What spells are we all hoping for in Secrets of Magic?

[Davido1000]

I want some Pit spells, especially walk the plank!

[The Gleeful Grognard]

More cantrips with a much wider variety.

Blasting spells of each theme (enough to cover each level, even if that includes heightened variants)

More transformation spells (and druid feats to go with them)

Higher versions of magic weapon (although I think magic weapon could do with heightend options as is)

A lot more divine spells, god the divine list is tiny,

[Gaulin]

I'm hoping for more cantrips and more sustain spells, ideally damaging ones for early levels. Mostly to get the most of those few spell slots casters get early game.

[WWHsmackdown]

I'm hoping for accuracy runes for casters. If fighters can get legendary proficiency in top of +3 I think casters can stand to get a +1 and +2 rune at their power slumps. Just the little edge necessary to quite some of the caster players grumblings

[Rushniyamat]

WWHsmackdown wrote:

I'm hoping for accuracy runes for casters. If fighters can get legendary proficiency in top of +3 I think casters can stand to get a +1 and +2 rune at their power slumps. Just the little edge necessary to quite some of the caster players grumblings

The real problem with spell attacks is their progression. The end bonus is quite fine, although I do agrer that a +1 could help a bit.

I would like to see more necromancy and battle field control spells, especially ones that allow versatility with their placement and option to change it mid battle.

Edit: Maybe this thread should be moved to Products?

[Valantrix1]

Any of the Golarion specific spells would be great.

[Salamileg]

I'm hoping for the casting variants to be interesting and easy to implement. I wouldn't mind having an alternative to Vancian casting, assuming that's what these variants are.

[Dinky_Dog]

Definitely more hex cantrips and hexes. Especially around fortune/misfortune.

[The Gleeful Grognard]

WWHsmackdown wrote:

I'm hoping for accuracy runes for casters. If fighters can get legendary proficiency in top of +3 I think casters can stand to get a +1 and +2 rune at their power slumps. Just the little edge necessary to quite some of the caster players grumblings

I wouldn't mind it being attached to their attack roll spells specifically, but I am not sold on boosting save spells with items.

Maybe metamagic options that boost accuracy at the cost of 1 action?

I would prefer blasters get support through class based restrictions though. Stuff that limits versatility in exchange for a little extra accuracy and damage (maybe things like spellcaster stances or heavily restricted schools could be interesting)

Salamileg wrote:

I'm hoping for the casting variants to be interesting and easy to implement. I wouldn't mind having an alternative to Vancian casting, assuming that's what these variants are.

I would love to see non broken spellpoint casting that isn't a variant and comes from the subclass choices.

And I want to see neo-vancian/arcarnist casting come back in class archetypes. So all prepared casters can get access to it.

[Kekkres]

I would like to see scourching ray, just because it's a classic and its absence irks me.

Also as much as I would like it, I dont see no vanceian casting mixing well with leveled spells.

[Steelbro300]

A whole lot more variable action spells! I don't even know what they could be, but more stuff like Heal and Harm would be amazing.

And not exactly spells, but feat lines for the wizards who are specializing in schools. I can't believe there aren't any yet. Say, an equivalent to Selective Energy for Evokers, or more support for Conjurors who are summoning creatures beyond just their focus spell.

[John R.]

Contagion (or various disease spells) that is viable for PC use.

[Themetricsystem]

They said they couldn't fit it in the releases that went out so far, but a book that's ALL about cool magic stuff, you bet this bad boy deserves his day in print.

Dinosaur Fort wrote:

Dinosaur Fort Spell 10

Conjuration
Traditions primal
Cast 10 minutes (material, somatic, verbal)
Range 500 feet
Duration 24 hours (see text)

You conjure a primeval fort with walls of sharpened wood adorned with dinosaur skin and teeth, up to 300 feet on a side. Each of the four quadrants of the fort is guarded by a tyrannosaurus (see Bestiary). While the tyrannosauruses won’t cross into the others’ territories, their reach allows them to simultaneously attack an intruder near the center of the fort. The tyrannosauruses leave you and anyone you introduce to them alone but treat anyone else they find in the fort as intruders and prospective snacks. When you prepare spells, you can choose not to recover the spell slot you used to cast this spell. If you do, the fort remains for another 24 hours.

