There has yet to be a pending charge to my credit card, so I got that going for me.
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I got a group walking in to a extreme encounter on Sunday because they dodged XP I put in front of them. I need that APG so they have options if they die. This always happens with the big books with the new character content, shows up late or last minute. You never see this with a bestiary or GM specific book.I have been a subscriber for at least a decade, my subscriptions have never been this late before.
I've only been a subscriber over the last few years and I've had my sub ship after the release date before. I don't know if it's because I add single mini's randomly or not, but I sub for the perks: PDF's and possible early access.
I try not to stress because I know it will get here eventually and I mainly use the PDF's. If they made a PDF only subscription path I might even go that route for the books.
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It's certainly a distinct possibility at this point, and it's not one I'm pleased with. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like Paizo is in a position to change it. I'd love to demand that they roster on a bajillion more pick-packers at their warehouse, but that's just not realistic.I simply don't like that some subscribers have the pdf, and others do not. The physical book being late is fine with me - they are mostly shelf decoration to me - the content is what I purchased, and that I'd expect to be fulfilled when the order enters my cart - not at some arbitrary date when the order ships.
It would certainly be upsetting if come the 30th, any non-subscriber can go onto the site, purchase the pdf, and have it immediately - while subscribers have to wait until their particular order ships.
You misunderstand. I don't care when my book ships. What I don't like is that for some reason the pdf access is tied to the shipping progress. They don't need more warehouse workers to fix that problem.
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You misunderstand. I don't care when my book ships. What I don't like is that for some reason the pdf access is tied to the shipping progress. They don't need more warehouse workers to fix that problem.It's certainly a distinct possibility at this point, and it's not one I'm pleased with. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like Paizo is in a position to change it. I'd love to demand that they roster on a bajillion more pick-packers at their warehouse, but that's just not realistic.I simply don't like that some subscribers have the pdf, and others do not. The physical book being late is fine with me - they are mostly shelf decoration to me - the content is what I purchased, and that I'd expect to be fulfilled when the order enters my cart - not at some arbitrary date when the order ships.
It would certainly be upsetting if come the 30th, any non-subscriber can go onto the site, purchase the pdf, and have it immediately - while subscribers have to wait until their particular order ships.
I think it's less that the PDF is reliant on the shipping, but more that giving you the product you bought doesn't happen until you've actually bought it by giving them money, which happens when the sub ships.
You misunderstand. I don't care when my book ships. What I don't like is that for some reason the pdf access is tied to the shipping progress. They don't need more warehouse workers to fix that problem.It's certainly a distinct possibility at this point, and it's not one I'm pleased with. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like Paizo is in a position to change it. I'd love to demand that they roster on a bajillion more pick-packers at their warehouse, but that's just not realistic.I simply don't like that some subscribers have the pdf, and others do not. The physical book being late is fine with me - they are mostly shelf decoration to me - the content is what I purchased, and that I'd expect to be fulfilled when the order enters my cart - not at some arbitrary date when the order ships.
It would certainly be upsetting if come the 30th, any non-subscriber can go onto the site, purchase the pdf, and have it immediately - while subscribers have to wait until their particular order ships.
The way it was explained to me, that I accepted, was this.
They don't want to charge you for a product that they haven't confirmed you are getting. Which means they won't charge you for your books until it is checked off of their inventory and applied to your account. When you order from the store it is charged immediately and removed from their on hand inventory in the system. When we subscribe though they want to make sure that their inventory is enough to fulfill the shipments. So when your box is prepared, verified and shipping can be applied is when they officially charge our cards.
The PDF's are not given out until we are charged for the books. This is because they are a 'perk' of the subscription. If they applied the PDF, then you some how cancelled your order it is a logistical nightmare if enough people were to do it.
I agree though, I wish they would just charge the card when the authorization went through and give me the PDF. But at least someone explained it to me, like I did above, enough for me to be 'ok' with their reasoning behind why it works the way it does.
If you already knew all that? That's cool. But maybe someone reading it didn't.
Will also say that my books are shelf decoration. I really like having them, but if they allowed for a PDF only subscription that still got me discounts across the board I would hop all over that.
Does that mean the bank only held the funds for so long and Paizo took too long to fill the order?The charge that was pending on my debit card for my order[containing AoE book 1 and the APG] just suddenly vanished after pending for 4 days. Money returned, and my order is still pending, but the charge just stopped I guess?
I've never had THAT issue before... :/
Possible, luckily I work where I bank so I can find out while I'm at work waiting for my order to stop pending.
