Can we put the Sling back in GunSlinger?


Gunslinger Class

1 to 50 of 51 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>
Sovereign Court

21 people marked this as a favorite.

This class runs on crossbows (most of which are simple weapons with Reload > 0) and guns, all of which have Reload 1. It's lining up to be the class for Reload weapons, basically.

Can we have some of this love for the sling too?

The sling is one of the classic weapons. It's both the stereotypical halfling weapon as well as the David and Goliath iconic weapon. They've had plenty of historical use.

Mechanically, they add some variety to "most ranged weapons are just bows or crossbows - all of them piercing weapons". For a switch-hitter they have the potential to leverage your Strength a bit.

But they've not gotten all that much love. Ranger feats tend to fixate on Reload 0 weapons or specifically crossbows. With the sped-up Returning rune, thrown weapons are pretty nice too.

But now we're playtesting this new class, and almost all of the feats that would work with both a crossbow and a gun, could make just as much sense with a sling. Now's the time to make the sling stop being the red-headed stepchild weapon.

Horizon Hunters

2 people marked this as a favorite.

I think this is a great point.

Sovereign Court

3 people marked this as a favorite.

So let's be constructive and outline some ways slings could get love.

- Any ability that applies to crossbows and guns could usually apply to slings too. This goes for the proficiencies and feats both.
- Assuming something is done to make sword-and-gun more manageable for reloading, slings would benefit from that too.

But they could also get some cool things of their own:
- Ricochet attacks (might also work for guns, but probably not crossbows).
- Delivering bombs or holy water by sling. Possibly with a daily allowance of bombs if you pay a few feats.
- Switch-hitting tricks with halfling sling staffs used as both melee and ranged weapons. (This might overlap with muskets with bayonets. One 2H ranged/melee combo weapon instead of something in each hand.)
- Maybe using slings to trip people in melee?
- Arcing slings, to launch sling bullets over (soft) cover to hit a backline?


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I agree, go ahead and put slings in.

I'd also take a pass on feats and make them all as permissive as is logical for what weapon types work. I see no real reason we can't have Alchemical Shot work for crossbows (and slings), even if the exact delivery mechanism varies, for instance.


Ascalaphus wrote:
Now's the time to make the sling stop being the red-headed stepchild weapon.

LOL What to know what gets less love than the sling? the slingstaff!!!


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I am 110% on board with adding slings and improving weapon permissiveness as much as is reasonable.

Slings are actually a fantastic weapon, and slingstaffs are even more so. They're quicker to reload than a crossbow. Historically, they could out distance bows and provide kinetic energy close to modern firearms.


Don't forget that Slings now share their Critical Specialization with firearms. This makes the sling even worse on balance, as before they had one of the better crit specs out there.

Now they share it with weapons that have Fatal or Scatter, which isn't too fair to the sling imo.

Sovereign Court

1 person marked this as a favorite.

One of the prospects I like if slings got folded in, and assuming the two-weapon reloading issue got cleaned up, is that slings are Propulsive. Propulsive isn't a crazy amount of damage but it does give you a little extra boost for having strength, which evens out with the slightly bigger damage die of crossbows and guns having fatal. But it also pays off for the melee side of things.

You'd still want a Finesse melee weapon because you're probably going to be favoring Dexterity, but since you're not a Thief Rogue you're not getting Dex to damage so you'll like some Strength.

You might even go the other way and lean heavily on Strength, and trust that the fighter-grade proficiency in Slings keeps you reasonably accurate at range.

Given how much the idea of being a switch hitter or even half/half hitter is being signaled in this class, I think slings have a nice contribution to make.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Slingslinger?

Or multi-class with bard and get a slingsinger?

Sovereign Court

Well the proposed "Deadeye" name would work fine for it..

I suppose a Sling Ace feat would have to work a little different from Gun or Crossbow Ace feat though, because Titan Slinger already exists and you can't stack dice size increases.


Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories, Pawns, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Also agree. Guns are great, but more options for other settings and the lowly sling/sling staff would be great alongside the crossbow.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Staffan Johansson wrote:

Slingslinger?

Or multi-class with bard and get a slingsinger?

Go with the Drifter Way, and you could be the Sling Singing Slasher.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Ascalaphus wrote:

Well the proposed "Deadeye" name would work fine for it..

I suppose a Sling Ace feat would have to work a little different from Gun or Crossbow Ace feat though, because Titan Slinger already exists and you can't stack dice size increases.

