Looking for some more players for a high powered, heavily-house ruled PF1e campaign set in the Ninth World setting of Monte Cook's Numenera


Recruitment

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Fellow Pathfinders,

We have four active players right now, and could use a couple more at least. This is a campaign where the characters wake up without any memory of their past lives, and explore the Ninth World setting of Monte Cook's Numenera RPG. We are using the setting, but not the rules, since we're instead using my heavily house-ruled version of PF1e I use for all my games, and which I've developed over the last couple of years.

This is the current plot -- the PCs woke up underwater, and then explored the outer reaches of a sunken city, but decided to abandon this idea when they received information that the ruins were inhabited by powerful and malevolent possessing entities.

They then encountered and defeated a coral warship commanded by octopuses that was preparing to destroy a nearby coastal town.

Then they came to the town, and began to interact with a local Aeon Priest, who led them to the archives. The front door of the archives led to a pocket dimension populated by mysterious entities.

This is basically a hex crawl, and is inspired by classics like Hommelet and Saltmarsh.

Character Creation:

*** These rules also apply to 'buddies' for 'buddy classes' and all cohorts. Use the base form of the creature from the Bestiary and construct it exactly like a PC, except that the 'special' category -- e.g., telepathy, etc., is added to the character. In other words, familiars, mounts, animal companions, and other 'buddies' are like 2nd PCs with a few extra minor abilities like telepathy. ***

System: A mix of DnD 3.5 and PF 1e.

Allowed Content: Anything.

Backstory: You start as an amnesiac from a previous world -- so you need to come up with some basic details about whatever your origins were.

Equipment:

The characters don't start with any equipment, because they wake up naked, and without any memories.

However, you will soon have the opportunity to possess the following:

Wealth: Double maximum.

Each PC gains a free Legendary Item per the universal path ability, which scales based on the tiers of the PCs. Each PC is considered to have taken the path ability 'for free' for each tier they posses.

I don't like the Xmas tree effect, so we'll use these two systems to get around that:

One is Chopping Down the Christmas Tree.

The second is Automatic Bonus Progression as if level +2 (i.e., the 'low magic' setting).

I really don't like the Xmas tree style of equipage, or the 'significant six' economy of items. If you're going to have magical items, I want you to make them named items with fluff based on this system from Ghostwalk:

Quote:
NAMED MAGIC WEAPONS

An unusual aspect of the Ghostwalk campaign is that all magic weapons, no matter how minor, have a name. The process to craft magic weapons that was discovered millennia ago in this part of the world required the weapon to have a unique name to cement its powers into place. A weapon is often named for the person who is to bear it, or for some memorable event tied to its creation or the person who created it. For example, a +1 longsword made for a Tereppekian fighter named Bakara might be named Bakara’s Blade by its creator, and a +2 ghost bane heavy mace made by the church of Orcus might be known as Spirit Breaker. Magic weapons that have abilities added to them over time sometimes have their names expanded, but always keep some element of the original name. If Bakara’s Blade later had the flaming special ability added to it, it might be renamed Bakara’s Brightblade. If Spirit Breaker was later crafted with the torturous special ability, its name might be changed to Spiritwrack. A weapon’s name often reveals some of its history or features, even if its name has changed over time due to the addition of new properties. Spells such as analyze dweomer, identify, and legend lore automatically give a weapon’s current and previous names (in addition to all other effects of the spells), and a bard who knows the name of a magic weapon gains a +5 bonus on bardic knowledge checks made to reveal more information about that weapon.

Ability Scores: I use a custom point buy system. At lst level, you receive 108 points that can be spent on a 1-1 basis -- i.e., an attribute of 1 costs 1 point, an attribute of 10 costs 10 points, and an attribute of 18 costs 18 points.

You can manipulate this however you like, with no minimum or maximum, as long as your score is high enough for your character to be alive. I think that's 1 for everything.

