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First off, bandits don't have to be the 'bad guys'... think privateers on land. Maybe two neighboring kingdoms have an uneasy peace deal and the players have decided to make bandit raids into the 'evil' kingdom to weaken it... or restart the war... or just to profit off an enemy. Maybe they are occasionally (or officially) hired by the local government... putting them somewhere between bandits and spies.
Motivations like that would then also give you hooks for other adventures. If they're out for profit then rumors of treasure should be enough to get them into that dungeon / slaying that monster.
There are a lot of ways you could go with it. Some of the characters could be traditional bandits brought in as experts on the craft and terrain who become noble over time... or principled government agents could find that they've been doing some questionable things and the 'enemy' kingdom isn't really as evil as they've been told.
Same way you'd do a pirate campaign but on land. Magic treasure comes from people sent to hunt down the bandits. As things escalate perhaps the party becomes bandit kings, recruited by an enemy nation that intends to invade the country they're in. Banditry turns to full scale military looting.
A key question for me would be: Why are they bandits? If they were forced into this life, maybe they still want the responsible person to pay.
I'd pit bandits of questionable morality against an oppressive nobility. The local nobles squeeze almost everything out of the population, to support their decadent lifestyle. Common people starve, nobility doesn't care. Unless there are open riots - which are ended with immediate, brute force. Maybe the bandits are survivors from villages that were burnt to the ground.
So what keeps the bandits from being heroic like Robin Hood? At the beginning, limited ressources. Food is scarce, so you have to think twice who joins your cause. I'd make food management a central issue at low levels. Nobility might have overwhelming enforcers, like well-trained knights or creatures far stronger than the usual humanoid.
Later, powerful potential allies appear - but they are shady themselves. And nobility might not be as united as it looked like first - maybe one of them offers quests with high reward but questionable actions necessary. Players might think they can redeem this noble, use them against the others or take them out when it's time - up to you what works and what doesn't. Finally, nobility might try to bribe characters. And perhaps fellow adventurers won't know this for a while...
I'd actually keep nobility human - this potentially makes villains deeper and players' decisions tougher. Maybe they have some monstrous allies (or prisoners etc.), but exploring what humans will do in bad times is always an interesting topic. And I'd strongly consider to cap the level to 6 or so, so I can stick with the area and opponents I introduced at the beginning.
One more thing: Heroic behavior partially relies on other good characters (which seem worth it to be assisted) and good organizations (which can be joined or supported). Once you minimized such characters and organizations, there is much less incentive to be a hero. You can accentuate this further by adding a few good persons - who turn out to be misguided morons.
"A Song of Ice and Fire" has a great passage in it about the...I think they refer to him as the "broken man".
You're one of the commonfolk, drafted into service by your lord. You're pulled from your small village--that you've never been further than a couple day's ride from--and are soon marching through unknown lands, under an unknown banner for an unknown cause. There's no mass communication or anything, and you're most likely illiterate.
Then there's the actual fighting. You watch as friends and brothers fall beside you, shot with arrows, hacked with swords and trampled under countless feet.
Your unit breaks. You are captured. And now you're marching again, through different lands, under a different banner.
Eventually, you break. Maybe after one skirmish. Maybe after a dozen. But you break and run, and now you're...where? In some lonesome field or wood or mountain pass. How will you ever find your way home? Is that place you grew up even really your home anymore?
Now you're alone, struggling to survive. You're hungry and scarred and desperate and damaged in a way you'll probably never really heal from. So what do you do? What can you do? You have your training, however brief it was. You have your sword. And here comes a wandering peddler with a sack full of apples and cheese, and a skin full of red wine...
--and that's how a highwayman is born.
At least. Some of the time. And you can always adjust the elements to be a little less gritty and depressing and *real* to suit a more fantastical campaign tone.
In council of Thieves Adventure path you are still the good guys, but are the bandits....
Maybe it's a blend of a few things; get that whole motley crew vibe going on.
The ruling class is busy fighting some distant war for land or resources--something the common people will never see the benefit of, but will be forced to pay a great and bloody price for it. So the wartime tax collectors are making their second round through the kingdom, with rumors that a third will be on its way shortly before winter.
One of the characters could be an ex-soldier, a veteran of this war who has seen first hand how terrible things are out there. He's somehow made it back and is determined to do something about it.
Another could be a mercenary/caravan guard, hired to protect the tax collectors. Maybe not a heart of gold, but they could be swayed to join a more just (or maybe just more seemingly lucrative) cause.
--I feel like you could easily have two characters share one of the above stories. Brothers-in-arms who served together in the war or long-time work associates, or both. I mean, mercenaries got to get their training from somewhere, right?
