What NEW classes do you hope to see out of pf2e?


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Since my first thread on returning classes seems to have wrapped up, the logical next step is where do we go from here? What new themes mechanics or ideas do you see them using to create brand new classes or perhaps classes that at the very least have no resemblance to their pf1 incarnation (there are so many archetypes it wouldn't surprise me if one or two of them are named the same as one of the new classes)

For my part i would love to see an artificer, jury rigging gadgets and contraptions, building gizmos and do dads to fill whatever need the party has, vaguely similar to the alchemist but with a more skill monkey approach to the class. And if people need the magic item aspect back i feel like "false runes" or something like that for fleeting enchantments could be a thing as well.

Sovereign Court

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There does seem to be a kind of niche for a class that really embraces the "trinkets" concept.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

An advanced player-oriented class that's based on variable number actions.


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Yes a tinker / artificer that uses the alchemist style rules to come up with trinkets on the fly as needed

Issue is of course that there is definite debate over how well this actually works out for the alchemist. And they have far more obvious combat damage things like bombs and items to overcome DR


I think it could be really sweet to see a combat-skill class that can gain various combat-oriented skill actions, perhaps some upgrades to already existing ones as well. (a lot of the ones already in the game are quite good though)


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
GenericFighter wrote:

Yes a tinker / artificer that uses the alchemist style rules to come up with trinkets on the fly as needed

Issue is of course that there is definite debate over how well this actually works out for the alchemist. And they have far more obvious combat damage things like bombs and items to overcome DR

for combat i could see them using things like traps and snares to control space or perhaps constructed minions like the artificers of eberon had, alternatively they could have some sort of system to build experimental mechanical weapons, just spitballing here.

As for how well alchemists work i think that has more to do with the math just not lining up in their favor than it does the underlying mechanic


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Ascalaphus wrote:
There does seem to be a kind of niche for a class that really embraces the "trinkets" concept.

I could see this working well as a martial that has alchemist-style talisman creation.


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

An artificer would be neat. Would have to be careful designing one in such a way that it doesn't feel like it's stepping on the toes of the alchemist or to a lesser extent trap ranger (or Occultist, which is a class I've seen a lot of people say they want back).

I think I've said this in every thread on the topic, but I'd like to see some sort of warlord-esque class (or other option). A martial-ish character that emphasizes buffing and battlefield control over raw damage.

PF1 Cavalier had notes of this with banner and teamwork feats, but obviously I'm imagining something much more fleshed out and all encompassing here.

More vaguely, I think martial support and martials that care about mental stats are both areas of the game that feel underexplored and ripe for a lot of various ideas, even if not necessarily this one.

Also vaguely I'd like to see some kind of magical-non-spellcaster class. Maybe something built around cantrip-like abilities (except better than actual cantrips) and focus spells, but not a true spell slot caster either.


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I'd love to see a primarily martial class that has a heavy focus on focus spells. Champion is the closest we have, but focus spells are really a side thing for them. I'm not sure what it would look like flavor wise, but it's a mechanical niche I hope we see.


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The Runecaster from Rogue Genius is actually a really nice class that I would love to see an official class work similair to. They essentially make one off buffs (similair to talismans but bespoke to the runecaster) that the person they are cast on can choose to execute. Its a niche that doesn't exist yet.


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- A bender class. You can tell me that Kinetecist was kind of that, but not really no. Not enough. I want an hybrid monk/kinetiecist martial elemental classe, not a Monk with a few elemental strikes or a Kinetecist who can flurry sometimes, but a true full fledged avatar bender.

- A time class. Make it a time thief, a Chronomancer, a time watcher, whatever. But give us a true real time class. Who an remake action with reactions, or switch dice results, or maybe even kind of the narration, in very specific scenarios.

- A Dragon class. Either to play a Dragon, the monster, or a true Dragon Rider. You start at one with a young drake, and you go full adult dragon at 20.

- An Harrow Class. Like the early Medium. A complex, tactic, harrow classe you can play like a Medium from a Vampire Novel, or like Gambit from the X-Men, choose your « Major Card » and pick a card, any card.

- A planar guy. Someone who take powers from the Planes and use them, with alignment restrictions or focus on some planes in particular.