Consequently you could have the spreads:

1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 103,
1, 1, 1, 1, 51, 52,
1, 1, 1, 34, 34, 35,

and so on and so forth.

I have two additional modifications to the standard PF 1e rules for attributes.

For Intelligence, I adopt the rule from DnD 4e that it can be used for AC, as well as Reflex saves, but not for Initiative.

For Charisma, it can be used as 'morale' in place of Constitution to calculate Wounds, Vigor, and Fortitude saves. It is also the attribute which is the basis for the custom Hero Point system I use, which is a mix of the PF1e Hero Point system and the Action Point system from DnD 3.5.

Please also note that Constitution is the primary stat for combat stamina and tricks, which are a part of the core system for this game, since everyone gets the associated feat for free. Accordingly, you can't just dump constitution in favor of charisma without really losing out on your stamina points.

Health: In place of Hit Points, I use a custom Wounds and Vigor system that synthesizes elements of the Wounds and Vigor system from PF 1e and the Wounds and Vitality system from DnD 3.5.

There is no rolling, you take double the maximum value for everything. Additionally, you get double at first level.

For Wounds and Vigor, I am maintaining the higher Wound total from Pathfinder (i.e., Constitution x 2 instead of just the flat attribute value) instead of the flat ability score value from 3.5. Furthermore, Vigor is calculated as per Vitality in DnD 3.5 -- adding the Constitution bonus.

Example: A half-orc barbarian has an 18 constitution. At 1st level, His Wounds are 72 (18 x 2 = 36, 36 x 2 = 72), and his Vigor is 64 (12 + 4 = 16, 16 x 2 = 32 (1st level double), 32 x 2 = 64 (double everything)). At 2nd level, he would have 72 Wounds, and 96 wounds (64 + 32). Every level thereafter, he will get an additional 16 Vigor points from his class and Constitution modifier, but no additional Wound points, which stay the same after they are calculated at 1st level unless modified by a feat or some other ability.

-As I stated above in the discussion of 'attributes', you calculate your Wounds and Vigor using either Constitution or Charisma, which ever is higher.

-In my system, critical hits still multiply damage, and they do not go directly to Wounds, as in the DnD 3.5 version of this system. This contrasts with the PF1e variant, where critical hits do not multiply damage and go straight to Wounds. Basically, that means critical hits work as normal, except they apply to Vigor instead of Wounds.

-Both temporary and lethal/nonlethal categories of Hit Points are converted into lethal/nonlethal categories types of Vigor, instead of dispensing with those categories. I am doing this to avoid conflicts with class abilities, feats, and spells that mention temporary Hit Points or lethal/nonlethal damage.

Races: Anything.

Classes: Anything.

Experience: You have 6 gestalt levels, 3 gestalt mythic tiers, and a bin of +6 CR of templates, with a max of +3 CR for any single template, with which to construct your character.

These levels can be moved around and exchanged at the following conversion rates:

1 CR = 1 gestalt levels of a base class or prestige class
2 CR = 1 gestalt mythic tier

You can use this conversion to acquire more template CR, gestalt base class levels, gestalt prestige class levels, or gestalt mythic tiers by sacrificing template CR, base class or prestige class, or mythic tiers, but no individual template can be over +3 CR, and you cannot make a build with more than 4 gestalt mythic tiers, and you cannot have any individual class level over 12.

You can multi class within the gestalt.

Here are some examples:

6//6 3//3(MR) + 6CR
12//12 3//3(MR)

The same template can be taken more than once.

*For archetypes, you can gestalt two archetypes for each base class. That means you add the features on top of the base class, rather than replacing features. You can also add further archetypes on top of that in the normal fashion, replacing class features.

*There is a system from Rouge Genius games called 'archetype packages' which are base class features like animal companions or clerical domains which can be taken to add additional oracle domains to an oracle, an additional animal companion to a druid, etc.

Skills: We will use the Background Skills system from Pathfinder Unchained.

