3 - Eyes of Empty Death (GM Reference)


Abomination Vaults

51 to 95 of 95 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>
Scarab Sages

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
ShadowFighter88 wrote:

So just going through it and noticed a hiccup with the map, specifically on A16. The room's description mentions some of the cages being marked to indicate their current occupants, but all of the cages on the map are blank.

EDIT: Should point out this is the PDF and I'm looking at both the map in the adventure PDF and the version in the maps PDF. Both have the cages unmarked.

Has anyone figured out what is going on with this issue? The hard copy book's map is also unmarked.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Lozardyn is mentioned a few times in chapter two, but I don't see anything that actually says what it is. I gather it's a nearby drow city?

Dark Archive

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Was map lacking markings for which cage had which creature ever fixed?


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
CorvusMask wrote:
Was map lacking markings for which cage had which creature ever fixed?

It's fixed in the hardcover. Counterclockwise from the southernmost, it's skeleton, krooth, empty, chuul, skeleton, empty, empty.


On Level 9, the Random Encounters (The Cavern Vast) indicate that the creatures come from specific areas. If the PCs encounter a set of creatures in a random encounter, does that reduce or eliminate those creatures from the area they are from? Conversely, if they encounter the creatures in their home area and eliminate them, does the random encounter entry now count as no encounter?


Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
SillyOldeBear wrote:
On Level 9, the Random Encounters (The Cavern Vast) indicate that the creatures come from specific areas. If the PCs encounter a set of creatures in a random encounter, does that reduce or eliminate those creatures from the area they are from? Conversely, if they encounter the creatures in their home area and eliminate them, does the random encounter entry now count as no encounter?

Yes, that's how I'm playing it.

Scarab Sages

Quick question, on the first level of book 3 (the food level with the gnome-bog-mummie) the PCs encountered (and killed) the Gug before they met the cult dedicated to him (because they are players, of course they did). So how does the cult leader react? I know normally he is supposed to able to become an ally, but if he knows they killed his gug ‘god’ does he attack aw them out of anger? Become despondent? Give up and revert to his old religion?


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
VampByDay wrote:
Quick question, on the first level of book 3 (the food level with the gnome-bog-mummie) the PCs encountered (and killed) the Gug before they met the cult dedicated to him (because they are players, of course they did). So how does the cult leader react? I know normally he is supposed to able to become an ally, but if he knows they killed his gug ‘god’ does he attack aw them out of anger? Become despondent? Give up and revert to his old religion?

I would definitely have the cult be hostile to the PCs if they became aware that they killed the gug. But if it hasn't been long, I'm not sure they would realize their 'god' is dead.

Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I'm coming up on the end of the AP and I can't find the actual rules for how to use the Fulcrum Lenses and/or Fulcrum Lattices against Belcorra. Can anyone give me a specific page number or place to look? I have found mentions that it's easier with the Lattice, but no rules on what you specifically do in combat, or what the exact effects are for just using 1 or 2 of the items. Help?
I have both the three and the unified versions, but I've just been checking the hardcover. Did this not make the transition?


Pathfinder LO Special Edition, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

my thoughts:
Belcorra has the Ebon lens. Each of the other three has this ability:
Activate [two-actions] Interact (attack, possession);
Effect While grasping the lens, make a melee spell attack roll with a modifier of +18. On a hit, you force the splinter of Nhimbaloth’s essence from the lens to possess the target. You’re no longer invested in the lens, and the target gains the benefits as though it had invested the lens but can’t activate the lens’s other abilities. This effect is permanent, but it can be ended by any effect that removes a possession effect. The lens doesn’t have any magical abilities until the possession effect ends; when it does, the essence returns to the lens.

Seems like if you activate each lens (except the Ebon) against Belcorra in this way, Nhimbaloth's attention will be drawn to her, resulting in her death. With the Fulcrum Lattice it seems like you can activate all three lenses at once.

This strategy may rely on Belcorra absorbing at least one splinter of Belcorra's essence of the three in the Ebon Fulcrum. A better strategy, if you can get the Ebon Fulcrum from Belcorra, would be to put it in the lattice with the other three and activate all four at once. But see below.