- A Warlock. Like in 3.5 or 5E. Or maybe not a Warlock but at least an at will magic user who is not the kinetecist (because we would have a Bender!!!). Gimme that Sidious feels. Spam a lot, spam with passion, spam with strength, spam at will.

- A kill it, eat it or wear it, become it kind of class. The trophy big game hunter one. Kinda like a mix between a Ranger, a Shifter and Boba Fett. Where you try to kill and use what you kill to do amazing things, like an armor in Monster Hunter, or a power or spell that the type of creature were able to use, or the knowledges of your prey.

- An astrologist class. You got a lots of things in the stars of Golarion. From old empires to Starfinder to Cthulhu to Desna to whatever. I think there is enough room in design spaces here to do more than a bloodline or Wizard sub school. Maybe you choose a constellation, or a star wanderer? You got spells and they are better at night or day? Dunno, but something to consider.

- I know this is stupid, but I would really like a class that is true support, got no direct combat ability at all or almost, and who is kind like an Archivist from Diablo or a Lawyer from Cheliax or an Erudite like Da Vinci or Flamel. Without spells, maybe a bit of magic but from a contract, pact, law of the man or philosophical beliefs. Like a Rahadoumi Philosopher, à Cheliax Lawyer, a Mwangi Sage. A Sage class basically. Like the Expert wnPC, but better and for player.

And thit is enough for today ^^


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SteelGuts wrote:

- A bender class. You can tell me that Kinetecist was kind of that, but not really no. Not enough. I want an hybrid monk/kinetiecist martial elemental classe, not a Monk with a few elemental strikes or a Kinetecist who can flurry sometimes, but a true full fledged avatar bender.

- A time class. Make it a time thief, a Chronomancer, a time watcher, whatever. But give us a true real time class. Who an remake action with reactions, or switch dice results, or maybe even kind of the narration, in very specific scenarios.

- A Dragon class. Either to play a Dragon, the monster, or a true Dragon Rider. You start at one with a young drake, and you go full adult dragon at 20.

- An Harrow Class. Like the early Medium. A complex, tactic, harrow classe you can play like a Medium from a Vampire Novel, or like Gambit from the X-Men, choose your « Major Card » and pick a card, any card.

- A planar guy. Someone who take powers from the Planes and use them, with alignment restrictions or focus on some planes in particular.

- A Warlock. Like in 3.5 or 5E. Or maybe not a Warlock but at least an at will magic user who is not the kinetecist (because we would have a Bender!!!). Gimme that Sidious feels. Spam a lot, spam with passion, spam with strength, spam at will.

- A kill it, eat it or wear it, become it kind of class. The trophy big game hunter one. Kinda like a mix between a Ranger, a Shifter and Boba Fett. Where you try to kill and use what you kill to do amazing things, like an armor in Monster Hunter, or a power or spell that the type of creature were able to use, or the knowledges of your prey.

- An astrologist class. You got a lots of things in the stars of Golarion. From old empires to Starfinder to Cthulhu to Desna to whatever. I think there is enough room in design spaces here to do more than a bloodline or Wizard sub school. Maybe you choose a constellation, or a star wanderer? You got spells and they are better at night or day? Dunno, but something to consider.

- I know this is...

I really like the idea of a Time based class as well.

Dragon rider. Bring it on!
Not sure how they would stop it being OP though!


I've always liked Nightcrawler and characters like him.
It would be nice to be a teleporter class! I know PF1 gave us a number of feats that gave us teleporter abilities. But they were late game and limited.


I would like something like a martial sorcerer where you get better at hitting things (or get new and interesting ways to hit things) because of your bloodline.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber
Squiggit wrote:
An artificer would be neat. Would have to be careful designing one in such a way that it doesn't feel like it's stepping on the toes of the alchemist or to a lesser extent trap ranger (or Occultist, which is a class I've seen a lot of people say they want back).

Easiest way to solve the problem of it stepping on the Occultist is to make it the Occultist.

The 4 vague ideas I've had so far:

-If my mechanical concept for the medium, that of flexible multiclass feats, doesn't make it to the medium (definite possibility, I doubt many miss the lesser hero medium, and most would prefer a harrow version), I would still like a class based around it. Factotum, Dilettante, whatever you'd like to call it.
-I will not stop wanting a dragon shaman, a spell-less support class, the cleric's answer to the warlock. Champions are nearly there, but too combat focused for my taste. Note: does not need to be dragon flavored.
-Sort of echoing some of the people upthread, but I had an idea for an Edgewalker class, a mostly combat class that tapped the Transitive planes (Shadow, Ethereal, Astral, Dream, and Time) for mystical self buffs
-The specific ability I'd like to add to the artificer chat would be the ability to manipulate weapon traits. Gnomes can already do this, I would like to see it as a main class ability.