At this point it'd probably be better to just consolidate the three feats into one since they all do basically the same thing for the same category of weapon (ranged weapons you have to reload).

Sovereign Court

Arachnofiend wrote:
Ascalaphus wrote:

Well the proposed "Deadeye" name would work fine for it..

I suppose a Sling Ace feat would have to work a little different from Gun or Crossbow Ace feat though, because Titan Slinger already exists and you can't stack dice size increases.

At this point it'd probably be better to just consolidate the three feats into one since they all do basically the same thing for the same category of weapon (ranged weapons you have to reload).

Well Crossbow Ace already exists for rangers, and increases die size. If you ported that over to slings without changing, then it wouldn't work with Titan Slinger which would be a little bit sad. Because I think a design goal for slingslingers (there I said it) should be that they work neatly for halflings.

Dark Archive

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I think I agree that would be nice if all current reload based weapons would get x-slinger love yeah :D


3 people marked this as a favorite.

Count me in for thinking Gunslinger should be able to effectively use any reload weapons.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Immediately makes me hope for gunblades

Sovereign Court

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Gunblades seem like a reasonable thing on Golarion. Even in real life people tried out lots of wacky weapon designs, and it's just the effective ones that survived and that we consider normal.

But in a world with zombie hordes, wanting slashing options is pretty pragmatic.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber
Ascalaphus wrote:
Arachnofiend wrote:
Ascalaphus wrote:

Well the proposed "Deadeye" name would work fine for it..

I suppose a Sling Ace feat would have to work a little different from Gun or Crossbow Ace feat though, because Titan Slinger already exists and you can't stack dice size increases.

At this point it'd probably be better to just consolidate the three feats into one since they all do basically the same thing for the same category of weapon (ranged weapons you have to reload).
Well Crossbow Ace already exists for rangers, and increases die size. If you ported that over to slings without changing, then it wouldn't work with Titan Slinger which would be a little bit sad. Because I think a design goal for slingslingers (there I said it) should be that they work neatly for halflings.

I'm not sure there's as much overlap as you're assuming. Halfling Sling Staffs and Bolas are both martial weapons (and my read is that they'd remain martial weapons for the purposes of a Sling Ace feat), so their damage die would not be increased by an Ace feat. Slings would overlap, but Titan Slinger only works against certain foes; Ace would get the buff under most circumstances.

Scarab Sages

3 people marked this as a favorite.

I agree that adding slings into the class would be a great way to make that weapon more relevant past being a 1st level free ranged weapon. But also...

graystone wrote:
Ascalaphus wrote:
Now's the time to make the sling stop being the red-headed stepchild weapon.
LOL What to know what gets less love than the sling? the slingstaff!!!

Can we get some clarification somewhere that feats that work with slings work with the slingstaff? Right now it's still unclear whether or not Titan Slinger and things like it work with the sling staff, depending on whether or not you read the reference to slings as being the specific weapon or the slings weapon group.

I'd happily make a Halfling slingstaff wielding Slingslinger if I knew everything worked.

Sovereign Court

2 people marked this as a favorite.

Yeah, if we could fold in a clarification on the slingstaff in that'd be swell.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

Fair enough. I did read it as pertaining to the whole weapon group, as that made sense from a crunch and fluff perspective, but I can see how you might read it the opposite.

Scarab Sages

2 people marked this as a favorite.

It can be read either way, which leaves it in table variation territory for things like PFS. But mainly I wanted to show support for having it included in the abilities of the class, as clarification or no clarification, I think having more sling options is a good thing.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

Apologies on my thread, I guess I was using the general page to see new posts, so managed to miss this thread completely. I'm happy to see others had the same sort of idea.

Several of the admittedly anime seeming feats they gunslingers have wouldn't be impossible to imagine being functional with slings and a pseudo-magical centrifugal force allowing them to leap farther, etc. with releasing a spinning bullet from their sling.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I'd like to piggyback the atlatl onto this. :)

Always been fascinated with them since the early Drow used them in one of their first illustrations.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Every time I read this thread title I just imagine a sling but inside the sling is a gun instead of a rock or metal ball.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber
Squiggit wrote:
Every time I read this thread title I just imagine a sling but inside the sling is a gun instead of a rock or metal ball.