This from page 205 of the hardcover edition:

Quote:
Once the heroes infuse Belcorra with all three of Nhimbaloth’s splinters, the earth shakes. A tremendous and hideous wail emanates from somewhere beyond this chamber—indeed, it seems, from beyond the Material Plane. All creatures in the Abomination Vaults must succeed a DC 30 Will save or become frightened 3 (a creature that critically fails is also paralyzed for 1d4 rounds). At the start of the following round, Nhimbaloth’s essence pervades the room.

So perhaps the PCs don't need to gain the Ebon Fulcrum Lens and put it in the Lattice.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Starfinder Superscriber
goodkinghadrian wrote:
CorvusMask wrote:
Was map lacking markings for which cage had which creature ever fixed?
It's fixed in the hardcover. Counterclockwise from the southernmost, it's skeleton, krooth, empty, chuul, skeleton, empty, empty.

Those cages are way too small for a huge sized creature


Pathfinder LO Special Edition, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

Which of these creatures are huge? Looks to me like they're all large.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Starfinder Superscriber

The Skeletal Hulks.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder LO Special Edition, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

Hm. From the hardcover edition of AV: "an 's' indicates a cage with a skeletal hulk that was once a Large reptilian humanoid".

I grant you that the bestiary entry says skeletal hulks are huge, but the quote above makes me question that: how does what was once large when alive end up having a huge skeleton?


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Starfinder Superscriber

Look, I really don't want to argue about whether I'm just too stupid to get the inferred meaning. If they wanted me to use a variant skeletal hulk, they should have specified. It's an error on their part. I don't pay for AP's to wildly guess at meaning.

Scarab Sages

So . . . I have a problem. I read everything to my players, they understand that Getting The mad god's attention will permanently take care of Belcorra, but . . and here's the thing, they kinda missed the part about how to do that. And all of them staunchly refuse to invest in the lenses. Which . . . normally good call, but you need to invest in the lenses in order to transfer the shard into Belcora to get the mad god's full attention. Should I just tell them? They think it will be as easy as walking in, pointing the lenses at Belcorra, and walking out. Thoughts?


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder LO Special Edition, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

Let them do it their way. They'll figure it out eventually. Or not.


The four dark circles in the area A3 (Hazy Shrine), what are they supposed to be?

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

Adjoint wrote:
The four dark circles in the area A3 (Hazy Shrine), what are they supposed to be?

I think they are supposed to be floor-to-ceiling pillars. I don't think they do anything but provide cover.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

With the Dread Wisps it seems that despite being effected by searing light and spells with the positive trait, a number of additional effects don't work against them. Searing lights extra good damage doesn't hit them because they aren't demons/undead. And you can't target them with a two-action heal because they aren't undead.

As a GM I'd probably just allow it to count as undead for the purposes of heal and lay on hands but I wondered if this is intentional, an oversight or perhaps I'm misunderstanding the wording?


jimbob5555 wrote:

With the Dread Wisps it seems that despite being effected by searing light and spells with the positive trait, a number of additional effects don't work against them. Searing lights extra good damage doesn't hit them because they aren't demons/undead. And you can't target them with a two-action heal because they aren't undead.

As a GM I'd probably just allow it to count as undead for the purposes of heal and lay on hands but I wondered if this is intentional, an oversight or perhaps I'm misunderstanding the wording?

I don't think you'll break anything by adding the Undead trait to them. The only edge case I see is the extra damage from Searing Light, but I think it's thematic if that's allowed to go through. The Wisp's immunity to magic should prevent any other weirdness.

I don't know why or how the rules for negative healing got so convoluted in 2e.


Pathfinder LO Special Edition, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

Negative healing: A creature with negative healing draws health from negative energy rather than positive energy. It is damaged by positive damage and is not healed by positive healing effects. It does not take negative damage, and it is healed by negative effects that heal undead.
Source: Bestiary 2, page 305.

How is this convoluted?