Feats:

This game will have a metric ton more feats than in a normal game -- there are three major sources of feats, not counting any for certain races or bonus feats gained by classes like the fighter.

First, you get certain feats for free (Signature Skill (General), Combat Stamina (Combat), Hybrid (Horrifically Overpowered)).

Second, you get feats as if a PF1e fighter receiving 1 feat per level on both sides of gestalt base class levels, gestalt prestige class levels, and gestalt mythic tiers.

Finally, you get additional bonus feats from the low-magic item, automatic bonus progression system I use called 'Chopping Down the Christmas Tree' (see above).

For feat progression, instead of the standard allocation of 1 feat every other level, everyone gets the PF 1e fighter progression of feats as if they were a fighter with 1 feat per level on each 'side' of the gestalt. So, you get 2 feats per level, plus 1 additional feat on each side of the gestalt for every level you would get a bonus feat as a Pathfinder fighter. This also applies to the mythic tiers.

This means you get between 2 or 4 feats each level.

You can use PF1e or 3.5 versions of feats.

Feat progression for gestalt levels:

Level Feats
1 4
2 4
3 2
4 4
5 2
6 4

Total = 20

Feat progression for mythic tiers

Level Feats
1 4
2 4
3 2

Total = 10

*We are using horifically overpowered feats from Rogue Genius games.
*You can only pick 1 horifically overpowered feat per level or mythic tier. For the base build of 6//6/3//3 +6CR, that would mean 6 horrifically overpowered feats and 3 horrifically overpowered mythic feats.
*We are using the feat tax rules from Elephant in the Playground, and will be using the updated pdf instead of the original blog post. This document can be found here:Elephant in the Room Feat Taxes in Pathfinder
*Everyone gets Signature Skill (General) for all skills they possess, as well as Combat Stamina (Combat) for free.
*You can use the scaling versions of feats from the Feats Reforged series from Total Party Kill games, or can rewrite a feat that is not in that collection to scale if you so desire.

Spellcasting:

We are using the Spell Points (PF) system from Pathfinder, except for the following aspects of this PF 1e conversion of the DnD 3.5e Spell Points (3.5) system:

*For prepared casters, you have two options: you have to pick whether to prepare spells, in which case your selection is limited as per the DnD 3.5 rules, or you can use the PF1e system where casting the same spell multiple times raises the spell point cost of the dweomer each time you cast it.
*Where the DnD 3.5 spell point value for a given level is higher, the greater value is applied.
*There is no restriction on the number of bonus spell points based on the highest level of spell you can cast, instead you just get bonus points as per your casting stat.
*The Vitalizing Variant rule, where casters can draw upon their life force to power spells, is also in use.

This is also an option for divine casters: Spontaneous Divine Casters

Traits:

*You can have 5.
*You can use PF or 3.5 traits/drawbacks.

Other Notes:

*Bonuses of the same type(profane, competence, insight, etc.) from different sources stack - i.e. a deflection bonus to AC from a template stacks with a deflection bonus from a spell.

*We are using a custom armor as DR system which combines elements of the DnD 3.5 and PF1e system. For my variant, I am maintaining the 3.5 system of having an AC instead of the defense score from Pathfinder. However, I am also changing it so you still calculate AC as normal. In other words, the difference is just adding the DR value for your armor and the defense score for the opposed critical hit roll. In this way, the armor as DR system is just tacking on something to the existing combat system instead of messing with all the AC values.

*Characters get a Defense Bonus to their AC based on class as per DnD 3.5 Unearthed Arcana.

*Here, the defense score is only used for an opposed check for critical hits. When an opponent hits you, they roll to confirm the critical hit, and you make an opposed check based on your defense score. If you succeed, you stop them, even if they confirm.

*Armor will provide temporary Vigor equal to its hit points and can transfer damage. If it runs out of Vigor, it falls apart.

*This system has healing surges, which are basically the DnD 4e system.

*In combat For the Action Economy, you can use either the standard or the Unchained Action Economy for your actions.

