Ideas on how to make a boss monster encounter work with just the one monster?


Advice


So yeah I've heard it all before, The turn order is the ultimate killer of single monster boss encounters, I get that its better to have some minions floating about but I just can't get over the idea of wanting to make just one big monster work and not have it end too quickly. Part of me wishes I could just give the monster multiple turns on the turn order but I'm not too sure how balanced that would be, Not to mention I'm not even sure that would solve the problem so I wouldn't want to risk trying to pull something like that. Does anyone have any ideas on just how to make one big baddy in a boss fight work without any sort of minions? Thanks in advance for all the help.

Sovereign Court

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Not as applicable at lower level, but maybe you can extract a few pointers from it.

My favorite fight I GMed was vs a high level party, and a Marilith. Bear in mind that this wasn't actually the boss fight of the module (Moonscar), the boss was a some sort of Antipaladin, maybe undead I forget. Though I did change a few things to make it more interesting for the party because they are decently optimized. This was technically for PFS and since we were trading off GMing through modules we all had an understanding that we could tweak things a little.

In the adventure, you do encounter a Marilith but I don't remember the exact conditions but I think it was something like a big open room and single monster. I noted that earlier in the module some of the treasure was a significant amount of gp worth of mundane weapons and equipment so I decided to modify the encounter. There were also several sections with 200' tall x 10' wide smooth cylinder tunnels that the party has to figure out a way down/up.

So, I decided to start the encounter in one room at the top of one of the tunnels and had the Marilith standing over the 10' wide pit entrance with a Blade Barrier cylinder form to fill the entrance so it looked like she was standing on blades.

Barbarian enters the room first, sees the Marilith and charges. Pseudo- out of initiative at this point because I know something the party doesn't. And the party wants the barbarian to charge anyway. The barbarian immediately rolls his dice to hit and I say "Ok, now roll a Will Save". He's a little confused, but rolls decent but not quite enough, and I declare that his attack has missed. And the Marilith laughs and mocks the barbarian for how weak his attack was.

The rest of the party quickly attempts to attack and receive Will saves of their own, until one of them succeed and realizes that the Marilith is actually a Projected Image. Realization dawns on the barbarian player and loudly exclaims at the Marilith that she is just an illusion and that the party should just ignore her.

"Just an illusion?" The Marilith responds and gestures toward a rack of 15 large sized longswords against the wall. Using Telekinesis she throws the whole bundle at the barbarian and I roll 15 attacks that mostly hit, because barbarian. Oh, did I forget to mention that I also modified her so that she was also a Graveknight and I decided to allow Infuse Weapon and Channel Destruction to apply to the TKed longswords. The barbarian was not happy with 15 attacks of 2d6+1 +4d6 fire heading his way.

After the attacks, I very obviously (as the GM) mark off one of the 4 racks of longswords on the map.

Wizard starts to panic and walls of force and emergency force spheres start flinging around and they soon realize that they need to figure out a way to fight something that is probably at the bottom of the pit (that they can't see how deep it is) through several blade barriers. The plan was once the party got to the bottom to mock them and teleport back to the room above and continue the hit and run, but the Wizard got a lucky Dazing Spell off that the Marilith rolled a 1 to save on.

First morale of the story, a single failed save can end a boss fight. Second, distraction and terrain can make for a memorable fight. Third, a Marilith is generally run as a beatstick since they have a lot of attacks and not a whole lot of spellcasting. However, the fluff is that they are brilliant tacticians and generals and the few spell-likes they do have are actually pretty good for hit and run. Look closely at monster abilities and think of ways of using them that weren't quite intended.


Pretty vague question. Any solo creature that is not grossly overpowered has the potential to be one shotted. Whether by a lucky critical hit, or more likely a spell designed to kill or neutralise a single opponent.

Given that at least 1 roll in 20 is a critical hit or automatic failure you will need a creature that can mitigate as many potential suck or die scenarios as possible.

To make the encounter interesting you will need a creature that has options in its actions and ideally one that can attack multiple opponents. Given there are no other opponents then you definitely need to consider the terrain, prepared traps and battlefield control in general. You should also consider what magic items and buffs the creature would have active.