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You misunderstand. I don't care when my book ships. What I don't like is that for some reason the pdf access is tied to the shipping progress. They don't need more warehouse workers to fix that problem.It's certainly a distinct possibility at this point, and it's not one I'm pleased with. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem like Paizo is in a position to change it. I'd love to demand that they roster on a bajillion more pick-packers at their warehouse, but that's just not realistic.I simply don't like that some subscribers have the pdf, and others do not. The physical book being late is fine with me - they are mostly shelf decoration to me - the content is what I purchased, and that I'd expect to be fulfilled when the order enters my cart - not at some arbitrary date when the order ships.
It would certainly be upsetting if come the 30th, any non-subscriber can go onto the site, purchase the pdf, and have it immediately - while subscribers have to wait until their particular order ships.
The way it was explained to me, that I accepted, was this.
They don't want to charge you for a product that they haven't confirmed you are getting. Which means they won't charge you for your books until it is checked off of their inventory and applied to your account. When you order from the store it is charged immediately and removed from their on hand inventory in the system. When we subscribe though they want to make sure that their inventory is enough to fulfill the shipments. So when your box is prepared, verified and shipping can be applied is when they officially charge our cards.
The PDF's are not given out until we are charged for the books. This is because they are a 'perk' of the subscription. If they applied the PDF, then you some how cancelled your order it is a logistical nightmare if enough people were to do it.
I agree though, I wish they would just charge the card when the authorization went...
One further issue which may be historical or may be still relevant:
When Paizo first began offering subscriptions there was a fair bit of bitterness from some FLGS owners. Their view was that the real, hardcore fans were going to subscribe and that the initial sales when a new book launched would therefore be suppressed somewhat. That sales “spike” on release is what pays for the order (and allows the store to over-order and hence carry stock for a long term with minimal risk).
The provision of PDFs a couple of weeks before streetdate would (so the argument goes) greatly increase the attraction of subscriptions and thus depress FLGS initial sales even more, meaning carrying Paizo products becomes a more substantial risk.
That’s why, when all-in-one PDF releases are contemplated, it’s generally been on the assumption that we’d all get it on streetdate, not on authorisation. And given most subscribers get their books shipped considerably earlier than that, the upshot would be that most of us would actually be worse off were Paizo to address the perceived inequity of a patchwork, PDF-on-shipment release.
The view Paizo have taken, I think, is that by randomising the order of shipping cohorts we are all treated fairly long term - some months we’ll get our books after streetdate, or close to. Others we’ll be a week or even more ahead of that.
Possible, luckily I work where I bank so I can find out while I'm at work waiting for my order to stop pending.Does that mean the bank only held the funds for so long and Paizo took too long to fill the order?The charge that was pending on my debit card for my order[containing AoE book 1 and the APG] just suddenly vanished after pending for 4 days. Money returned, and my order is still pending, but the charge just stopped I guess?
I've never had THAT issue before... :/
That happens to me quite often. My bank only holds authorisations for four or five days. Once it’s expired, Paizo’s system will quite often issue another hold (though there’s usually a few days between expiration and re-authorisation, in my case).
I believe it’s quite bank-dependant though.
Possible, luckily I work where I bank so I can find out while I'm at work waiting for my order to stop pending.Does that mean the bank only held the funds for so long and Paizo took too long to fill the order?The charge that was pending on my debit card for my order[containing AoE book 1 and the APG] just suddenly vanished after pending for 4 days. Money returned, and my order is still pending, but the charge just stopped I guess?
I've never had THAT issue before... :/
Uugh! I hope this is not a further delay for you.
Possible, luckily I work where I bank so I can find out while I'm at work waiting for my order to stop pending.Does that mean the bank only held the funds for so long and Paizo took too long to fill the order?The charge that was pending on my debit card for my order[containing AoE book 1 and the APG] just suddenly vanished after pending for 4 days. Money returned, and my order is still pending, but the charge just stopped I guess?
I've never had THAT issue before... :/
That happens to me quite often. My bank only holds authorisations for four or five days. Once it’s expired, Paizo’s system will quite often issue another hold (though there’s usually a few days between expiration and re-authorisation, in my case).
I believe it’s quite bank-dependant though.
Is that due to being an international transaction?
Is that due to being an international transaction?Possible, luckily I work where I bank so I can find out while I'm at work waiting for my order to stop pending.
Does that mean the bank only held the funds for so long and Paizo took too long to fill the order?
That happens to me quite often. My bank only holds authorisations for four or five days. Once it’s expired, Paizo’s system will quite often issue another hold (though there’s usually a few days between expiration and re-authorisation, in my case).