The fort must be created on a plot of land free of other structures. It adapts to the natural terrain, adopting the structural requirements for being built there. The fort adjusts around small features such as ponds or spires of rock, but can’t be created on water or other nonsolid surfaces. If created on snow, sand dunes, or other soft surfaces with a solid surface underneath, the foundation reaches the solid ground. If created on a solid but unstable surface, such as a swamp or an area plagued by tremors, there’s a 10% chance each day the fort begins to sink or collapse.

The fort doesn’t harm creatures within the area when it appears, and it can’t be created within a crowd or in a densely populated area. Any creature inadvertently caught inside the fort when the spell is cast ends up unharmed inside the complete fort and always has a clear path of escape.

[Kyrone]

I am mainly looks for the incarnate spells, and other new types of spells.

Having like 10 flavors of Bahamut would be ideal lol.

And btw the accuracy booster will not happen, it was said that if said thing was to exist it would be in the CRB.

[Gaulin]

I also agree on anything to make playing a witch just a little bit more appealing to play. Maybe a feat that allows another cantrip hex, or more cantrip hexes in general. Something unique to rival a bard in support or debuffing without stepping on their toes too much.

[CaffeinatedNinja]

I want some alternative focus spells for sorcerers as their lvl 1 spell. A lot of those abilities are flat out useless which is annoying. How about a draconic sorcerer gets "You may choose one of the following focus abilities as your starting bloodline power. Dragon Claws, Whatever, or Whatever"

And please make some of the options generally useful focus spells, niche focus spells should not be a lvl 1 mandatory pick.

[Charon Onozuka]

More variable-action spells.
More cantrips in general.
More focus spells for various classes.

Support for school specialist wizards. They really need some love, and if they don't get it in the magic-focused book I'll be highly disappointed.

Hexes/Witch Patrons. Witch was my favorite class in PF1, but the more I look at the PF2 version the less excited I get. If class archetypes come about - I'd love to see something that got rid of the extra familiar abilities in exchange for something, because "familiar-master" was never the focus I wanted for the class.

[TheGoofyGE3K]

A version of Battering Blast, perhaps dependent on actions spent for balls of force and knockbackability

[Albatoonoe]

I want the return of Bigby's hand spells. They are perfect for the heightening system.

Also, Bone Shaker is one of my favorite spells.

[Ravingdork]

I'm a huge fan of what I like to call "body horror spells"--essentially spells that mutilate and maim your foes, while leaving survivors blanching with horror and disgust.

Horror Adventures from 1st Edition Pathfinder released several of these, but there are several from other sources as well. I've listed several examples below.

• Bloodbath
  
• Blood Boil
  
• Boiling Blood
  
• Boneshaker
  
• Boneshatter
  
• Canopic Conversion
  
• Death Clutch
  
• Excruciating Deformation
  
• Explode Head
  
• Lipstitch
  
• Rend Body
  
• Slough
  
• Transmute Blood to Acid
  
• Wither Limb

Valantrix1 wrote:

Any of the Golarion specific spells would be great.

Yeah, like blood money! XD

[Gisher]

Ravingdork wrote:

Valantrix1 wrote:

Any of the Golarion specific spells would be great.

Yeah, like blood money! XD

LOL!

[Perpdepog]

Gisher wrote:

Ravingdork wrote:

Valantrix1 wrote:

Any of the Golarion specific spells would be great.

Yeah, like blood money! XD

LOL!

I'm glad they made that joke. I couldn't bring myself to do it.

[roquepo]

Two favourites of mine are Icy Prison and Ice Crystal Teleport from 1st ed, hope we at least get one of those back.

[Kekkres]

Also not a spell but I would love a generic bladebound/ black blade dedication, as blade bound magus was, hands down my favorite archetype from pf1. Roleplaying both myself and my sword was a blast!

[Gaulin]

One small thing I forgot to say I hope for is crossblooded sorcerer. Just the ability to have feats to spend on for the features of a single other bloodline, like how druids can take order explorer etc.

[rainzax]

My top 5

1) More Cantrips generally
2) Alternative School Spells (Wizard)
3) Alternative Domain Spells (Cleric)
4) More (◆), (↺), (◇), or variable Spells generally
5) More Spells not using Spell Attack / DC generally

[Salamileg]

Thinking about it, I'd like to see more elemental spells that aren't blasts. Stuff like Air Bubble, Wall of Ice, and Aqueous Orb.

[Loreguard]

First I'd like Rituals that take less than a day to perform. If necessary, call them something other than rituals to distinguish them. They could be Ceremonies, Rite, Liturgies, Favors, Boons (ok, that term already is in use for Divine) or Tokens. Casting times I would imagine in the range of 10 minutes to a couple hours for most examples. Balanced with cost for the ritual's formula and likely material components to complete them.