At a rough guess, you would be looking at a APL+6 creature to make things tense for the campaign finale. But even then, the probability is that the encounter will be anti-climactic due to a (un)lucky roll. To compensate, you should foreshadow the encounter and build tension before the showdown.

Shadow Lodge

One or two extra turns, rolled normally in initiative, can do wonders for single creature encounters.


Dragonborn3 wrote:
One or two extra turns, rolled normally in initiative, can do wonders for single creature encounters.

Well of course it would, it could also be called cheating. If you want 3 sets of attacks then you need 3 creatures and then the challenge rating of each needs to be adjusted downwards to compensate for the greater number.

Shadow Lodge

Hugo Rune wrote:
Dragonborn3 wrote:
One or two extra turns, rolled normally in initiative, can do wonders for single creature encounters.
Well of course it would, it could also be called cheating. If you want 3 sets of attacks then you need 3 creatures and then the challenge rating of each needs to be adjusted downwards to compensate for the greater number.

That is... an interesting perspective. Just another reminder of how many different ways people play the same game. Some GMs might run everything raw, only use published enemies, roll their dice on the table and never fudge rolls. There's other people who think the GM can't cheat, hard stop, the GM sets the rules and if they say this is how it works, then that's how it works. And of course plenty of people somewhere in between.

If you want to do it "legally" there's the agile monster template which gives a creature 2 turns per initiative (from mythic)

I was looking upthread going didn't I respond to this already, then realized yes I did, there's apparently two different copies of this thread.


One thing I did once was take a single monster (a sea drake in this case) and basically stack 3 of them together into one body. And yes, I calculated the cr of all 3 together. 3 heads, each with its own pool of hp and turn in the initiative. One a given head's turn it could only attack with what the base creature has, not the extra heads. All damage dealt goes to one head's hp pool until it hits zero (extra damage doesn't spill over). Then, that head's turn in initiative goes away and the pcs attacks start damaging the next head's hp pool.


I consider the hame rules as nouns and verbs. The nouns are things like creatures, spells, classes, equipment etc. The game mechanics are verbs. I believe that it is ansolutely fine for the GM to make up and introduce new nouns to keep the game fresh. But the verbs need to be agreed and understood between the GM and players for a harmonious table. If the GM suddenly changes an established mechanic then the players will have a right to feel cheated.

If the mythic template is being used then fine, but the CR of base creature needs to reduced to compensate. I like Daarigaaz's solution, it's immediately clear to the players that each head is sn independent entity.


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If you want a monster to not be one-shotted, give it an ability that keeps it alive after it reaches 0 HP that the players and their characters either aren't immediately aware of or isn't able to be learned by a Knowledge check.

For example, make the boss monster a humanoid made up of bees. When the creature is "slain", the bees discorporate. One round later, more bees from a previously unseen location begin streaming in, reforming the creature.

Another way to do this is to set conditions for the monster's destruction the way some video games do. There was an old game called Soul Reaver 2 where you're a vampire with a power to drain life if you impale your enemies with a weapon. Eventually you happen upon a massive, bloated enemy vampire you can't simply impale because he can become incorporeal at will. The only way to damage and ultimately kill this boss is to wait until he rematerializes in his cage, then wait for the monster to start leaving said cage and hit him by dropping the portcullises of the cage on him.

So, translating this to Pathfinder you could have a cold-based creature as the boss monster, then make a very obvious point about how there are several bas reliefs of open-mouthed gargoyle faces, the mouths scorched as if by fire. The PCs can't seem to do any damage to the foe, but when they activate the "flame thrower" traps these weaken the monster so they CAN deal damage or only these traps can defeat the monster.

You might also consider in-fight healing. Lots of players swear that this is useless; after about level 3 there's no way that healing keeps up with damage dealt so using Cure spells or other healing while the battle is still going is a waste of actions.

If however the boss monster has some way of receiving healing without spending an action on it, this can be one way to keep it up and running long term. Fast Healing, Lay on Hands, or Quickened Channel Energy all leap to mind, but the amount of damage healed is very minimal. Combining healing sources in the same round could be advantageous but again, this will waste a single monster's precious action economy.