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

My group is about to clean up the remainder of the Farm level, about to abuse the poor Nilith, but a couple things occurred to me as they uncovered the Upper Pit area of the Gauntlight.

In book 1, saving Lasda Venkervale causes the Ribbon of Light to disappear from the areas in that book, and the shaft doesn't mention having the Ribbon of Light in book 2, but in this book, the Ribbon is back. Is that to imply the Ribbon only goes up as high as the Upper Pit room, or does saving Lasda disable the Ribbon in this book as well?

Additionally...has anyone had a party climb down the pit all the way down to the bottom? I can see my party trying that.


Ed Reppert wrote:

Negative healing: A creature with negative healing draws health from negative energy rather than positive energy. It is damaged by positive damage and is not healed by positive healing effects. It does not take negative damage, and it is healed by negative effects that heal undead.

Source: Bestiary 2, page 305.

How is this convoluted?

Not convoluted at all! It's just most of the positive spells that specifically only target undead or mention undead as taking damage from it. As a GM it's easy to handwave it but sometimes wondering if there was an intention behind it or just an omission. Things like Disrupting Weapon & the Disrupting rune have no effect on the Dread Wisps if we go by RAW as they specifically target undead. Interestingly Positive Attunement specifically mentions creatures Undead & creature with negative healing.


Pathfinder LO Special Edition, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber
Coybold wrote:

My group is about to clean up the remainder of the Farm level, about to abuse the poor Nilith, but a couple things occurred to me as they uncovered the Upper Pit area of the Gauntlight.

In book 1, saving Lasda Venkervale causes the Ribbon of Light to disappear from the areas in that book, and the shaft doesn't mention having the Ribbon of Light in book 2, but in this book, the Ribbon is back. Is that to imply the Ribbon only goes up as high as the Upper Pit room, or does saving Lasda disable the Ribbon in this book as well?

Additionally...has anyone had a party climb down the pit all the way down to the bottom? I can see my party trying that.

the ribbon, when fully working, goes all the way from the Empty Vault to the Gauntlight itself. Rescuing Lasda breaks the connection at level 4. As to why you don't see the Ribbon on levels 5, 6, and 7, I don't know. Either the second book assumes the party rescued Lasda (doubtful) or you wouldn't see the Ribbon on those levels even if Lasda was still in place (or has been replaced by another victim). Probably the latter. On the bottom three levels, the Ribbon is there because it's being generated by the menhirs in the Empty Vault.

Most of the various "Gauntlight Rooms" have stone floors, so it would not be possible to climb *all* the way down. You could I suppose climb down from level 5 to level 7, but you've got a spiral staircase there, so why bother?


Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Ed Reppert wrote:


the ribbon, when fully working, goes all the way from the Empty Vault to the Gauntlight itself. Rescuing Lasda breaks the connection at level 4. As to why you don't see the Ribbon on levels 5, 6, and 7, I don't know. Either the second book assumes the party rescued Lasda (doubtful) or you wouldn't see the Ribbon on those levels even if Lasda was still in place (or has been replaced by another victim). Probably the latter. On the bottom three levels, the Ribbon is there because it's being generated by the menhirs in the Empty Vault.

Right right. It's bothersome that there's an inconsistent narrative regarding it. Clearly something interrupts it in book two, with the only known thing to do that is Lasda's removal.

The only reasonable thing I can think of, is that the floor of the Prison is a sort of junction that only progresses the Ribbon upward if there is an anchor on level 3, which solves my issues and prevents party members from reaching the final fight too soon, ha.

Quote:
Most of the various "Gauntlight Rooms" have stone floors, so it would not be possible to climb *all* the way down. You could I suppose climb down from level 5 to level 7, but you've got a spiral staircase there, so why bother?