They like rituals, would be usable by non-magic users, but potentially might have interactions to make casters have an advantage to utilizing these, but not invalidating non-caster. (idea being, some Rites could have an option to spend a focus point, or perhaps to spend a spell slot to change the casting time from 1 hour to 10 minutes, as an example)

Otherwise, I'd love to see some alternate Focus spells for many of the various class choices, across the board. New cantrips (potentially including higher level ones opening up options of different ubiquitous magic, but only showing up at higher levels of play where it can be sustained.)

I would welcome more of the variable casting length spells, as well reaction and single action spells would also be really nice. Perhaps a new single-action type casting spell that can't be paired with any other 2-action spell during a round. Basically a magic specific version of flourish, that makes this type of single action spells incompatible with other similar ones, or normal two-three action spells, but would not prevent use of the other single-action spells or reaction spells. Perhaps an Intense trait. (which by default is implicit on any two or three action spell that is not listed specifically as non-intense) One action spells can be however be tagged with Intense, and that would mean that they can't be cast with any other Intense spell in the same turn. Even a reaction could potentially be be marked Intense, which would mean it couldn't be used if you'd cast an Intense spell the prior round. This is not entirely my idea originally, others specifically suggested using the flourish trait on two and three action spells to be able to lower their action count. I'd rather keep things more as they are, but open up new opportunities for something between a one-action spell and a two action spell. Quickened Casting metamagic feat would remove the Intense trait from the spellcasting it is modifying.

Not truly spells, but others have mentioned it, so I'll add here at the end. Hope that the casting variations are balanced, and I'd like to see a less Vancian casting option for prepared casters, but one that will hopefully not simply given them the best of both prepared/spontaneous worlds like most proposals I've seen. My hope is that a non-Vancian wizard could be in the same party with a Vancian wizard, and a more traditional sorcerer, and they would each have advantages/disadvantages over one another. If they offer more drastic changes to spontaneous and prepared casting, (like changing prepared to spontaneous with a prepared listed every day) I hope they still also provide a less drastic version that can coexist with Vancian classes somewhat reasonably.

[Gisher]

Salamileg wrote:

Thinking about it, I'd like to see more elemental spells that aren't blasts. Stuff like Air Bubble, Wall of Ice, and Aqueous Orb.

Definitely. Enough elemental spells for staves of Frost, Lightning, etc.

[dmerceless]

Loreguard wrote:

Otherwise, I'd love to see some alternate Focus spells for many of the various class choices, across the board. New cantrips (potentially including higher level ones opening up options of different ubiquitous magic, but only showing up at higher levels of play where it can be sustained.)

This. Very much this. Would be really nice to have alternatives to some of the initial focus spells that are mandatory but currently very underwhelming or super niche (e.g. Glutton's Jaw, a spell that works better on MCs than on actual Sorcerers). It doesn't feel good to have something like that as your only option to use a resource that recharges with a 10 minute rest.

[AnimatedPaper]

Cantrips! Lots and lots of cantrips, of various utility, action cost, and traits.

Maybe some more rituals, including specifically low level ones.

[Deriven Firelion]

Improved implementation of summoning spells. I want to be able to summon creatures that are useful in boss battle encounters.

Better attack roll spells useable with [i]true strike/i].

[Inquisitive Tiefling]

I'd like to see spells like Storm Step, Damnation Stride, and Bladed Dash. Spells that feel a bit more dynamic in doing their thing rather than just standing there throwing out magic. But, maybe I've just been playing too much Wizard of Legend lately.

I'd also like to see Scorching Ray make a return, along with the various attribute buff spells, if only because they're classics and really cool. And I too would like to see something to make spell attacks a bit more... maybe not simply stronger, but more relevant? I mean hell, I made a thread about the Sorcerer feat Split Shot, and as one comment pointed out there are exactly seven spells that work with it across all four traditions.

I'd like to see some means of buffing or improving spell attacks (without having to resort to "fixer" feats), if just to expand on the options that casters have for how they build. I know they're supposed to fall short in single-target DPS compared to martials, but still.