THIS is where minions come in.

Imagine that your boss is a young dragon against low-level PCs. The fight is challenging but certainly not impossible. But then take and add 3 kobolds, all with 2 levels of the NPC class Adept. This raises the fight by +1 CR so you might be awarding a little extra XP and treasure, but the kobolds themselves are doing NOTHING to attack the PCs.

Instead each kobold has Cure Light Wounds as their level 1 spell for the day and they also have scrolls of the spell as well. Each round, one or two of these casters are casting Cure Light Wounds, handing that to their familiars, and having their familiar dart in and heal the dragon. These are only 1-2d8 worth of healing, but the dragon stays pretty close to full HP for a few rounds unless the party divides their attention to the Diminutive birds that keep flying in, landing on the dragon's back and glowing with power.

You can always just randomly give the monster extra attacks. Instead of one weapon attack or a single Natural weapon, what if this monster also had secondary claws or a secondary stinging tail? What if the boss monster has an Immediate action to spit some kind of small damage Energy attack as a Ranged Touch with a 30' range?

Another thing to think about are ALL of the actions a monster has. Say you have a spell casting monster. Really look at how long those spells last. For example, Obscuring Mist has a 1 Minute/Level duration. Then look at the monster's Perception and Stealth capabilities. Can this monster stealth to a location where they can see the PCs but the PCs cannot see it, then cast this spell to confound the characters? By doing so and then fleeing back to it's original location, this monster may be able to force the PCs to waste actions or even daily resources, weakening the party that much more for when they finally confront the monster.

If your boss monster is actually a BOSS, they will have strategies thought out to place THEM at the greatest advantage to defeating their enemies. In other words, the BOSS monster, not the PCs, should control the battlefield initially. Even a tatzlwyrm at CR 2 and Int 6 is noted as being smart enough to use simple hunter's traps such as covered pits or concealed snares to harass or injure their prey.

When you plan out where your boss monster will be encountered, think about how much time they've been there, what kind of resources they have access to. Consider the monster's defenses. Zombies have DR 5/Slashing, Piercing. Putting a Zombie Lord boss in a room with dozens of swinging hammers that constantly deal 1-4 Bludgeoning damage to everyone in the area might only raise the CR by 1-2 but would mean that the entire party is taking damage inside this area while the Zombie Lord capers about unhindered.

Taking these suggestions to higher levels can make things even more ridiculous. Consider an Adult Black Dragon, CR 11. Looking at this monster, it's already an intelligent and powerful creature with 6 melee attacks along with its breath weapon, but perhaps this isn't enough for you as the GM.

It's likely living in some kind of Swamp environment. Read up on the levels of Cover being submerged in water give even a Large sized creature in this environment. Then consider: this dragon has been alive, at the top of the food chain in this area, for over a century. If this monster's digits are capable of holding and manipulating tools, think about how MANY traps it could have hidden around it's final encounter zone.

This monster ALSO possesses Swim speed of 60. Often swamp lakes and streams interconnect. If these waterways are large enough the dragon can traverse 120' in six seconds, or 60' with a Stealth +20 check modified by the terrain. It can detect magic at will, so for three rounds from a place of Stealth the dragon can hone in on one of the PCs' biggest magic items.

It has dominated the local fauna and possibly intelligent flora for a century. This dragon also has Handle Animal +16 and the ability Speak with Reptiles. Diminutive snakes are a dime a dozen in most swamps. There is NO REASON why the dragon wouldn't have forewarning of the party's presence through it's swamp, and possibly even have eyewitness accounts of the powers and abilities the PCs' possess.

THEN consider that the dragon can throw out 60' radius' worth of Darkness at will. If it can move 60' in Stealth and manage to get to a place where it's got lots of traps laid out to hurt the party without being detected, the dragon can use it's Surprise round to touch the shore and put out 60' of Darkness. While the PCs take a round to deal with that, it can ALSO cast one of it's Obscuring Mist spells for the day. As the darkness lifts, the PCs still can't really see all that well. If they're stupid enough to bunch up, have the dragon use it's breath weapon and flee; if they're spread out, have the dragon try to engage one in melee and drag them into the water. OR, if you as the DM think the players would fall for it, have the dragon assemble a Dancing Lights spell for the PCs to move towards, only to catch them in one of those traps.