I find the latter less of a headache than the normal system, but I'm leaving it as a parallel option so that builds that rely on swift actions aren't compromised. You can switch back and forth, you just have to declare each round which is operative.

*I do block initiative, as in the monsters go together, and the players go before and after the 'block' of the of the opponents. I find that makes things easier.

*I use battle maps in google drawings, and love making maps and handouts, etc. I will do a lot of that for this game. I will post a pdf of the combat round at the beginning of each round.

*I use a hex grid.


Quite interested, though there are a fair few options to sort through when putting together a character concept. Are there any gaps in terms of party roles?


Maybe a full caster or healer? Honestly, with this many options, there's going to be some overlap. I don't think we have any characters that are like arcanist/oracles that try to be able to cast any spell.


Right now our group is a fool, a nameless person, a dragon, and an amnesiac.

I'm the amnesiac.


This will take some time to wrap my head around, but basically, within limits defined by the DM, you can play an overpowered version of whatever you want or every wanted to play.

Edit: I can't find the Hybrid Overpowered Feat. I have both overpowered books, but I don't see the feat in either one.


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Here's a concept I've wrapped my head around. I wanted to see if I'm reading the rules correctly.
My concept is a Fortune-Blessed (CR + 1) Holy (CR + 1) Seelie (CR + 1) Half-Celestial (eventual CR + 3) half-elf gestalt classed Godling (mighty)/Godling (eldritch).


The dual full caster approach does sound like a worthwhile challenge.

Character-wise, I'm looking at an android from a World of high technology. Highly attuned to the ruins of prior worlds and the constructs which populate them. Fairly outgoing, inquisitive, and keen to see civilisation climb upwards once again (well, he will be once he orients himself within the Ninth World).

Initially, I'd considered a cleric/arcanist build to represent this concept (with the Augmented template), but the more I think about it, the more I'd like one of those gestalt classes to be a reworked version of the druid. My perspective is that, over billions of years, technology has worked itself into the very fabric of the planet, with ruin complexes (or cities, in better days) and the constructs inhabiting/maintaining them operating akin to an ecosystem. And if Horizon: Zero Dawn is anything to go by, the constructs need not stick to the ruins.

I think the changes for a 'techno-druid' would be relatively straightforward for me to make, substituting construct-themed abilities and tweaking skills/spell lists as appropriate. Plus, there's a good deal of amusement value in imagining classic Transformer sound effects for the transition to and from construct form.

Anyway, let me know your thoughts. In the interim, I'll continue typing up a character sheet.


TheWaskally wrote:
Edit: I can't find the Hybrid Overpowered Feat. I have both overpowered books, but I don't see the feat in either one.

I found it. I didn't realize they made more horribly overpowered books. Very cool.


Update: Concept complete. Only took 3 work days (whew). I have the day off tomorrow and will be formatting a character profile to submit.
Uh, anybody else here?


Still around. Putting together a character sheet hasn't been a quick process.


You ain't kidding, brother!!


just to clarify the plot -- everyone wakes up without knowing where they are: the only reason some of them know anything is because they talked to some octopuses. Octopuses are immortal and have lived for 1 billion years and remember all the past civilizations, so they remember all the races and cultures these characters came from.

The story is based on the one from Torment: Tides of Numenera where the action starts when the player character falls out of the sky. I'm tying the characters into some of that lore as we go along (there's a whole print supplement about it).

I'm also open to people making characters that are natives of the Ninth World. That's harder fluff wise because you need to know something about the setting.

I own almost all the Numenera, as well as Cypher System, books that have been published except Priests of the Aeons and a couple of other things. I can help with fluff if you need me to look up something or explain setting material from the Ninth World Guidebook.


Don't get overwhelmed by the setting -- it's basically Greyhawk except that there's remnants of a high tech age that explain magic instead of actual mysticism.

The basic set up is there's a little town the heroes are in that has some weird stuff going on.

