(CoCT) Can The Tall Knife defeat Troll and Shadow?


Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion


Hi, our Kyra has acquired "The Tall Knife" weapon and is uncertain about how some encounters would be resolved if the encountered monsters requires specific traits to defeat. We've tried reading the Encountering section in the Core Rulebook but couldn't figure out the answer to these cases.

The Tall Knife has 4 traits Object, Guillotine, Slashing, 2-Handed, and the power:
• Instead of your first exploration of your turn, discard to examine the top # cards of your location. Encounter 1 non-villain monster you find; it is defeated. If you do not find a non-villain monster, reload this card instead. Then shuffle all remaining examined cards into the location and end your turn.

We think that The Tall Knife alone won't be able to defeat some monsters and would need support like the two examples below.

1. Troll has this power:
• If neither check to defeat has either the Acid or Fire trait, this monster is undefeated; you may reload it into its location.

Then can Kyra play "Heat Metal" to add the Fire trait to this combat check to defeat Troll?

2. Shadow has the Undead trait and this power:
• If the check to defeat does not have the Magic trait, this monster is undefeated.

Then can Kyra use her power "On a local check against an Outsider or Undead bane, add 1d4 and the Magic trait." to defeat Shadow?

Thank you in advance for reading my questions.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Tall Knife works by itself because of the following rule:

Rulebook p9 wrote:
If a power allows you to automatically defeat or acquire a card, you may use it instead of attempting the check. Doing so counts as succeeding at all checks and requirements to defeat or acquire the card.

Because Tall Knife says "it is defeated" that short-circuits all of the checks and requirements to defeat. Per the above-quoted rule, you succeeded at the check to defeat Troll and that successful check had the Acid and/or Fire traits.

Kyra cannot play Heat Metal nor use her character power in conjunction with playing Tall Knife because Kyra is never making any checks when a card is automatically defeated.


@skizzers
Ah, I understand now, so this type of power actually bypasses all those trait requirements too.
Thank you for your helpful reply.

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