Dragons are immune to Paralysis. Leng's Tears is a contact poison that inflicts Paralysis and horrible visions, also dealing 1d2 Wis damage. It would be easy for high-level PCs to beat the DC 18 Fort save, but this is ONE way to weaponize the dragon's defense.

Another would be Spider Vines, carefully cultivated by this dragon for a century so they are more advanced and more deadly than the common Hazard. Again, it might be easy for PCs to save against, say a CR 7 version of this Hazard with a DC 18 Fort save, but even just one of the PCs paralyzed is one less threat the dragon needs to destroy.

And THEN... consider the dragon's fear aura. This causes all monsters of 13 or fewer HD AND it might reveal the dragon's presence, but remember what Yoda said about swamps: they're TEEMING with life. A well timed Frightful Presence exposure COULD cause a mass stampede of wildlife heading STRAIGHT TOWARDS the PCs. The dragon doesn't care about the snakes and boars and other creatures swarming over the characters to escape; it'll spit a line of acid straight through it trying to disintegrate any prone PC it can. Meanwhile the characters have to deal with this onslaught and may even have moral restrictions that force them to do so in a humane way.

Finally... Acid. The monster is IMMUNE to acid. If your PCs are as foolish as mine and wander straight into an adult black dragon's lair with NO energy resist spells against Acid, feel free to have the dragon engage the PCs in an area DRIPPING with the stuff. Literally. Bubbling lye pools, or flasks of acid in the canopy all simultaneously smashed so it's raining a couple D6's of the stuff, and so on.

It is conceivable, if perhaps a bit unlikely, that ALL of the above cause some kind of damage and inconvenience to the party of PCs before they even actually engage the boss in a final battle. Now that they have, battered and scarred, they meet a foe that can easily traverse the terrain, uses any deep water to extreme advantage to it's AC, and can potentially unleash 4d6 +3d8 +66 if using Power Attack on a Full Attack, or a single Vital Strike attack after moving 60' inflicting 6d6 +22... that is, if it's not just hanging back 80' and targeting a single, not-protected-from-Acid PC with a line of the stuff that deals 12d6 damage.

Oh yeah, and there's 12 Kobold Adept 2 minions hiding in the bushes waiting to deliver 1 Bless spell and 11d8 +11 worth of healing to their dragon god in a single round...


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My post above got too deep into the wall o' text territory, but one thing that several folks have mentioned is how a failed save on the part of the monster can end a fight instantaneously. There are a few strategies on this.

1. Monster treasure: if any of the boss' treasure includes Resistance bonuses, perhaps consider the boss wearing this treasure as the fight begins

2. Swapping feats: again, this shores up poor saves

3. Rerolls: increase CR by 1 or 2 as you see fit; give the boss a 1/day reroll of any D20 with the increase

4. Illusions and distractions: from as simple as a low-level boss dressing up a scarecrow in the darkness to high-CR magic using bosses tossing out Simulacrums or Projected Images, this can be a way of absorbing a PC's attack

5. Resistances/Immunities: Fear, energy types, Sleep and Paralysis; there are lots of these you can pick up through spells or CR increases

Another note about minions: you don't have to use them IN the final battle for these creatures to have an effect on the final outcome. Think about it; how often to PCs win fights against their foes because of a timely Haste or Enlarge Person spell? Taking just ONE ROUND to exploit a minion or 2 for buff spells prior to engaging with the PCs could turn the tide in a solo boss' favor.

REALLY don't want to use minions? Fine; take one level in a class that grants a Familiar, then take the needed feats to make the Familiar adept at consistently succeeding at Use Magic Device checks. Now take a significant amount of the boss' treasure and turn it into Consumables that the Familiar can use from the safety of an article of clothing to keep the villain going.

Or, y'know, just make all your bosses either Constructs, Swarms or Undead...