You should know I imagined this being said by Eartha Kitt as Yzma.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Squiggit wrote:
Every time I read this thread title I just imagine a sling but inside the sling is a gun instead of a rock or metal ball.

But is the gun loaded in the sling itself loaded? ;)

Dark Archive

I couldn't agree more. I don't have much to add that others haven't already, but would love the Sling to be added to the weapons for which the Gunslinger uses and gets bonuses to. Seems like it would be an easy add.

Sovereign Court

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Castilliano wrote:

I'd like to piggyback the atlatl onto this. :)

Always been fascinated with them since the early Drow used them in one of their first illustrations.

Oh yeah that'd be interesting too. I'd say that one also fits in the class of "fussy" reload weapons too :)


Totally putting down the recommendation that slings be included in my playtest docs.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Ascalaphus wrote:
I suppose a Sling Ace feat would have to work a little different from Gun or Crossbow Ace feat though, because Titan Slinger already exists and you can't stack dice size increases.

I can't see why it should work differently at all. We've got Crossbow Ace and Deadly Simplicity landing in the same territory, and they don't stack either.

I'm pretty sure not being able to stack die size increases is intentional..


2 people marked this as a favorite.
graystone wrote:
Squiggit wrote:
Every time I read this thread title I just imagine a sling but inside the sling is a gun instead of a rock or metal ball.
But is the gun loaded in the sling itself loaded? ;)

Of course it is. See, what you do is load a pistol, and then use a sling to propel the pistol. The pistol then hits a surface somewhere, and shoots some coward who was hiding behind cover. Elementary.


I’m starting to really want gunslinger to be the ranged weapon master especially with reloading weapons. Would love to make a slinging master. They’ll be the opposite end of the spectrum of Barbarians/Swashbucklers when it comes to the range they fight which is neat


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I am no joke excited to play a small town shepherd boy who walks around with a sling and a hook and a dog and a smile on his face, but if you f$#@ with him you best be ready to die.

Sovereign Court

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Staffan Johansson wrote:
graystone wrote:
Squiggit wrote:
Every time I read this thread title I just imagine a sling but inside the sling is a gun instead of a rock or metal ball.
But is the gun loaded in the sling itself loaded? ;)
Of course it is. See, what you do is load a pistol, and then use a sling to propel the pistol. The pistol then hits a surface somewhere, and shoots some coward who was hiding behind cover. Elementary.

If the gun afterwards bounces back into your hand that sounds a lot like the Drifter level 9 ability :P


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Ascalaphus wrote:
Staffan Johansson wrote:
graystone wrote:
Squiggit wrote:
Every time I read this thread title I just imagine a sling but inside the sling is a gun instead of a rock or metal ball.
But is the gun loaded in the sling itself loaded? ;)
Of course it is. See, what you do is load a pistol, and then use a sling to propel the pistol. The pistol then hits a surface somewhere, and shoots some coward who was hiding behind cover. Elementary.
If the gun afterwards bounces back into your hand that sounds a lot like the Drifter level 9 ability :P

But it manages to make more sense! ;)


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

The problem with the sling for this class, and all of its flavor, is that the sling is not really weapon you load and then walk around ready to fire at the pull of a trigger. Mechanically it feels that way in PF2, but it is such a kinetic weapon that a lot of the feats and abilities of the class are going to feel completely off. You aren't going to be hiding in thick underbrush with a sling ready to take out a target at just the right moment. The way of the drifter and Pistolero really requires walking around with a loaded weapon or two as well. dual sling wielding is a little hard for most people to wrap their heads around.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Unicore wrote:
The problem with the sling for this class, and all of its flavor, is that the sling is not really weapon you load and then walk around ready to fire at the pull of a trigger. Mechanically it feels that way in PF2, but it is such a kinetic weapon that a lot of the feats and abilities of the class are going to feel completely off. You aren't going to be hiding in thick underbrush with a sling ready to take out a target at just the right moment. The way of the drifter and Pistolero really requires walking around with a loaded weapon or two as well. dual sling wielding is a little hard for most people to wrap their heads around.

I mean, if we can compress what should be a full six rounds of loading a firearm into one action, maybe we can handwave the time to wind up a sling, or assume you start swinging it early?


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

The game already does that, but it is the visual/narrative aspect of the sling that feels like it should be different and worthy of its own thing


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I mean, releasing a bullet from a sling that's already up to speed is pretty dang close to firing a loaded weapon. I wouldn't bend over backwards to restrict the sling from getting cool things the Guns and Crossbows might get because we all know the likelihood of slings getting their own special things that are just as cool is almost negligible.

