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Summoner doesn't have much actual summoning, which seems a little surprising.
The problem is that it's a class that attracts new players. There is no way I want a new player having to hunt through three bestiaries for something good so that they can try to juggle three creatures in combat for a total of five actions. Even if it only works while the eidolon isn't present, I still don't want to point a new player towards the summoning rules.
Just add some appropriate summoning spells to their repertoire on top of the four spells they pick.
- They're already spontaneous, so even if a character isn't focused on summoning, they can toss out a summons when it's useful.
- It avoids taking power away from the eidolon. The power of an extra spell known is not nearly as big as an extra spell in a free, dedicated slot.
- It allows new players to safely ignore the incredibly rules-intense summoning rules without being weaker for it.
The slightly improved version:
Each eidolon gives a choice of one of two bonus spells known. One is a summoning spell, and the other is a spell that benefits from heightening. Heal, Charm, Magic Missile. Include a sidebar recommending new players take the non-summoning spell.
I like the idea of the improved version. If they did decide to go with dedicated spell slots for summoning, adding this option instead of having to mess with the summoning rules as well would be a great idea.
Call it something like a Summoner's Cache where they get some number of slots that auto heighten. It could be something where you draw power off the magical nature off the eidolon. The slots are filled with either an appropriate summons spell OR an appropriate spell that benefits from heightening. Allows newer players to still use those slots without getting into summoning.
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See some of marks comments in the main thread for this board. Based on his comments, the reason 'more summoning' isn't in the playtest is simply because they know how summoning mechanics work and they wanted feedback on other mechanics.
I'm not currently concerned that the final result will lack Summoning.
See some of marks comments in the main thread for this board. Based on his comments, the reason 'more summoning' isn't in the playtest is simply because they know how summoning mechanics work and they wanted feedback on other mechanics.
I'm not currently concerned that the final result will lack Summoning.
All right, good to know.
Then my recommendation is just some eidolon-focused alternatives for new players, or ways to approach it so that it's easier for new players.
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In my first draft, every eidolon actually did give a specific extra summon spell, but we cut it in a later draft. Returning it could be a possibility for the final.
In my first draft, every eidolon actually did give a specific extra summon spell, but we cut it in a later draft. Returning it could be a possibility for the final.
That’s something I would definitely be interested in buying into. I’m not sure my more eidolon-focused summoners would be interested in something like that as baseline.
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In my first draft, every eidolon actually did give a specific extra summon spell, but we cut it in a later draft. Returning it could be a possibility for the final.
I assumed as much from the orphaned sidebar about divine summons.
In my first draft, every eidolon actually did give a specific extra summon spell, but we cut it in a later draft. Returning it could be a possibility for the final.That’s something I would definitely be interested in buying into. I’m not sure my more eidolon-focused summoners would be interested in something like that as baseline.
I'd consider having a bonus spell known to be small enough that I wouldn't care about buying in or not, but it'd be mildly pleasant to have an alternate bonus spell known.
Yes it was Summoner that got me into Pathfinder. Because it was something not in other games.
With only 4 spells most Summoners aren't going to have a summon spell. Which is really odd.
Personally I'd love to see the summoner get a focus spell or a "summoning font" that functioned like a designated type of Summon spell, determined either by the summoner at level one, or simply be linked to the eidolon (like the beast eidolon gives summon animal, etc), and have there be feat that broadens out what types of summon spells it can replicate, similar to how wild shape works now. It would make the summoner actually able to summon a lot, and would provide an easy way to give the summoner the ability to cast 10th level summoning spells.