I believe it’s quite bank-dependant though.
Pretty much as Steve said, the authorization expired.
However, my order is not international. I'm sitting in Texas, yeehaw.
Is that due to being an international transaction?Possible, luckily I work where I bank so I can find out while I'm at work waiting for my order to stop pending.Does that mean the bank only held the funds for so long and Paizo took too long to fill the order?The charge that was pending on my debit card for my order[containing AoE book 1 and the APG] just suddenly vanished after pending for 4 days. Money returned, and my order is still pending, but the charge just stopped I guess?
I've never had THAT issue before... :/
That happens to me quite often. My bank only holds authorisations for four or five days. Once it’s expired, Paizo’s system will quite often issue another hold (though there’s usually a few days between expiration and re-authorisation, in my case).
I believe it’s quite bank-dependant though.
I guess there might be an Australian rule that says banks can’t hold authorisations open indefinitely, I’m not really sure.
I don’t think so, though. I think it’s just what happens (at some banks). I’m pretty sure I’ve seen some Americans have the same issue in months with long shipping windows.
Uugh, a delay that you have no control over
Uugh, a delay that you have no control over
Better experience than other sites I’ve seen. I preordered a case of minis in December from miniaturemarket.com and they charged me on the spot. I still haven’t got it (it was shipped in March/April).
I’ll take a couple of weeks held funds over seven months of actually missing money. (If I never see it, I believe I’ve now missed the six month window of challenging the charge, meaning my only option would be the practically impossible avenue of legal action).
I'm in cleveland, ohio so i shouldnt have a delay in shipping
I'm in cleveland, ohio so i shouldnt have a delay in shipping
The delay is caused by too much volume/too few warehouse staff. It’s not related to one’s location.
However, I do not buy that reason. It not like they did not know that thisnwas going to be a possability in March or May. These are rookie mistakes being made.
However, I do not buy that reason. It not like they did not know that thisnwas going to be a possability in March or May. These are rookie mistakes being made.
EDIT: <deleted this bit. I just misunderstood what you meant....>
As for mistake - I’m not so quick to judge. No matter what industry you look at, they’ve pretty much all been impacted by COVID and it’s flow on effects. Although everyone knew in March they’d be facing problems later in the year, nobody knew what they would be. Paizo may well have spent March/April stressing that they’d have no orders and be needing to fire warehouse staff by August, not that they’d need more. Hiring people back then could easily have been the wrong call too.
I’m glad they’ve hired more warehouse staff. I’m glad they’ve been working overtime to get us our books.
This GenCon shipment isn’t substantially different from previous years - the backlog of emails is the unusual problem, in my view and I really feel for the CS people having to deal with that. Especially being hit with a humble bundle sale! :o
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However, I do not buy that reason. It not like they did not know that thisnwas going to be a possability in March or May. These are rookie mistakes being made.
That's not really a fair assumption, unless you think that the printed books arrived in the warehouse in March or May. Production and shipping everywhere have been slowed by the pandemic, and it's not all that easy to determine the degree to which distancing measures will slow down a process until you're in the middle of it.
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However, I do not buy that reason. It not like they did not know that thisnwas going to be a possability in March or May. These are rookie mistakes being made.That's not really a fair assumption, unless you think that the printed books arrived in the warehouse in March or May. Production and shipping everywhere have been slowed by the pandemic, and it's not all that easy to determine the degree to which distancing measures will slow down a process until you're in the middle of it.
Or to predict whether demand for a luxury good like RPGs would collapse six months into a global recession.
IIRC they had copies at Paizo con.
Paizo are doing fine. We're still well within SLA. There is no indication yet that they might fail to fulfill all shipments by the date they promised.
They've got two full days to wrap up the last of the shipping. Allow them those with as much patience as we can muster! That's my opinion, still. I hate being at the back of the line, as I'm sure do you all too. But in the grand scheme, waiting another week or two than some others pans out to little. We'll get there.
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IIRC they had copies at Paizo con.
That was also when they started hiring more warehouse crew. (And I know they have a casual pool for high volume months, though historically they’ve been loathe to rely too heavily on that model).
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Paizo are doing fine. We're still well within SLA. There is no indication yet that they might fail to fulfill all shipments by the date they promised.
They've got two full days to wrap up the last of the shipping. Allow them those with as much patience as we can muster! That's my opinion, still. I hate being at the back of the line, as I'm sure do you all too. But in the grand scheme, waiting another week or two than some others pans out to little. We'll get there.