A local priest who wants to help their people. A druidic hermit or woodsman who finds some bandits in their neck of the woods and takes up their cause. A common their who wants a chance to cut some serious purses. A social pariah who's had enough of the ridicule and prejudice that their town/city/nation has to offer them and wants to burn it down and build something better in it's place. A disillusioned sixth son of a noble who wants to do what's right for once.
You could introduce them one-by-one and watch the party grow to its full size. Maybe the first encounter starts with them on opposing sides; the newly turned bandits versus a tax collector and their bodyguard...who ends up joining the bandits
your main problem is when 'things are fine as they are' happen. i mean once they hit the jackpot (wow 50 gp? iv only seen silver!) why would they risk robbing people and getting killed by the merchant's hired mercs.
also some people tend to cry when robbed and stabbed, it's not something normal people would like to get up in the morning to start. (and some do just for that!).
what i think you need is constant pressure (or close enough)
so my advice: don't do highway bandits. go into a more confined place.
change it into an urban gang turf war. each party member is a part of their gang, and a known face in it. (so perk up your disguise kit boys!)
also the city is on a lock-down due to XYZ. (i like the siege of war to help with making resources scarce.) and now all the city's gangs are up and about and at each other throat trying to make it or break it.
(nothing says shit is down like when 4 different gangs try to hit the same payload at the same time!..well unless there are MORE gangs then 4 on it that is..)
think of it like this - there is a reason why the GODFATHER is a top list movie\book. (i actuly read the books first..)
bandits do it for the money mostly. once that is set they have little reason to continue. gangsters have many other reasons: honor, respect, family, money, thrill, survival etc..
your main problem is when 'things are fine as they are' happen. i mean once they hit the jackpot (wow 50 gp? iv only seen silver!) why would they risk robbing people and getting killed by the merchant's hired mercs...
You've just described the main issue with your run-of-the-mill, dungeon-crawling, tomb-plundering, goblin-cleaving, dragon-slaying adventurers.
We're talking about people who's main occupation is...getting stabbed. Or bitten. Or burned. Poisoned. Cursed. -- pretty much on the regular.But hey! The payoff is huge! If you survive, you can make more on your first adventure than you could in a lifetime of being a rutabaga farmer. What are you going to do with all that wealth? Seems like it's time to hang up your scale mail and your heavy wooden shield and enjoy an early (but well-earned) retirement.
Oh. What? You're going to... buy a better sword? To...do it all again? And...then you'll just keep doing it forever?
There is something seriously, deeply wrong with you.
--I think greed and ambition can go a long way toward sort of covering up this fairly large issue that exists for so many characters. Same goes for bandits. Sure, this is a lot of money. But if we use this to gear up and rob that whole village blind, we'll be living like kings for life!
This sounds like Robin Hood (as Sheepish Eidolon mentioned).
Just reverse the sides in Kingmaker. The characters are members of the Stag Lord bandits. They harass an upstarting kingdom, preying on the new trade routes as they appear, and stealing from the evergrowing population.
your main problem is when 'things are fine as they are' happen. i mean once they hit the jackpot (wow 50 gp? iv only seen silver!) why would they risk robbing people and getting killed by the merchant's hired mercs...You've just described the main issue with your run-of-the-mill, dungeon-crawling, tomb-plundering, goblin-cleaving, dragon-slaying adventurers.
We're talking about people who's main occupation is...getting stabbed. Or bitten. Or burned. Poisoned. Cursed. -- pretty much on the regular.
But hey! The payoff is huge! If you survive, you can make more on your first adventure than you could in a lifetime of being a rutabaga farmer. What are you going to do with all that wealth? Seems like it's time to hang up your scale mail and your heavy wooden shield and enjoy an early (but well-earned) retirement.
Oh. What? You're going to... buy a better sword? To...do it all again? And...then you'll just keep doing it forever?
There is something seriously, deeply wrong with you.--I think greed and ambition can go a long way toward sort of covering up this fairly large issue that exists for so many characters. Same goes for bandits. Sure, this is a lot of money. But if we use this to gear up and rob that whole village blind, we'll be living like kings for life!
yes adventurers have a lot of danger too, but they have more then one thing driving them usually beside getting cash. mostly the cash they find is an extra reason beside the main thing they went into the cave\dungeon\ruin for. by being a bandit you say the main reason is cash. once that is no longer a reason your kinda stuck.
also lets be honest unless it's a VERY popular highway. how much traffic and cash would you assume your going to get out of it? there is a reason most people reher live in a town\city - there is more wealth there, it is gathered there while on the highway weeks can go by before another merchant risk the road which by your 20th run is rumored to be infested with high-men.
and then you have the variation, how long will it take for the players to be board out of an other rich merchant\noble\poor farmer\etc encounter ? cash or your life is a bit limited. i agree there might be other random encounters, but most of the game is designed to face enemies where they stay not when they are on the move. (ruins\dungeons houses\etc etc)
im not saying you can't make interesting encounters for bandits, the army\merc would chase them for the 'wanted' notices. there might be monster\undead outbreak nearby. there would be prison scenes and prison break as well etc. but when you stop and think most of it would NOT be about the actual bandit activity, if only for the reason that staying along a road to ambush people can tend to be rather doll and repetitive if nothing else happen.
my idea was to move into a more dynamic area where staying still is never a good option. you lay down for too long and the other gangs going to get the better of you.