There are several nearby dungeons: one is an island with a dungeon that is coordinated to elemental forces. It's my lose take on the Temple of Elemental Evil -- but it's a numenera version of it.

Another is a 'moathouse' -- notice I literally copied the name from the Hommelet site -- that is a ruined fort with dungeons below it that dates from the time immediately preceding the current age (i.e., the rise of the kingdoms of the Steadfast and the Amber Papcy). It has extensive dungeons.

Both of these dungeons are connected to the history of a renegade aeon priest that came to the town a few generations ago.

There's some other stuff going on too -- it's very much like Sandpoint or Restenford or Hommelet or Nulb, or any other town in a Necromancer Games module -- the setting is just a little different.

This is a hex crawl, so I'm slowly developing the details as the group explores -- in other words, there is an answer to all the weird stuff, but I'm making up a lot of the details and improvising around a broad idea as I go along.


I have a couple traits to choose still, and 2 mythic feats and calculating wounds but otherwise it is ready to go. I can have it finished tonight.

His familiar will be a bard/orcale that will be there for pure support.


Sebecloki, I wish to submit this Nameless Elf for your awesome-sounding Numenera campaign.
Two things of note, I was unsure how to apply the bonus mythic hit points from his mythic tiers, and how to add (if possible) additional spell points from the mythic 3rd-tier heirophant path, Divine Potency (Su).
Please give it a lookover. Making this character was definitely a labor of love!


Oh -- there's no selection process, if you make a character you can play -- I'm not rejecting anyone unless they're abusive to the other players or refuse to follow the rules for this game.

However, noticing the basic bent of your character can I suggest you're a native of the Ninth World instead of one of the returnees? There's a nation to the north of the Steadfast called Lostrei for which I a cool idea for a plot thread.

I can PM you fluff.


Jesus, I'm glad I checked the recruitment thread for the first time in months. This sounds stupidly fun just to make a build for. You said you're not turning anybody away; is there a cutoff date for building a PC?


no, it's just a hex crawl -- there's really no story arc as such except what you make of it, so you can join any time and it doesn't really make any difference


Here we go, one more or less complete character sheet for your consideration.

It's looking a bit untidy at the moment, so I might do a bit of reformatting, add some more links in as I go and so forth. I do miss being able to put my math in OOC tags.

I have included a custom techno-druid archetype to fit with my chosen theme. I think it's balanced, particularly since there's a bit of overlap with other selections I've made. Probably the major question to be resolved is whether I'd be okay to treat low-intelligence constructs as animals for the purposes of the druid spell list.

I'm still pretty early in my playthrough of Torment: Tides of Numenera. It should be interesting to see how it contrasts with this game.


Quick question. What's your opinion on Tail Terror or Dangerous Tail feats, or tailblade equipment on something with multiple tails? Do they allow attacks per tail, or only one attack? If only one attack, since we have all these feats, could we take the feat multiple times?
Obvious example would be Kitsune with multiple tails. The tails don't normally get attacks, but if I were mixing with tailblades or the aforementioned feats?


GrinningJest3r wrote:

Quick question. What's your opinion on Tail Terror or Dangerous Tail feats, or tailblade equipment on something with multiple tails? Do they allow attacks per tail, or only one attack? If only one attack, since we have all these feats, could we take the feat multiple times?

Obvious example would be Kitsune with multiple tails. The tails don't normally get attacks, but if I were mixing with tailblades or the aforementioned feats?

whichever you prefer.


Aerik Sult wrote:

Here we go, one more or less complete character sheet for your consideration.

It's looking a bit untidy at the moment, so I might do a bit of reformatting, add some more links in as I go and so forth. I do miss being able to put my math in OOC tags.

I have included a custom techno-druid archetype to fit with my chosen theme. I think it's balanced, particularly since there's a bit of overlap with other selections I've made. Probably the major question to be resolved is whether I'd be okay to treat low-intelligence constructs as animals for the purposes of the druid spell list.