[UnArcaneElection]

Loreguard wrote:

{. . .}

Perhaps an Intense trait. (which by default is implicit on any two or three action spell that is not listed specifically as non-intense) One action spells can be however be tagged with Intense, and that would mean that they can't be cast with any other Intense spell in the same turn. Even a reaction could potentially be be marked Intense, which would mean it couldn't be used if you'd cast an Intense spell the prior round. This is not entirely my idea originally, others specifically suggested using the flourish trait on two and three action spells to be able to lower their action count. {. . .}

What about a spellcaster feat (having the prerequisite of Focus Pool and the otherwise bad Quickened Casting) that lets you shorten the casting time of a normal spell (that you could have used with the normal version of Quickened Casting) in return for spending a Focus Point and adding the Flourish trait to it? (Maybe if the spell is at least 4 levels below the highest level you can cast, then it doesn't gain the Flourish traint after all.)

[Set]

Salamileg wrote:

Thinking about it, I'd like to see more elemental spells that aren't blasts. Stuff like Air Bubble, Wall of Ice, and Aqueous Orb.

More air, earth and water spells, definitely. Whenever there's a list, it seems like there's fifty fire spells, and ten for each of the other elements. :)

[roquepo]

I forgot about Ride the Lightning.

It's too metal to be left out.

Deriven Firelion wrote:

Improved implementation of summoning spells. I want to be able to summon creatures that are useful in boss battle encounters.

They mentioned something about a new type of spell with the incarnate trait here, maybe this is what you are looking for.

[Davido1000]

Deriven Firelion wrote:

Improved implementation of summoning spells. I want to be able to summon creatures that are useful in boss battle encounters.

Better attack roll spells useable with [i]true strike/i].

Incarnate spells are probably the closest we will get to that. But i would love to see a spell that cuts close to the summoner/eidolon where you can summon an on level to you monster but with the severe drawback of it being lifelinked to you or it takes all your actions to control it.

[Nicolas Paradise]

My biggest hope is for un-nerfing the transmutation list and giving them a cantrip that isn't sigil.

[Alchemic_Genius]

My wishlist:

-more transmutation cantrips
-mone love for non fire elements for bkasting
-heighting options for magic weapon/fang
-the pit spells
-telekinetic charge and similar support magic that interacts with the party
-explosive runes
-lower level spells to summon aberrations and outsiders; like for real, theres not much reason to gate off demon clerics for pulling out imps or good clerics from summoning like a lyrakien.

I hope to see a lot of the incarnate spells, those look really cool

[Staffan Johansson]

Davido1000 wrote:

Incarnate spells are probably the closest we will get to that. But i would love to see a spell that cuts close to the summoner/eidolon where you can summon an on level to you monster but with the severe drawback of it being lifelinked to you or it takes all your actions to control it.

Isn't that basically a battle form spell? Or at least very, very close to it, except that the summon version makes you vulnerable in two places at once?

[Staffan Johansson]

Loreguard wrote:

First I'd like Rituals that take less than a day to perform. If necessary, call them something other than rituals to distinguish them. They could be Ceremonies, Rite, Liturgies, Favors, Boons (ok, that term already is in use for Divine) or Tokens. Casting times I would imagine in the range of 10 minutes to a couple hours for most examples. Balanced with cost for the ritual's formula and likely material components to complete them.

I very much agree on rituals. 4e gets a lot of flack, but I think the way they handled rituals were spot on, and something I think both 5e and PF2 missed the boat on. Heck, even 13th Age, which otherwise is very much an improvement on 4e, gets rituals wrong.

For those unfamiliar, almost all non-combat magic (including long-term condition relief) in 4e was turned into a ritual. This covers both relatively simple things like Animal Messenger, Knock, or Water Breathing, or more powerful things like Remove Affliction (diseases/curses), Linked Portal (the first of a series of long-distance teleport rituals), or Consult Mystic Sages (the equivalent of Contact Other Plane). Rituals only needed the Ritual Caster feat, which some classes got for free (in the core, clerics and wizards did, but not warlocks or paladins), but it was open to everyone.

Rituals usually required a skill check (Nature, Religion, Arcana, or Heal), took time to cast (10 minutes or more), and cost money both to acquire and cast. This also solved the problem of "Why bring a rogue when the wizard can cast Knock?" — because Knock costs 10 minutes and 35 gp to cast, plus a healing surge. This makes rituals a fallback option, instead of the first thing you try.

It also meant no-one had to play a cleric to fix long-term problems like poison and curses — the wizard can do that just as well, or why not the fighter who takes the ritual casting feat?

When I first learned that PF2 would have rituals, I had high hopes for them, but those were somewhat quashed when I realized they were just more complicated spells that took days or more to cast, and that things like Speak with Animals would still need spell slots.