...adventurers have a lot of danger too, but they have more then one thing driving them usually beside getting cash...by being a bandit you say the main reason is cash.
Neutral treasure-hunting mercenaryp-type adventurers (who are really just bandits of a different sort) would disagree.
And just as many adventurers have other motivators beyond simple wealth, bandits can, too. See: the various references to Robin Hood above....unless it's a VERY popular highway. how much traffic and cash would you assume your going to get out of it?
That seems like an overly simplistic view of what being a highwayman is all about. Camp out by one road and just sit there all the time? So the king's men can march on you and slaughter you all? No way. Keep it moving. Control a vast network of roads. Pay off some innkeepers to hide you on occasion. Take up residence in an abandoned barn or keep for a while.
...but when you stop and think most of it would NOT be about the actual bandit activity, if only for the reason that staying along a road to ambush people can tend to be rather doll and repetitive if nothing else happen.
Anything is boring if that's all you do. Life is varied; who's suggesting a campaign where the players only do one thing over and over? I'm certainly not. As you pointed out, bandits involves a lot more than robbing merchants on the road. Suggesting that's all the campaign would involve is like suggesting a campaign where the party just walks through the woods and has random encounters with wolves.
Hmm, yes, I agree... always include a necromancer. Great suggestion, Meirril.
Blight Druid/Shade of the Uskwood-13/
Agent of the Grave-5 might be a tad much, however thematically flavorful it may be... funny thing is that I have the Stag Lord's father, Nugrah the Decrepit, as an incorporeal Wild Shaping Lich based off of this very build.
Anyways, a Spirit Warden Shaman-5/
Agent of the Grave be but 10th level and could fit well...
@10:
BAB: +5
Base Saves: +4/+3/+7
CL9, 5th level spells
I have more if you want me to dig them up...
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The main problem with a bandit group of players is giving them good reasons to work together and not backstab each other when sharing loot.
Perhaps they are from the same orphanage and to surive they have learned to be loyal to each other but no one else.
Or they have the same Nemesis/Powerful enemy they work together to overcome.
This could to be part of each players background story.
The main problem with a bandit group of players is giving them good reasons to work together and not backstab each other...
Nothing could be simpler.
Even for the most jaded, selfish, casually violent of people, a code of conduct is an extremely useful thing to have.A. You need extra bodies on your side if you're to pull off jobs at the scale you want to.
B. Having someone "on your side" only works as long as you can trust them.
Since A and B apply to everyone in the group equally, everyone is forced to trust everyone, and be trustworthy in turn, lest the whole thing falls apart. You don't betray each other out of a practical need to stay together, rather than a moral desire to be a decent person.
You could open things up eventually for some kind of double-cross at the end, or you could just keep things simple and ask your players not to be jerks to the other players and make it part of session 0. A little suspension of disbelief to keep the game running smoothly and out of territory you don't want to deal with.
And that's all assuming that your bandits are hopelessly self-absorbed, greedy and fairly two-dimensional characters. Once you allow for things like loyalty and honor--no matter how hypocritical it may be--or the fact that the bandits have a motivation outside of common wealth to unify them, you're really in no different water than your average adventuring party.
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I think the initial meeting/start fase could use some nudging in a bandit group of neutral->evil alignments.
When they know each other and have established some respect and perhaps loyalty it will run as smoothly as a normal adventure party.
An easiest way is to have some shared background story.
And remember to discuss some etics with your players beforehand.
What kind of evil/unlawfull behavior is okay and fun with your friends and what is off limits.
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as for adventures, you can use pretty much any cliche normal adventure, just spin it around. Instead of the lich's lair to destroy the evil once and for blah blah blah...it's the home of a rich, yet extremely paranoid noble who had a vault with immeasurable wealth. Both have traps, guardians (either having powerful beasts as such), secret rooms/hidden passages, etc...
Saving the Princess? Well this princess happens to be the main dame of the bandit lord who landed herself in the King's Tower after trying to nab the royal jewels *giggidy*. Again, you have to overcome all manner of dangers, guards, climb checks to rescue the damsel and whisk her to safety.