Because I can see my party doing it because it's there. But the Ribbon being active would make it next to impossible to survive that. Probably. So it shouldn't be an issue if I keep the Ribbon active, I just wanted to see if anyone knew if I was missing something regarding the state of it.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Dartraks wrote:
There's a sidebar about killing her, and notes elsewhere that the only way to open the doors without her is to smash them open. I think the expectation is actually that the players kill her and then smash their way through the temple, rather than letting her lead them around, but the option is there.

page number please as i can't seem to find it


Pathfinder LO Special Edition, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

I couldn't find it either, in the hardback version.


kevsurp wrote:
Dartraks wrote:
There's a sidebar about killing her, and notes elsewhere that the only way to open the doors without her is to smash them open. I think the expectation is actually that the players kill her and then smash their way through the temple, rather than letting her lead them around, but the option is there.
page number please as i can't seem to find it

Page 196 in the hardback version, sidebar titled "The Proctor." Just below it in the notes for room J1, it lists the Hardness & HP for breaking open the doors in that room.

There's also lots of chances for the PC's to notice that she seems annoyed they keep surviving, so the intention seems to be that they don't follow the advice of the spooky evil skeleton.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
willfromamerica wrote:
Is it just me or is the amount of XP provided on the Farm level totally insane? Even excluding the XP from the Froghemoth encounter, the potential random encounters, and everything with the drow, I added up 1,700 XP that players can get from handling everything in Chapter 1. Are players not expected to see all of those encounters?

I'm not sure about the farm level, but the hunting grounds seem rife with encounters you're not expected to fight with all the drow. I'm hoping my players can ignore their murder hobo instincts because there is a lot of loot and XP down there.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

What are the exact conditions for freeing the soul feeders? Do the soul infused globes NEED to be smashed in their presence, or will the players destroying or dismantling the globes in the other room suffice?

Speaking of, does dismantling a globe release the soul inside as though it were demolished? I'd have to think so.


Also wrapping up the farm level, with the Nilith, Drakauthix, and Drow encounters left.

How have groups fared against Ravirex and does anyone have any suggestions for making that encounter *memorable*?

I was thinking of including small pools of acid that PCs have to avoid, and other obstacles/vantage points that the dragon can use against the PCs, but any suggestions are appreciated.

Horizon Hunters

goodkinghadrian wrote:
Lozardyn is mentioned a few times in chapter two, but I don't see anything that actually says what it is. I gather it's a nearby drow city?

Did you ever get an answer for this?


My party just had it rough with the clay golem. Clay golems are bad enough on their own but the combo of Cursed Wounds and a Graveknight's ability to counter all healing spells is N A S T Y.

The Summoner's been captured, and he was carrying (foolishly) all 3 fulcrum lenses, but his eidolon has 2 of them. So Caliddo can't kill him, the baddies need those back!

My players also can't seem to figure out what they're supposed to do with the lenses. I outright told them at one point, since they have the Whispering Reeds, but they've already forgotten. They are refusing to invest the lenses and are super scared of them.

Doppelgamer wrote:
How have groups fared against Ravirex and does anyone have any suggestions for making that encounter *memorable*?

I'm also a little sad that the obligatory dragon is kind of just shoved in a corner and knows he isn't the baddest thing on the block. My players only encountered him once they had cleared most of the level, at which point he felt confident enough to venture out to the lake. He made the mistake of demanding tribute from the adventuring party and they bullied him!

I changed Ravirex's lair into 10ft deep of swamp water, with only a few stones and mushrooms to stand on, so he's able to submerge and use hit-and-run attacks. There's no room for flying in his lair, so this replaces that tactic.

After being thoroughly rattled by the party, I'm having him infiltrate Yldaris disguised as a drow to try to figure out where the lenses are. He figures he can pick off the party one at a time if he can separate them. If he gets the lenses, he's powering up to an Umbral dragon.

However, with the Summoner captured and holding the lenses, perhaps Ravirex can help with the rescue attempt now! Funny how that works out.


I am probably wrapping up my game tonight, so I'm just going to run by the seat of my pants here, but what happens if the party "kills" Belcorra before they invest all 3 Fulcrum Lenses into her?

I'm going with the Ebon Fulcrum lens rejuvenates her immediately, because I don't want to deflate the momentum by going "alright, you did too well, come back in 7 to 10 days to try the boss fight again." We'll see if it actually applies.