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Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I'd like to see a class that works kind of like familiars do now. You have a big list of abilities and as you level you just build a bear your character, almost like how augmentations work in starfinder. There could be mini feat chains for jaws or scales or what have you that branch into different things, and every one of that class would be there own mix of everything. I think that would be cool.


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Alchemist unchained: one where you you get cool new actions and abilities [especially non-bomb ones] instead of math fixes for feats and where the Research Fields feel remotely equitable. I'd be happy for the suggested artificer class if it does something similar to the alchemist but actually works well at the theme.


3e's Tome and Blood had some wild stuff in it. The Fatespinner as a full time/luck class would be cool. I've always liked luck abilities. Blood Magus was also really funky in theory.

An Artificer would be fun. I'm thinking less creating and using magic staves and wands like in D&D and the Eberron setting and more doing things like having a construct companion, creating a construct suit, different varieties of mechanical contraptions or inventive upgrades to weapons. Last time I checked out Starfinder there were some cool things that could transfer over.

A martial buff class without spell casting would also be cool. I liked the Paragon in the original Guild Wars and always though that concept was really fun. A divine berserker class a la the Dervish would also be something we haven't really seen. I even homebrewed a class like that up for 1e I called Avatar that one of my players had fun with.


Salamileg wrote:
I'd love to see a primarily martial class that has a heavy focus on focus spells. Champion is the closest we have, but focus spells are really a side thing for them. I'm not sure what it would look like flavor wise, but it's a mechanical niche I hope we see.

The only concern I have with this is the whole thing about how Focus Points generally seem to only go up to a max of 3, and usually you can only regain 1 at a time until later-game. Makes it really hard to make a Focus Spell your primary combat thing. Buffs maybe, but as an offensive ability it just wouldn't really work.

---

That aside, while PF2e doesn't have them yet, PF1e saw many ways for martials to summon weapons, but one thing it never really had (at least not from Paizo, though you might be able to count Synth Summoner I guess) that I think would be cool is a summoned-power-armor type class. The Iron Man, based around your armor that you can call to you at a moment's notice and it gives you cool abilities. Basically something along the lines of the Aegis psionic class. Reasonably it could even be a way to get Legendary Armor proficiency without being tied to an Alignment and Deity.

Also adding my support to Dragon Rider ideas. As far as balancing goes, honestly I think it could be balanced around the same power level as some Animal Companions, maybe a little bit stronger because unlike the Druid or Ranger where Animal Companion is just one path this would be a class based around the Companion. And maybe a bit more survivability because replacing a Dragon Mount seems like it would reasonably be harder than replacing an Animal Companion.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I am all for powerful race classes that pair with a powerful ancestry like dragon. I would throw all the money at such a book.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber
Gorbacz wrote:
An advanced player-oriented class that's based on variable number actions.

Would you mind elaborating on this? I'm curious what you mean.


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A Binder like from 3.X where you use a ritual to augment yourself for the day. I doubt swapping out so many abilities each day would work, so it's more for the theme of drawing ancient entities into oneself. Having the essence of heroes, villains, dead deities, and so forth empowering you seems pretty cool. Could help flesh out some of Golarion's past too. :)

A martial polymorph class unlike the Shifter, more like a PF1 Eidolon where you pick from a large set of powers, perhaps with a theme like the Unchained version. So you could get angel-gal, devil-guy, yet with more options like dragon-dude and aberrant-woman. So I suppose it's similar to martial bloodlines, though I hadn't made that link until now.


Salamileg wrote:
I'd love to see a primarily martial class that has a heavy focus on focus spells. Champion is the closest we have, but focus spells are really a side thing for them. I'm not sure what it would look like flavor wise, but it's a mechanical niche I hope we see.