I'm still pretty early in my playthrough of Torment: Tides of Numenera. It should be interesting to see how it contrasts with this game.

Are you going to be like the other characters and be an amnesiac that gets dropped in from one of the previous eight worlds, or were you going to be a native of Lostrei?


I could go either way, to be honest. I'd assumed the amnesiac option when building my character sheet, but paging through my books, Aerik would fit very well as a native of Lostrei.

With that in mind, I might shuffle my skills about a little to add some knowledge skills pertaining to the modern world, include some basic equipment and amend / flesh out his background.


Whatever you want -- I'll just write a different intro for you tomorrow depending on which you pick, just let me know. If you go with the Lostrei option, you're going to be a spy/scout kind of character, checking out the Steadfast for your compatriots in the north.


I'll go with the native of Lostrei option. Character sheet and background adjusted accordingly.


I'll write you an intro something this evening


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Aerik Sult wrote:
I'll go with the native of Lostrei option. Character sheet and background adjusted accordingly.

made an intro post for you in the gameplay thread; it's in a spoiler.


> Please also note that Constitution is the primary stat for combat stamina and tricks, which are a part of the core system for this game, since everyone gets the associated feat for free. Accordingly, you can't just dump constitution in favor of charisma without really losing out on your stamina points.

If we go undead via template and no longer have a CON score (or CON/STR), how do you want us calculating stamina?

Also, I'm taking forever because I'm having fun just mixing s~%@ together right now, but I think I've found something I like and I want to see how it run, so I'm doing all the official build stuff for it.


You use CHA isntead


That's what I think the fun of these rules are -- you can try out all kinds of crazy stuff that's completely impossible with average build restrictions. For example, the Intimiancy build, or 2 weapon fighting, is so feat intensive you can only do one, by high level, if you're smart about it. With these rules, you could do an Intimancy 2 Weapon Fighting build, and something else too. All kinds of build ideas and character ideas become possible that weren't otherwise viable.


This still open? I always have fun making high-power characters.


Sure, but I think one more is all we need, cause I think that will be 8 , which I think is really the limit for PbP.


Alright. Here's GrinningJest3r's submission. I used PF material for basically everything except the template. Take a look over it if you'd like and let me know if you have any questions.


All right. I’ll still make my character, and keep her in reserve for if you end up needing a replacement at some point.


I'm saying you can join, but that I'm capping it after you join.


Also, anyone in this thread, I have 2-3 openings at a story break for a homebrew campaign in a homebrew Darksun + Setting (it has a slightly modified version of the Dark Sun setting as the core lands, and a bunch of other stuff I made up over the last couple of years).

It started out as a Dark Sun conversion of Legacy of Fire, but the 'story grew in the telling' and we're almost 2 years and 3,300 + posts into it now, and its turned into a complicated homebrew setting and campaign.

Almost identical build rules. We are about to start a new story section where the party will explore the ruins of the City State of Kalidnay to shut down an interdimensional portal. There is... a lot of plot to fill you in on if you're interested.

Shadow Lodge

Ooh I'm quite a fan of dark sun
Is the whole 2e dark sun ascendant being thing something you can quest for?
Back in the old days you'd have to basically take 20 levels in wizard and psion (or cleric and psion or Druid and psion) in something resembling modern gestalt, which could be interesting to try to make work in pathfinder with its different design philosophy, or I could try to jimmy with something like argeis or psywarriror//Druid or whatever


It’s sort of interesting. Normally, I always build with the intent of squeezing every drop of efficiency and power possible out of my builds, but with build restrictions this... extreme, I know that the real power limiter will be entirely my own time spent considering action, and any character I build will be insane, so I can build more for flavor (such as burning half of the gestalt, an Overpowered feat, and a Mythic Overpowered feat on a class that will have very little actual impact on the actual combat-effectiveness.