I'm not quite ready to send in complaints yet, I'm just curious as to why they initialized a charge and left it for so long it fell off my bank account.
If I don't get the books by street date, however, I will be slightly upset. I have no wishes to cancel my AP subscription, in any case. I enjoy the products too much, and this is the first time this has happened so I'm rather lenient considering circumstances.
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I just got my email.
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I just got my email.
Pending... Pending... Pending....
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IIRC they had copies at Paizo con.
Those were most likely some samples from their printer so they can approve of quality, and make any last minute changes that show up in a physical book. I know in other industries they are called "Artist Proofs"
EDIT: Repeated myself
I actually used a prototype paver plunger vacuum thingy today that's getting released next month.
pending
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Mine went pending two weeks ago and it took about five business days to fully process. I'm stoked for this particular shipment as it contained the APG, and Starship Operations Manuel.
I am stoked for this! Thank you to all the CS personnel and warehouse staff for their work during this hell time, for real. You're all rocking it and I appreciate you all! :)
IIRC they had copies at Paizo con.Those were most likely some samples from their printer so they can approve of quality, and make any last minute changes that show up in a physical book. I know in other industries they are called "Artist Proofs"
EDIT: Repeated myself
Not sure.
Got an email from Paizo..... telling me Kingmaker 2.0 is delayed. Not surprised and happy to wait on that one. Want them to be able to give it the respect it is due....
Still pending here though... pending.... pending.... pending....
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Got an email from Paizo..... telling me Kingmaker 2.0 is delayed. Not surprised and happy to wait on that one. Want them to be able to give it the respect it is due....
Still pending here though... pending.... pending.... pending....
same same. OH YEA AN E_MAIL FROM PAIZO.... oh... :*(
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Got an email from Paizo..... telling me Kingmaker 2.0 is delayed. Not surprised and happy to wait on that one. Want them to be able to give it the respect it is due....
Still pending here though... pending.... pending.... pending....
I'm so far at the back of the line that I haven't even gotten that email. Haha.
I'm wondering if I'll even get it today or tomorrow
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The issue I see here is a lack of communication. We're all still pending, and obviously a subscription doesn't guarantee an early pdf etc. From what I can tell, customer service hasn't answered many people over the last few weeks. Honestly, I'm considering cancelling my subscription for the future. I genuinely understand that they're slammed, and can't answer all the emails and messages they're getting. Everyone has it rough right now, but a simple stickied post asking us to be patient, or explaining what's going on would help. I could be wrong, or just have missed it, but a lot of what I've seen seems to be guesses or hearsay. If our subscriptions were going to ship late, we could have skipped this month and put money into our local economies via local game shops, many of which are struggling.
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In solidarity with those who still have not gotten their pdf
The issue I see here is a lack of communication. We're all still pending, and obviously a subscription doesn't guarantee an early pdf etc. From what I can tell, customer service hasn't answered many people over the last few weeks. Honestly, I'm considering cancelling my subscription for the future. I genuinely understand that they're slammed, and can't answer all the emails and messages they're getting. Everyone has it rough right now, but a simple stickied post asking us to be patient, or explaining what's going on would help. I could be wrong, or just have missed it, but a lot of what I've seen seems to be guesses or hearsay. If our subscriptions were going to ship late, we could have skipped this month and put money into our local economies via local game shops, many of which are struggling.
I too am hoping for an update today.
However, in this thread, Paizo staff said they were absolutely on track to have all subscribers' shipments out the door by end of day tomorrow. That was on Thursday. They haven't just ignored us this whole time.
The CS backlog is a very different and much more serious issue. Definitely with you on that.
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Shipping Update:
Hi folks, thanks so much for your patience this month. I wanted to drop in for a correction and an update on shipping. Street date for our July subscriptions is actually Thursday, July 30, which aligns with the start of GenCon. I'm so sorry for the confusion! Additionally, shipping is taking longer than estimated, and the Warehouse Team has let us know that most folks should expect their shipping confirmation on Friday, July 31.
I know this is really disappointing news for some, so I wanted to take some time to break down two major factors contributing to this delay.
1. July is a massive month for subscriptions. Most of our subscription lines have a product releasing, which means orders take longer to build.
2. The warehouse team is taking extra pandemic precautions. As the only team that can't work remotely, Paizo is making sure to put their health and safety first. All of the team are working spread out in the warehouse and limiting interactions, which means that everything just takes a little longer. Those seconds and minutes add up for a big month like July.