Monk is already that class. Ki strike on Flurry of Blows is baked in as the most powerful action the monk can take. They can also spend focus to grant themselves ranged attacks/spray attacks, heal themselves, and just move themselves around with flying and teleporting. At high levles, they get an instant death and one of the best scouting abilities in the game, ethereal jaunt. They get 3 focus points per combat with the higher level feats, and they will definitely use all of them.


Castilliano wrote:
A Binder like from 3.X where you use a ritual to augment yourself for the day. I doubt swapping out so many abilities each day would work, so it's more for the theme of drawing ancient entities into oneself. Having the essence of heroes, villains, dead deities, and so forth empowering you seems pretty cool. Could help flesh out some of Golarion's past too. :)

The Medium was 1e's answer to the Tome of Magic Binder, so we've seen Paizo's take on that.


Puna'chong wrote:
Castilliano wrote:
A Binder like from 3.X where you use a ritual to augment yourself for the day. I doubt swapping out so many abilities each day would work, so it's more for the theme of drawing ancient entities into oneself. Having the essence of heroes, villains, dead deities, and so forth empowering you seems pretty cool. Could help flesh out some of Golarion's past too. :)
The Medium was 1e's answer to the Tome of Magic Binder, so we've seen Paizo's take on that.

Disliked Mediums, though yes, there was much overlap so that's odd. It's likely because they were primarily casters, even if not full casters.

And while Binders could access magic, it worked more like Focus Spells, having a recharge time. Or even unlimited like Cantrips at times or after 1d4 rounds.
I'd think a PF2 Binder would be more a martial w/ Focus like a Champion or Monk, yet with specific paths depending on which entities were accessed, though I suppose specific feats could represent that (much like a Monk's Dragon Stance opens up other options later rather than forces them on you).


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

Yeah, Paizo did that a couple of times. For instance, the Witch is pretty clearly their first answer to the Warlock (lots of all day abilities), but in some ways missed the point by also making it a caster. I think they said at one point that they generally disliked all day options, and liked the way vancian casting limited big effects to once or a few times a day.

That said, if this stance ever really existed (and is not just a figment of my imagination), it clearly wavered over the years, with mechanics like Grit and Panache appearing instead of ones like Arcane Pool. Focus and Cantrips are much more to my taste, and in the same book as the medium they also put out the kineticist. But, also note that the Burn mechanic placed a cap on the number of times you can use your best abilities, so even there you can see that philosophy peek through.


Queaux wrote:
Salamileg wrote:
I'd love to see a primarily martial class that has a heavy focus on focus spells. Champion is the closest we have, but focus spells are really a side thing for them. I'm not sure what it would look like flavor wise, but it's a mechanical niche I hope we see.
Monk is already that class. Ki strike on Flurry of Blows is baked in as the most powerful action the monk can take. They can also spend focus to grant themselves ranged attacks/spray attacks, heal themselves, and just move themselves around with flying and teleporting. At high levles, they get an instant death and one of the best scouting abilities in the game, ethereal jaunt. They get 3 focus points per combat with the higher level feats, and they will definitely use all of them.

I suppose so. Maybe I just dislike that the ki powers don't really have a unifying theme other than "they use ki". Like, having Elemental Fist, Ki Blast, and Wholeness of Body on the same character feels weird from a flavor standpoint. Also, I can't find any way to increase your occult/divine proficiency without multiclassing. So, much like the Champion, focus spells seem to be a side thing for monks (and are even completely optional).


Salamileg wrote:
Queaux wrote:
Salamileg wrote:
I'd love to see a primarily martial class that has a heavy focus on focus spells. Champion is the closest we have, but focus spells are really a side thing for them. I'm not sure what it would look like flavor wise, but it's a mechanical niche I hope we see.
Monk is already that class. Ki strike on Flurry of Blows is baked in as the most powerful action the monk can take. They can also spend focus to grant themselves ranged attacks/spray attacks, heal themselves, and just move themselves around with flying and teleporting. At high levles, they get an instant death and one of the best scouting abilities in the game, ethereal jaunt. They get 3 focus points per combat with the higher level feats, and they will definitely use all of them.
I suppose so. Maybe I just dislike that the ki powers don't really have a unifying theme other than "they use ki". Like, having Elemental Fist, Ki Blast, and Wholeness of Body on the same character feels weird from a flavor standpoint. Also, I can't find any way to increase your occult/divine proficiency without multiclassing. So, much like the Champion, focus spells seem to be a side thing for monks (and are even completely optional).