Lord Foul II wrote:

Ooh I'm quite a fan of dark sun

Is the whole 2e dark sun ascendant being thing something you can quest for?
Back in the old days you'd have to basically take 20 levels in wizard and psion (or cleric and psion or Druid and psion) in something resembling modern gestalt, which could be interesting to try to make work in pathfinder with its different design philosophy, or I could try to jimmy with something like argeis or psywarriror//Druid or whatever

Yes, I kept that but we haven't devised the exact nature of the ascendant destinies yet -- there's clearly the dragon and avangion.

There are elemental lords -- I actually have an area which is ruled by ascended druid/psions instead of sorcerer kings that I haven't detailed very much yet, which lies far to the south of the Tablelands.

Sun mage or Shadow master are other concepts.

I'm partial to a concept I saw on one forum that the Mind Lords of Saaragar became some kind of ueber powered gestalt that can grant templar like powers (divine mind prestige class) to their Lawmakers.

Basically yes, but there are definitely more types and we haven't come up with them all yet in fluff or mechanics because we haven't gotten to that level yet. One character is taking levels in the rakshasa paragon class to become a yaksa rajah, for example.

I do want to be clear that this is a highly customized version of Dark Sun that's almost become it's own setting. The characters and races are there, but I added a lot of stuff. The progenitor species from Stardrive, the Stoneburners and Glassmakers, were responsible for teaching lifeshaping and naturebending, as well as defiling and preserving, to the halflings and Rajaat. I'm using a 3pp. setting called Violet Dawn as the ancient 'Dawn Age' of the world, and it involves a war in heaven where the creator destroyed all his children. I created some new continents and regions -- an area ruled by merchant houses, an area settled by essentially skro, an area ruled by elemental lords, flying continents, a pole made out of frozen carbon, a sea of methane, etc. There are now hundreds of elemental planes, including a plane of flesh, poison, crystal, and mold. I have my own maps of the city-states and added to the fluff. For example, Urik is now on the border of a red wasteland dominated by mutated abominations with which they are at war. There's remnants of space age tech strewn around the setting like crashed space ships, droid factories, and laser guns if you know where to look for it. The tablelands used to be ruled by an advanced race of kobolds, and the remnants of their civilization, for example in Tyr, are still in evidence. Lots of stuff like that.


Dαedαlus wrote:
It’s sort of interesting. Normally, I always build with the intent of squeezing every drop of efficiency and power possible out of my builds, but with build restrictions this... extreme, I know that the real power limiter will be entirely my own time spent considering action, and any character I build will be insane, so I can build more for flavor (such as burning half of the gestalt, an Overpowered feat, and a Mythic Overpowered feat on a class that will have very little actual impact on the actual combat-effectiveness.

That's sort of the idea behind these rules -- there are tons of feats and other class features you can't actually really take if you're restricted to a normal build because they don't fit a very restrictive feat chain you need for things like 2wf or intimimancy. I really don't see the point of having 1,000's of feat options hundreds of base classes and archetypes, if the choices are already basically made for you, and its just an illusion and most of that is dross. I wanted to create a set of rules where you can actually use the endless stuff that's available.


Oof. As much as it pains me to say it, I'm going to have to drop out. My character is just taking far, far too long to make compared to the time I actually have.

Have fun!


I'm still considering making a character for Numenera Seb, I've just been back and forth on which one to make.

And now I have a whole new concept, based on Drow-Dragons of the Forgotten Realms.

However, unsure if I would make it for Numenera or make it as a secondary character for Dark Sun, and move Hamza to somewhat of a background role for the time being.

Shadow Lodge

I would definitely play a dragon disciple/aegis or soulknife if the dragons weren't the explicitly super evil option in this setting


Monkeygod wrote:

I'm still considering making a character for Numenera Seb, I've just been back and forth on which one to make.

And now I have a whole new concept, based on Drow-Dragons of the Forgotten Realms.