Finally, I wanted to address some speculative comments with a blanket statement. We're always doing our best to look out for our customers, and thinking of how we can minimize impact to you all as much as possible when an issue or delay arises. It's not in our nature to "take it easy" while books are sitting unshipped and messages are waiting to be answered. Thanks again for your patience and understanding. If you have a concern with your order beyond the shipping delay, please open a new thread and we'll get to you as quickly as possible.
Shipping Update:
Hi folks, thanks so much for your patience this month. I wanted to drop in for a correction and an update on shipping. Street date for our July subscriptions is actually Thursday, July 30, which aligns with the start of GenCon. I'm so sorry for the confusion! Additionally, shipping is taking longer than estimated, and the Warehouse Team has let us know that most folks should expect their shipping confirmation on Friday, July 31.
I know this is really disappointing news for some, so I wanted to take some time to break down two major factors contributing to this delay.
1. July is a massive month for subscriptions. Most of our subscription lines have a product releasing, which means orders take longer to build.
2. The warehouse team is taking extra pandemic precautions. As the only team that can't work remotely, Paizo is making sure to put their health and safety first. All of the team are working spread out in the warehouse and limiting interactions, which means that everything just takes a little longer. Those seconds and minutes add up for a big month like July.
Finally, I wanted to address some speculative comments with a blanket statement. We're always doing our best to look out for our customers, and thinking of how we can minimize impact to you all as much as possible when an issue or delay arises. It's not in our nature to "take it easy" while books are sitting unshipped and messages are waiting to be answered. Thanks again for your patience and understanding. If you have a concern with your order beyond the shipping delay, please open a new thread and we'll get to you as quickly as possible.
thanks for the update. But I'm wondering are our pdf's being delayed as well until our books ship?
Y'all realize that even if they had more people/less orders there's always gonna be someone who go their order last, right?In the broader context of human experience, sure, but orders are going to keep rolling in, to be fulfilled on a rolling basis. I doubt they very often have no orders in the queue, which means functionally speaking, there's always someone who's next.
And I for one would be very sad if the day ever came when that was no longer true at Paizo. I have seen that happen for too many companies that I enjoyed doing business with.
Shipping Update:
Hi folks, thanks so much for your patience this month. I wanted to drop in for a correction and an update on shipping. Street date for our July subscriptions is actually Thursday, July 30, which aligns with the start of GenCon. I'm so sorry for the confusion! Additionally, shipping is taking longer than estimated, and the Warehouse Team has let us know that most folks should expect their shipping confirmation on Friday, July 31.
Bummer.
BUT, we appreciate the hard work of the CS and warehouse teams! Thank you for doing your best as always!
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Shipping Update:
Hi folks, thanks so much for your patience this month. I wanted to drop in for a correction and an update on shipping. Street date for our July subscriptions is actually Thursday, July 30, which aligns with the start of GenCon. I'm so sorry for the confusion! Additionally, shipping is taking longer than estimated, and the Warehouse Team has let us know that most folks should expect their shipping confirmation on Friday, July 31.
I know this is really disappointing news for some, so I wanted to take some time to break down two major factors contributing to this delay.
1. July is a massive month for subscriptions. Most of our subscription lines have a product releasing, which means orders take longer to build.
2. The warehouse team is taking extra pandemic precautions. As the only team that can't work remotely, Paizo is making sure to put their health and safety first. All of the team are working spread out in the warehouse and limiting interactions, which means that everything just takes a little longer. Those seconds and minutes add up for a big month like July.
Finally, I wanted to address some speculative comments with a blanket statement. We're always doing our best to look out for our customers, and thinking of how we can minimize impact to you all as much as possible when an issue or delay arises. It's not in our nature to "take it easy" while books are sitting unshipped and messages are waiting to be answered. Thanks again for your patience and understanding. If you have a concern with your order beyond the shipping delay, please open a new thread and we'll get to you as quickly as possible.
Thanks for the update! While the wait can suck, the transparency and updates really does help!
Stay safe!
Thank you for the update. Disappointed that it will be a bit of a further delay but completely understandable. Thank you all at Paizo for your hard work.
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Well that's a bit disappointing. It's a little disheartening to received your subscription after it's released to everyone else that didn't subscribe.
But circumstances being what they are, it's understandable. I just wished they'd charge me and give me my PDFs at least.
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Well that's a bit disappointing. It's a little disheartening to received your subscription after it's released to everyone else that didn't subscribe.
But circumstances being what they are, it's understandable. I just wished they'd charge me and give me my PDFs at least.
Agreed.