Thebazilly wrote:

I am probably wrapping up my game tonight, so I'm just going to run by the seat of my pants here, but what happens if the party "kills" Belcorra before they invest all 3 Fulcrum Lenses into her?

I'm going with the Ebon Fulcrum lens rejuvenates her immediately, because I don't want to deflate the momentum by going "alright, you did too well, come back in 7 to 10 days to try the boss fight again." We'll see if it actually applies.

My session is ending tomorrow as my players have only the final fight. This is pretty much how I plan on running it if she dies before they put the lenses in. I might make her rejuvenation take a turn or so to give them a chance to invest a lens in her.


My group is also about to take on Belcorra in the Empty Vault, and I like having the Ebon Lens rejuvenate her continually if necessary until they hit her all three times with the Fulcrum Lattice.

I interpret the Lattice as being able to use the highest lens attack bonus, but that each lens still has to be activated with 2 actions before being "fired". If the attack misses, it has to be re-activated. So there's a minimum of 3 rounds of combat for the group to take her out.

My question is, how many rounds of preparation is reasonable for Belcorra?

I advanced my group to 11th level after the fight with Lady's Whisper and I am going to handwave the "rest and reflection" and just let them head right in to the finale fully restored, so they will have an opportunity to prep as well.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Are Caligni effected by Death Flame from the deaths of other Caligni?

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Metron wrote:
Are Caligni effected by Death Flame from the deaths of other Caligni?

I was wondering this too. I ruled that they aren't affected, otherwise in Caligni society if one random person dies from natural causes in a busy marketplace, you could start a chain reaction of deaths.

One other solution I thought of is maybe they treat their save as one degree better.


Grumpus wrote:
Metron wrote:
Are Caligni effected by Death Flame from the deaths of other Caligni?

I was wondering this too. I ruled that they aren't affected, otherwise in Caligni society if one random person dies from natural causes in a busy marketplace, you could start a chain reaction of deaths.

One other solution I thought of is maybe they treat their save as one degree better.

hah I had this same scenario in my head. Daddy Caligni has a fatal heart attack at the dinner table and the next day his brother comes to check on him and finds nothing but a pile of ashes around the dinner table where he was having dinner with his wife, mother in law, and three kids.


So after digging more, it seems that like the explosive nature of Caligni differs based on level. Like a creature 1 dancer :

“Death Flare (light) When the dancer dies, their body combusts in a flare of white light. All creatures in a 10-foot emanation must succeed at a DC 17 Fortitude save or be dazzled for 1d4 rounds. Calignis that fail this save are also frightened 1. The dancer’s gear and treasure are left in a pile where they died. As this isn’t a magical effect, the light has no effect within magical darkness.”

It doesn’t do damage but it specifically effects other Caligni with an additional effect.

Thus leads me to believe that higher level Caligni like the Stalker do indeed effect other Caligni.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Unless I am reading the Images of Failure and Images of Powerlessness hazards wrong in rooms C11 and C12, they act as a free action, instantly reset and can affect the same creature multiple times on that creature's turn. Shouldn't that mean that they'll fry anybody who steps into their radius instantly?

For example, PC1 steps into the hazard, triggers Images of Failure, repeated DC32 basic Will save for 2d10+10 mental damage as a free action until they are dead or they accept the save condition (lose one skill feat for a week) and no remedy to avoid unless somebody notices the trap before entering the room.

Doesn't that seem really stupidly unfair to anybody else?

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

I think the hazard only does it thing ONCE each time the Trigger is met as a free action. So a PC can only be effected a max of 3 times in a turn if it ends 3 move actions in the area. And theoretically for a party of 4, it could trigger 12 times in a round.
Also note if they stand still and Seek or something else, the Hazard does not trigger, only on MOVE actions that end in the area.

edited to add: I only have the original books, and not the re-issue all-in-one book, so maybe the text changed.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Good question about the text. Were the PDF's for the normal adventure path modules updated to the hardcover editions errata at any time?

But thank you for the clarification, nonetheless!

51 to 95 of 95 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>
Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder Adventure Path / Abomination Vaults / 3 - Eyes of Empty Death (GM Reference) All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Abomination Vaults