However, unsure if I would make it for Numenera or make it as a secondary character for Dark Sun, and move Hamza to somewhat of a background role for the time being.

whichever you prefer


Lord Foul II wrote:
I would definitely play a dragon disciple/aegis or soulknife if the dragons weren't the explicitly super evil option in this setting

there are also drakes, you could refluff it. They're elemental dragon equivalents.


Anything is allowed? Wow.

Could I play a double Aegis gestalt? Only with each side of the gestalt having different archetypes. Specifically:

Aegis (Ascendant) 12 || Aegis (Host of Heroes + Mekanikos) 12

Ascendant Aegis uses their body instead of an astral suit, giving you a scaling natural armor bonus instead of acting as armor. Host of Heroes gives you armor specific to your choice of monomyth, so it should be possible to gain the benefit of both simultaneously. And Mekanikos just changes out the psionic stuff for a spheres of power/might progression.

Effectively, there's zero shared class features between the two sides, other than customization points. Even there, Mekanikos gets fewer customization points as it's major tradeoff for Spheres, and due to how Gestalt works, the two pools wouldn't stack, I'd just get the larger of the two.

If that won't fly, there's always the Mystic || Striker build I could give a whirl.

Dark Archive

Interesting. That could work then.
Sorcerer/dragon disciple//aegis/soulknife/ (or I could go single classes Soul knife, aegis or psywarrior) could be fun then
I just gotta pick an element and reflavor the backstory for Hanna to better fit the dark sun


Kaouse wrote:

Anything is allowed? Wow.

Could I play a double Aegis gestalt? Only with each side of the gestalt having different archetypes. Specifically:

Aegis (Ascendant) 12 || Aegis (Host of Heroes + Mekanikos) 12

This might have been missed, and it's possible it's not covered in Seb's first post(I didn't read most of the rules, as they are more or less the same as the Dark Sun and Rise games, plus I wrote a lot of them myself), but

Each class can have two gestalt archetypes, in addition to the base class features.

What this means is, you keep all of normal class features and then *add* the ones from each archetype.

For example, Hamza has the Brutal Slayer and Vigilante archetypes for the Stalker. He has the class features of all three, base class and both archetypes.

Dark Archive

Monkeygod wrote:
Kaouse wrote:

Anything is allowed? Wow.

Could I play a double Aegis gestalt? Only with each side of the gestalt having different archetypes. Specifically:

Aegis (Ascendant) 12 || Aegis (Host of Heroes + Mekanikos) 12

This might have been missed, and it's possible it's not covered in Seb's first post(I didn't read most of the rules, as they are more or less the same as the Dark Sun and Rise games, plus I wrote a lot of them myself), but

Each class can have two gestalt archetypes, in addition to the base class features.

What this means is, you keep all of normal class features and then *add* the ones from each archetype.

For example, Hamza has the Brutal Slayer and Vigilante archetypes for the Stalker. He has the class features of all three, base class and both archetypes.

Wait so I could go crossblooded sorcerer, snag both bloodlines with no penalties to spells known or will save?


Hanna wrote:
Monkeygod wrote:
Kaouse wrote:

Anything is allowed? Wow.

Could I play a double Aegis gestalt? Only with each side of the gestalt having different archetypes. Specifically:

Aegis (Ascendant) 12 || Aegis (Host of Heroes + Mekanikos) 12

This might have been missed, and it's possible it's not covered in Seb's first post(I didn't read most of the rules, as they are more or less the same as the Dark Sun and Rise games, plus I wrote a lot of them myself), but

Each class can have two gestalt archetypes, in addition to the base class features.

What this means is, you keep all of normal class features and then *add* the ones from each archetype.

For example, Hamza has the Brutal Slayer and Vigilante archetypes for the Stalker. He has the class features of all three, base class and both archetypes.

Wait so I could go crossblooded sorcerer, snag both bloodlines with no penalties to spells known or will save?

I’d say that’s undershooting yourself. I managed to cobble together an unholy combination that granted me the level 20 abilities of three classes, other than spell casting, before I gave up on the complexity.

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