I don't understand.

You want a martial class that goes to Legendary proficiency in a spell tradition? (Both go to Master already.)
As for theme, I expect the Kineticist will fulfill this want, perhaps even a spell-less Magus (which I'd prefer to a full-caster).


Shinigami02 wrote:
That aside, while PF2e doesn't have them yet, PF1e saw many ways for martials to summon weapons, but one thing it never really had (at least not from Paizo, though you might be able to count Synth Summoner I guess) that I think would be cool is a summoned-power-armor type class. The Iron Man, based around your armor that you can call to you at a moment's notice and it gives you cool abilities. Basically something along the lines of the Aegis psionic class. Reasonably it could even be a way to get Legendary Armor proficiency without being tied to an Alignment and Deity.

You just described the Folding Plate and Folding Shield Magic Items, you can go from no armor or shield to full in 1 full round. Non Aegis class wise, you just described the Arcanist with the Arcane Mask exploit. Or better yet, an Armored Battlemage Magus or Sigilus Magus, with a wand/command word item of Serren's Swift Girding.

*************

Having said that. A class that is actually based around armor would be awesome.

Teleporting via shadows is just another Shadowdancer clone. Poor Shadowdancer, everyone wants to take its core ability.

And finally, I think classes based on the Alternate sub systems might be awesome. Things like Words of Power, Wild Magic, Rune Magic, Called Shots, Corruption, etc.

Imagine a class based around trying to snipe body parts for benefits (pretty much like Monster Hunter). A martial who must balance between gaining power and controlling their level of corruption (this scenario is were the Oracle Playtest makes more sense). Or a caster who is not limited by their number of spell slots, but by the scrolls/runes they have prepared.


Castilliano wrote:
Salamileg wrote:
Queaux wrote:
Salamileg wrote:
I'd love to see a primarily martial class that has a heavy focus on focus spells. Champion is the closest we have, but focus spells are really a side thing for them. I'm not sure what it would look like flavor wise, but it's a mechanical niche I hope we see.
Monk is already that class. Ki strike on Flurry of Blows is baked in as the most powerful action the monk can take. They can also spend focus to grant themselves ranged attacks/spray attacks, heal themselves, and just move themselves around with flying and teleporting. At high levles, they get an instant death and one of the best scouting abilities in the game, ethereal jaunt. They get 3 focus points per combat with the higher level feats, and they will definitely use all of them.
I suppose so. Maybe I just dislike that the ki powers don't really have a unifying theme other than "they use ki". Like, having Elemental Fist, Ki Blast, and Wholeness of Body on the same character feels weird from a flavor standpoint. Also, I can't find any way to increase your occult/divine proficiency without multiclassing. So, much like the Champion, focus spells seem to be a side thing for monks (and are even completely optional).

I don't understand.

You want a martial class that goes to Legendary proficiency in a spell tradition? (Both go to Master already.)
As for theme, I expect the Kineticist will fulfill this want, perhaps even a spell-less Magus (which I'd prefer to a full-caster).

No, I'm just dumb, I didn't realize occult/divine proficiency went up with your Monk DC. I thought it was just stuck at trained.


Temperans wrote:
Shinigami02 wrote:
SNIP

You just described the Folding Plate and Folding Shield Magic Items, you can go from no armor or shield to full in 1 full round. Non Aegis class wise, you just described the Arcanist with the Arcane Mask exploit. Or better yet, an Armored Battlemage Magus or Sigilus Magus, with a wand/command word item of Serren's Swift Girding.

*************

Having said that. A class that is actually based around armor would be awesome.

And finally, I think classes based on the Alternate sub systems might be awesome. Things like Words of Power, Wild Magic, Rune Magic, Called Shots, Corruption, etc.

Yeah, the key points were "Martial", "armor that... gives you cool abilities", and "class". A Martial being able to don armor in an instant is cool (and I'll admit I didn't know about Folding Plate/Folding Shield) but having an Iron Man-esque class with power-granting armor is the real goal.

