in 2015. Was a great and creative member of the community back in the day.
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Do we actually know that the termination was "wrongful"? I don't think we do? So until we know the assumption that the termination was "wrongful" is just a speculation. A wild and totally made up example here: what if Sara was under such a pressure recently that she did something totally unprofessional on a whim, like, say, she spit her manager in the face? I am not saying that she did and I certainly don't believe that but the fact is that we don't know what happened and we might never know. If she kicked Jeff in the crotch would her termination still be "wrongful"?
- Sara Marie's wrongful termination needs to be investigated by that companyTo be fair, we don't know. It's possible Sara did something to bring this on herself. Usually, your number two won't follow you out the door in a situation like that, but who knows. And yet, even if she did something that justified the termination, all signs point to the decision being not thought out with no considerations given to the timing or ramifications. Clearly, someone thought she was disposable and not part of what makes Paizo special. I strongly disagree.
Sure, I'm giving Sara the benefit of the doubt, but I don't think that assumption is unwarranted given her extensive history at Paizo and the many, many interactions I and others have had with her over the years. She deserved better. And given her proximity to the actual customers with whom she worked, we are rightfully pissed off.
Put another way, the kind of person who spits in the face of their manager is not the kind of person who holds a position for a decade and is beloved by the customers with whom they interact.
Well yes, I don't believe Sara did anything wrong, but still we don't really know. People under serious stress can do things no one would suspect. I have seen people that couldn't manage stress break and act in a way no one would ever suspect. Anything is possible and it was reported that the tension was rising for 3 weeks before the incident. Anything could have happened.
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So, I actually took the time to email customer service and here is a screenshot of the very worrying response that I received.
I...do not understand how these three can be the points of contact for this issue.
I'm not going to comment on the merit of the accusations that have been leveled against several Paizo staff because I don't know whether they are meritorious or not. But Jeff, Erik, and Tonya are all highly implicated by those accusations. Establishing a point of contact that's not also implicated in a scandal should be one of the first things Paizo does if it intends to have any credibility in responding to the situation. If there is merit to any of the accusations, that's like having the fox guarding the henhouse!
Paizo, I would suggest that you switch these points of contact out for either your PR team or your legal team (in house or outside).
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Last post in 2015. Was a great and creative member of the community back in the day.Did something happen with Mikaze? I've stuck fairly firmly to the PbP forum with this account until now.Don’t play with me heart, Comrade Bag-that-looks-like-another-bag-but-for-legal-and-copyright-reasons-is-not- that-bag.I'm now fully expecting Mikaze to return.
I'm here, too! And watching things. I don't have anything useful to say that hasn't already been said, but I stand with Sara, Diego and Crystal.
Mikaze was great, it's sad to hear they just left but I'm glad they didn't get Ashiel'd which from the talking sounded like it may have happened.
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For anyone interested in a collection of all accumulated statements so far, here's a link to a reddit megathread on this. There have been quite a few outside of this thread and they shed a bit more light on the situation.
I'll also say I've been a huge fan of Pathfinder ever since I was first able to heal my friends as a Kyra pregen in a dusty basement, and I'm hopeful this all ends up resulting in positive change for Paizo going forward.
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Mikaze was great, it's sad to hear they just left but I'm glad they didn't get Ashiel'd which from the talking sounded like it may have happened.Last post in 2015. Was a great and creative member of the community back in the day.Did something happen with Mikaze? I've stuck fairly firmly to the PbP forum with this account until now.Don’t play with me heart, Comrade Bag-that-looks-like-another-bag-but-for-legal-and-copyright-reasons-is-not- that-bag.I'm now fully expecting Mikaze to return.
I'm here, too! And watching things. I don't have anything useful to say that hasn't already been said, but I stand with Sara, Diego and Crystal.
Still hoping that Mikaze will return leading an army of Neutral Good orcs riding Bella Sara horses and simply clean up this mess.
Funny thing, their Neutral Good orcs are actually now totally a default playable thing in PF2e... wish they were here.
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I've been here, as a customer and a fan, since before the public beta of PF1E. I've watched a lot of fantastic, creative, and highly ethical talent work for Paizo... and then sadly leave. Some of what I've read from these various accounts I've previously known about, or were hinted about. It isn't all new to me, but the breath and depth of it was.
I can only speak for myself, but I will no longer purchase any Paizo product, or any product sold through Paizo's storefront, until significant tangible steps are taken to seriously investigate and address these severe inequalities and abuses by management. Until then, I cannot in good conscience continue to contribute to Paizo's revenue.
I'm really torn on this one.
The people I know and love still at Paizo are the developers and designers, the creative forces. My subs keep them employed. And I don't want them out of a job.
But I do want better for them.