Sovereign Court

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Unicore wrote:
The problem with the sling for this class, and all of its flavor, is that the sling is not really weapon you load and then walk around ready to fire at the pull of a trigger. Mechanically it feels that way in PF2, but it is such a kinetic weapon that a lot of the feats and abilities of the class are going to feel completely off. You aren't going to be hiding in thick underbrush with a sling ready to take out a target at just the right moment. The way of the drifter and Pistolero really requires walking around with a loaded weapon or two as well. dual sling wielding is a little hard for most people to wrap their heads around.

Eh. From what I make of the guns at this tech level, or a typical crossbow, I also don't think they stay loaded if you hold them upside down. I think you're applying a harsher threshold here to one weapon than to the others.

I don't find double sling wielding super-hard to wrap my hand around - I'd imagine something similar to someone playing with two pois. The leap of imagination is always in the reloading while two-weapon fighting, and that's the same problem for dual crossbows, guns and slings.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

I actually find it easier to imagine someone who has done it enough, to be able to reload a sling using only one hand, or even drawing a sling with a stone/bullet wrapped in it already as a very reasonable skill for a stone-sling ace or the way of the stone and strap.

At rolling initiative you may draw your sling and load it in a single free action. (with Stone and Strap Ace you can draw two slings)

Stone and Strap Ace, a feat, with it you can always load a sling with only one hand which is already holding its sling if the ammo is easily available. I'd be willing to allow slinger to use risky reload with slings would represent dropping the ammunition and losing proper grip on the sling requiring them to regrip it before reloading..

So would a sling slinger option need to be something that might need to be a Class archetype, allowing you to boost the sling's abilities and redefine some of the effects/boosts that are given to firearms to be slightly different. (such as allowing draws at initiative to draw it loaded) Or can gunslingers afford to know how to use sling weapons by default at the start, and just have the pieces needed to enable more slinglike parts be a first level feat, and potentially some other specific higher level feats?

Liberty's Edge

4 people marked this as a favorite.

I haven't had MUCH to say so far about the playtest but I wanted to chime in here to say that I, as a customer, am TOTALLY on board with Sling support with the Gunslinger.

I like the concept so much that at the end of the day I might even look to homebrew to make this work out because the raw IDEA of it is just so perfect so yeah, my 2cp hers is: Make it happen!

The Exchange

5 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Late to the party, but totally in agreement that the sling and slingstaff should be covered under gunslinger.


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Oh, a way to make slings appealing beyond propulsive? Yes, please!

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I was wondering if the Gunslinger's ways should be based on the type of weapon (crossbows, firearms, slings, thrown) rather than your preferred range (the current ways), the latter's deeds becoming Class feats that a Gunslinger could choose according to their preferred tactics.


4 people marked this as a favorite.
The Raven Black wrote:
I was wondering if the Gunslinger's ways should be based on the type of weapon (crossbows, firearms, slings, thrown) rather than your preferred range (the current ways), the latter's deeds becoming Class feats that a Gunslinger could choose according to their preferred tactics.

I'm more in favor of the ways remaining more as they are, rather than being based around your weapon. It leaves more room to stretch a given kind of weapon in new directions.

Sovereign Court

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Perpdepog wrote:
The Raven Black wrote:
I was wondering if the Gunslinger's ways should be based on the type of weapon (crossbows, firearms, slings, thrown) rather than your preferred range (the current ways), the latter's deeds becoming Class feats that a Gunslinger could choose according to their preferred tactics.
I'm more in favor of the ways remaining more as they are, rather than being based around your weapon. It leaves more room to stretch a given kind of weapon in new directions.

Me too - I like that for a given weapon, there'd be more than one way to build with it.

Of course, we don't have to rigidly pick one or the other. One way could be all about encounter distance and another way could be more about weapon type.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

I too am hoping to make a Halfling Sling Staff Gunslinger.
I have some fun concepts for a Halfling Ranger with Titan Slinger, but that's basically the only martial class I can do well with a Sling Staff due to getting Running Reload.

1 to 50 of 51 << first < prev | 1 | 2 | next > last >>
Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder Second Edition / Guns and Gears Playtest / Gunslinger Class / Can we put the Sling back in GunSlinger? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.