Also... 100% with you on the Sub-System classes... assuming any of them get converted over. Especially the Corruptions one, being able to play with those without the omnipresent risk of being turned NPC any moment would be awesome. Heck, the Hive Corruption gave me Kerrigan (of Starcraft) vibes the first time I saw it and I would love being able to actually make that character..... and might wind up having to convert that class to Starfinder if it ever happens because it is marginally more appropriate of a concept for that ^.^;


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I would like a psychometabolism version of the Kineticist. As in, instead of channeling planar energy through your body, with too much hurting you, you're channeling planar energy into your body, with too much hurting you.

So instead of "shooting lightning" or "erecting walls of fire" you can do stuff like harden your skin, grow claws, stretch your limbs, have short bursts of incredible strength, etc.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

So..like a shifter, but more mutant than magic?


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Shifter: Planar Edition

I could see it.


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, Rulebook Subscriber

I always really liked the words of power system and would love to see a class based around that and can use semi-Eragon style spellcasting where you get to make custom spells instead of how in first edition it was just normal spellcasting but occasionally you merged a couple of effects.


zm3348 wrote:
I always really liked the words of power system and would love to see a class based around that and can use semi-Eragon style spellcasting where you get to make custom spells instead of how in first edition it was just normal spellcasting but occasionally you merged a couple of effects.

A major worry: Shenanigans.

Had an experience w/ those where the caster was nearly useless for 6 levels (which is pretty hard for so many levels!). Come the finale, he two-shots the campaign boss (though he did need our protection.)

Given the extreme flexibility, it'd likely have to be hindered to what may be called crippling. For example, they shouldn't be able to build an equivalent Magic Missile spell AND get other Magic Missile variants too.

Do like the flavor, simply cannot see a way to execute it.


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You are talking Word casting in the context of PF1. Also if they went 6 levels being bad, only to 2-shot a single boss, I would already call thst crippling. Making it worse is only adding insult to injury.

Also PF2 is a perfect vehicle for Word casting with more complex spells using up more actions.

Ex: Damage descriptor + Attack type = 1 action variable spell, and more words is more actions. Force + Missile == Magic Missile, Flame + Sphere == Flame Sphere; Flame + Missile + Explosion == Fireball.


Temperans wrote:

You are talking Word casting in the context of PF1. Also if they went 6 levels being bad, only to 2-shot a single boss, I would already call thst crippling. Making it worse is only adding insult to injury.

Also PF2 is a perfect vehicle for Word casting with more complex spells using up more actions.

Ex: Damage descriptor + Attack type = 1 action variable spell, and more words is more actions. Force + Missile == Magic Missile, Flame + Sphere == Flame Sphere; Flame + Missile + Explosion == Fireball.

You perhaps misunderstood. The PF1 example was pure shenanigans in that the player made extreme choices. He could've built a balanced PC, yet he went for the late game payoff. In his case, the very late game vs. the CR+4 boss we knew was coming from first level. Most of his choices were tuned toward that one enemy. Not a good framework for PF2, I think, so Paizo would have to rein in such extremes.

"Crippling" only referred to PF2, where having so much versatility would be costly IF played in a game alongside casters without such versatility. You give examples of building spells which duplicate current spells. Yet this new caster would also have extra variants they could build, right? That extra breadth and the open nature of the system would be hard to balance in PF2's more rigorous system. The Word system would likely have obvious flaws when comparing spells directly because how else does this caster pay for this versatility? How without the difference crippling its power?
Using one's third action? Maybe makes an extra roll vs. a DC based on the composition of the spell? A flat DC failure chance, even if tiny, may be sufficient. Dunno.
I could see maybe having "action costs", and as one goes up in levels, the action costs go down, opening up new power levels w/ full price action costs. This might allow for some 1-action weaker, Flourish spells (which I'd like) alongside 2-action regular Word spells (albeit slightly weaker than a normal spell).
Of course, this depends of if the Word caster is building on the fly or has to prep and how much casting they have available too.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

I am pretty new to official stuff, so I don't necessarily know what appeared in 3.5 and so...

I'd like to see a martial work with a berserker system. So killing enemies or dealing damage would increase their rage value or whatever, which would drain away when they don't fight enough. So after a few kills or crits or whatever in a runup, they could do significant damage. Kind of an incremental barbarian, can get stronger but probably start weaker? I dunno.

Might be a bit more metamagic or specific to spells, but I'd love to see a caster able to sustain an action or two per turn to build up a multi-turn single spell. I've heard talk of ritual casters, maybe that's what folks are talking about?