I mostly bring flavor, and less RAW to the table, but depending on your play style and search ability, what about "shells". Similar to what somebody up-thread said about drawing some inspiration from video games. You could basically make one boss that is layers of different creatures and/or ability packages. It's one creature/fig on the board, but each "shell" must be dealt with in turn before you can take out the enemy as a whole.

This could be done literally with a creature (like an evil Russian nesting doll), or through layers of objectives (ie. taking down a lich, and then still needing to find/destroy the phylactery.

There was a creature once in a book I read that each time it died, a new creature was spawned from inside the corpse until all of its magic was spent. You decide how many times or conditions must be met before the beastie is finally put down.


Hmm. A prepared spellcaster? With summon spells as forbidden school? But who has prepared the encounter room, is invisible and flying, has cast some ground control spells like black tentacles, web etc. plus mirror image and displacement?

All tactics can be countered, the question is only: How well does the villain know the party and how well can he prepare against their usual tactics?

If the group made enemies with some powerful "behind the scene" bbegs, they will probably be targeted by "low level" assassins with some nice extra money for preparations.

Most one shot groups prepare well, then buff-scry-teleport. Why shouldn't NPCs do the same? Just put a little bit more preparation into surviving.


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Hugo Rune wrote:
...it could also be called cheating.
Hugo Rune wrote:
I consider the hame rules as nouns and verbs...I believe that it is ansolutely fine for the GM to make up and introduce new nouns to keep the game fresh. But the verbs need to be agreed and understood between the GM and players for a harmonious table. If the GM suddenly changes an established mechanic then the players will have a right to feel cheated.

That sounds like a Session 0 discussion, right there.

I always tell my players that I bring a lot of new stuff to my table, so things won't always be so cut-and-dry as the bog standard ruleset, but that I will strive to be consistent, fair and reasonable.
What really helps me is breaking people out of the video game mindset; look at any given scene as something that is really, actually happening. Forget about the rules for a moment. What do you do?
I swear, it takes AGES to break people of the habit of "I roll Perception!" and into "I look around." But once they're at that point, they're not limited to "I charge and use Power Attack," and they can try "I want to slide down the bannister, cut the chandelier rope and swing up to the balcony."
And once you're in that mindset, you're not so easily thrown by a monster that's so fast it can take multiple turns, or so big that it's parts count as multiple creatures.

To answer the OP, I don't think you really can, within the rules as presented. Traps, terrain and obstacle-like spells like illusions all help, but they're really just the minion in a different incarnation. And that's sort of the point: you want encounters to be dynamic and have layers and facets.

I recently ran a game where the heroes had to confront an evil spirit that had been driving people to madness and murder. When they returned to the tribe with the relics they needed to banish the spirit, the tribe's medicine man ended up raising the village against them using their fear and paranoia. One of the people that fought for the shaman was currently possessed by the spirit. When that became apparent, the spirit manifested and started running around the village, eating people and growing in power until everyone had run off or was killed, and the PC's had to face down the cannibalistic frozen giant zombie spirit monster.
So instead of "minons plus boss," it was "minions plus mini boss with elements of social conflict", then "mini boss plus boss in all-out physical conflict" and then "suped-up boss in a potential TPK". I think it worked pretty well, even though there was really only one major threat at a time.


Melee based monsters will have a difficult time with this. Casters have the ability to harm multiple characters at once so they're better at taking on parties by themselves. They also have defenses based on miss chance, and unlike AC and DR it's not as easy to optimized against.

If you insist on using a melee based monster I'd also give it abilities that allow it to disrupt(apply negative conditions, damage, other bad things) multiple combatants in some ways. In other words it's going to have some abilities that are similar to spells, even if they're not technically spells. As an example if it can make a large part of the ground difficult terrain, or it has a powerful breath weapon.

Another option is to give it ranged attacks, that allow it to play keep-away as long as possible can also help.

I'd also make sure to not completely nerf the player's abilities, just to help the monster.


Trailblazer has a boss monster template.

Lots of reactive abilities, kind of like 4e solo monsters and 5e legendary monsters.


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Terrain...
It's the key to keeping low CR monsters viable at higher levels.
It's also the key to keeping a single monster alive against multiple characters.

No BBEG should ever fight in a big blank room.

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