[AnimatedPaper]

Full and total agreement Staffan. I genuinely don't see why they didn't go that route. And you could tell a lot of us had the same thought; the forum wide "oh" that happened when we found out the healer barbarian was a multiclass character showed how many of us had jumped to the wrong conclusion. It would make the limited slots make a lot more sense if utility spells were generally rituals, even some that could be cast relatively quickly.

It's not too late! They can ritualize spells even now! Heck they can even just make it a template so that you can turn any spell into a ritual cast version, which would really open up some options, and justify giving classes like wizards and witches general buffs.

[Davido1000]

Staffan Johansson wrote:

Davido1000 wrote:

Incarnate spells are probably the closest we will get to that. But i would love to see a spell that cuts close to the summoner/eidolon where you can summon an on level to you monster but with the severe drawback of it being lifelinked to you or it takes all your actions to control it.

Isn't that basically a battle form spell? Or at least very, very close to it, except that the summon version makes you vulnerable in two places at once?

You seem to be missing the "or" in what i said.

If not, then summoning a demon of the same level as you but taking all your actions to keep it under control or having your hp linked to it while you spend the usual 1 sustain action seem like a fair trade and doesnt sound much like a battle form to me.

[Travelling Sasha]

The Create Pit spells have already been mentioned, though likewise I suspect that they'd need to be recontextualized in a way that might make them feel not that cool. Still, here's hoping!

Telekinectic charge was another really fun one. It was meaningful and reliable — and aren't those the best spells in 2E?

Hmm, what else, what else... Well, stone call was pretty cool. Though transforming the whole terrain into difficult terrain with a low level spell might be a little too much for the current paradigm.

And they aren't spells, but I'm really hoping for some more fun and interesting metamagic feats. I mean, don't get me wrong: Reach Spell is great, and surprisingly useful. But... I dunno. I find most of them lacking. Well, honestly I think that all spellcaster's class feats could use some juice, though especially metamagic feats. Hopefully we will be getting some cool stuff!

[Staffan Johansson]

Davido1000 wrote:

Staffan Johansson wrote:

Davido1000 wrote:

Incarnate spells are probably the closest we will get to that. But i would love to see a spell that cuts close to the summoner/eidolon where you can summon an on level to you monster but with the severe drawback of it being lifelinked to you or it takes all your actions to control it.

Isn't that basically a battle form spell? Or at least very, very close to it, except that the summon version makes you vulnerable in two places at once?

You seem to be missing the "or" in what i said.

If not, then summoning a demon of the same level as you but taking all your actions to keep it under control or having your hp linked to it while you spend the usual 1 sustain action seem like a fair trade and doesnt sound much like a battle form to me.

Hmm, OK, I see your point there. Still, I feel that battle forms would pretty much create a ceiling for how powerful such a summon could be.

I also think they'd make a good model conceptually: the spell would summon a creature with stats specified by the spell. The normal summons get to be more flexible because the creatures summoned aren't all that powerful, and you have some safeguards against the worst shenanigans (no spellcasting higher than the summon, for example), but if you're going to summon stronger creatures you need to be a little stricter on that front.

[Old_Man_Robot]

Magic, in general, needs to be unchained to a decent degree in this system.

I'll welcome anything that allows casters to be more dynamic.

[Darksol the Painbringer]

Kekkres wrote:

I would like to see scourching ray, just because it's a classic and its absence irks me.

Here's a stand-in in case Paizo doesn't deliver. Adjust it as you see fit.

[Davido1000]

Staffan Johansson wrote:

Hmm, OK, I see your point there. Still, I feel that battle forms would pretty much create a ceiling for how powerful such a summon could be.

I also think they'd make a good model conceptually: the spell would summon a creature with stats specified by the spell. The normal summons get to be more flexible because the creatures summoned aren't all that powerful, and you have some safeguards against the worst shenanigans (no spellcasting higher than the summon, for example), but if you're going to summon stronger creatures you need to be a little stricter on that front.

Oh definitely, I was just throwing out conceptual ideas. Perhaps you can build the summon somewhat like the summoner builds its eidolon.

[UnArcaneElection]

roquepo wrote:

{. . .}

They mentioned something about a new type of spell with the incarnate trait here, maybe this is what you are looking for.

Well, I hadn't been following that thread for a long time, but now that you pointed me to it, and seeing that their example of an Incarnate Spell is Summon Vengeful Dead, suddenly I have this premonition of the counterpart Incarnate spell, Summon Grateful Dead . . . .

[Gortle]

A summon spell that has offensive combat value.