Wish I had better ideas. I can't wait for PF2 to actually bring entirely new classes--I'm hopeful they can.


Castilliano I think that debate is better in another thread, to not derail this one. I can see, what you mean but I dont think word casting is any more flexible. It really depends on how they translate it and its just to complicated to talk in quick snipets.

Sporkedup, there was a magic weapon enchantment named Furyborn. Its effect was to b n increase the enchantment bonu by 1 for every hit, max 5. I feel like Paizo might not port that enchantment due to the way the math work. But a feat for Barbarians might be nice.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Sporkedup wrote:

I am pretty new to official stuff, so I don't necessarily know what appeared in 3.5 and so...

I'd like to see a martial work with a berserker system. So killing enemies or dealing damage would increase their rage value or whatever, which would drain away when they don't fight enough. So after a few kills or crits or whatever in a runup, they could do significant damage. Kind of an incremental barbarian, can get stronger but probably start weaker? I dunno.

Might be a bit more metamagic or specific to spells, but I'd love to see a caster able to sustain an action or two per turn to build up a multi-turn single spell. I've heard talk of ritual casters, maybe that's what folks are talking about?

Wish I had better ideas. I can't wait for PF2 to actually bring entirely new classes--I'm hopeful they can.

For the first that would probably be some variety of barbarian, ebb and flow of rage sounds cool but perhaps a bit of a pain to track

For the second multi turn charge up spells sound neat but I'm unsure they could realistically be good considering how vital action economy is.

And rituals are hour or more long spells that use skill checks instead of spell slots and anyone with the right magical knowledge can perform not just spell casters, this is things like consecrate, planer ally, or control weather.

Silver Crusade

I would love to see the Magus return.

Additionally, I would not be opposed to seeing new classes, especially if mechanically a 1E class could not be brought back and coming up with something different.

What would different be I am not totally sure.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Kekkres wrote:
Sporkedup wrote:

I am pretty new to official stuff, so I don't necessarily know what appeared in 3.5 and so...

I'd like to see a martial work with a berserker system. So killing enemies or dealing damage would increase their rage value or whatever, which would drain away when they don't fight enough. So after a few kills or crits or whatever in a runup, they could do significant damage. Kind of an incremental barbarian, can get stronger but probably start weaker? I dunno.

Might be a bit more metamagic or specific to spells, but I'd love to see a caster able to sustain an action or two per turn to build up a multi-turn single spell. I've heard talk of ritual casters, maybe that's what folks are talking about?

Wish I had better ideas. I can't wait for PF2 to actually bring entirely new classes--I'm hopeful they can.

For the first that would probably be some variety of barbarian, ebb and flow of rage sounds cool but perhaps a bit of a pain to track

For the second multi turn charge up spells sound neat but I'm unsure they could realistically be good considering how vital action economy is.

And rituals are hour or more long spells that use skill checks instead of spell slots and anyone with the right magical knowledge can perform not just spell casters, this is things like consecrate, planer ally, or control weather.

Thanks! I'm just spitballing.

Ebb and flow of rage is a cool way to go about it but I could still see it being very different from a barbarian. I use rage/berserk as terms only because the most recent example I can think of that uses something like this is the rage system in Path of Exile... haha. I don't think it would be too bad to track, just like a multi-tiered panache that drops for every ten minutes not in combat (making questions of stopping to heal or refocus... complicated for a group? Which I don't think is bad). Obviously would need some serious theorycrafting and might not fit the structure of PF2, but I love the concept of a character that gets revved up and more dangerous as fights/dungeons continue, rather than everyone else managing resources into attrition.

But you're right, there's definitely a lot of barbarian in there. And I feel like folks would often multiclass between the two as submitted.

But throw on some focus powers to avoid making this just a "fighter until things get more interesting" or something, and I think it could be a fun concept. Plus building and playing would seem to be a bit more advanced, which is something I'd like to see out of future classes.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

Somewhat unrelated, somewhat related, but I hope they release at least one example of a class archetype ahead of the APG. Mostly because I’m impatient and want to see how Paizo uses the concept to modify the core and advanced classes.

Basically, I’d like to get a sense on where Paizo draws the line on what should be a subclass, class archetype, archetype, or full class. Seeing at least one in action, so to speak, would help me evaluate that, and possibly also spur my creativity into the correct direction once I do have an idea.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
AnimatedPaper wrote:

Somewhat unrelated, somewhat related, but I hope they release at least one example of a class archetype ahead of the APG. Mostly because I’m impatient and want to see how Paizo uses the concept to modify the core and advanced classes.

Basically, I’d like to get a sense on where Paizo draws the line on what should be a subclass, class archetype, archetype, or full class. Seeing at least one in action, so to speak, would help me evaluate that, and possibly also spur my creativity into the correct direction once I do have an idea.

Am I the only one not that interested in class archetypes? Maybe I misunderstand them to a degree.

But to me they sound like a limiting of options rather than an expansion. Want to play as this new class archetype? Well, you're stuck picking one definite class and you have to follow a pretty strict progression, as far as history has shown. Rather than expanding base classes so that multiclassing and everything can allow you some access from any corner of the map?


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Sporkedup wrote:

Am I the only one not that interested in class archetypes? Maybe I misunderstand them to a degree.

But to me they sound like a limiting of options rather than an expansion. Want to play as this new class archetype? Well, you're stuck picking one definite class and you have to follow a pretty strict progression, as far as history has shown. Rather than expanding base classes so that multiclassing and everything can allow you some access from any corner of the map?

I think the idea with Class Archetypes is supposed to be stuff that expands on a base class in a way that Subclass can't, modifying the odd-level class features (the things class feats don't generally change, and often the kind of things that Multiclassing doesn't touch for that matter) into new features. The general theory is that this will expand the flavor and mechanics of the base class.

Given how PF2e works kinda locking you into a single base class anyways, this does in fact grant expanded options in that it lets you have some measure of sway over those features that otherwise every member of your base class will have the exact same way.

That said... a vast majority of these features seem to be relatively simple proficiency advancements so yeah, I'm also kinda curious how these are going to work exactly. Also with the usual Archetype Feat Limitations... I'm hoping that it's not gonna cost class feats to change these things out (except maybe the initial Dedication feat, but even that I'm hoping will also introduce something in its own right if you even have to take one) but that just brings into question just how the whole thing's gonna work.


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I will just give some random ideas.

A class that gains "spell slots/focus/abilities" by attacking. The character would have to spend the beginning of combat just gaining points and use all the resources for big flashy attacks since they wouldn't carry over to the next combat. Many video games use mechanics like this and I think it could fit in Pathfinder 2e.

I would love a magic class not based around spell slots. Thematically it could be anything but doesn't necessarily have to be the Kineticist.

This one will most likely never come out but Blue Mage from Final Fantasy would be amazing. I would love playing through a campaign gaining monsters abilities randomly while adventuring. Could also actually just be a shifter that actually turns into monsters fought in adventures.


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A Warlord type. Master Melee/Master Buff/Debuffing. Sort of like a Bard with "Cantrips" For buffing and debuffing with Verbal only components like Shouts. Focus Spells to either make said Cantrips last longer or for more Higher Powered "Leveled" stuff. Abosolutly no spells. Give it key abilities of Strength and Charisma. He dont get Attack of Opprotunity but can maybe give an Armor Buff to someone within 15ft sort of like the Rogue Feat Nimble Dodge.

I mean technically you can do this already with Bard or Fighter Dedication but a Class actually dedicated to it would be awesome. I wonder if there is a way to do it without stepping on the Bards toes since it wouldnt have any Spellcasting.

I mean if you spitball enough ideas something is bound to stick and then the core of the class could form.

Wayfinders

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Seconding a desire for a Warlord/Commander type, who bolsters their allies via nonmagical means - commands, tactics, stratagems, and words of courage, while still being a capable fighter in their own right (though obviously no capital-F Fighter).

4e and 13th Age both featured this sort of class, yet it seems gone in modern D&D-likes - for shame in my opinion, since the concept is great and would especially fit into the framework of PF2.


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

That for sure is a good way to go about a new martial class. The battlemaster fighter is basically the only semi-interesting pure martial class in 5e, so I think there is tons of unexplored ground in there.

I was also thinking about two underexplored character types--one is a tankier but less potent martial, and the other is a more scientific alchemical side. Anyone play Torchlight 2? The Engineer is a steampunky, heavy armor class (like the image of the Pathfinder NPC in the Character Guide). I think that has a lot of unexplored potential perhaps.

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