I want to make a Batman themed character and am looking for suggestions on how best to do that. Obviously, he won't be able to do anything and everything Batman can do, but I'm hoping to be able to emulate enough of Batman's qualities that someone would look at the stat block and go "That's Batman."
Think we can do it? Can we pull it off?
I think the Investigator maybe multiclassed with Monk will do it.
Monk for punching and jumping. And the playtest Investigator has many feats that are basically directly taken from Batman.
Max out Intimidate, get a magic cape to fly and you should be good. Decorative bat motifs on everything should be mostly free.
Your Batmobile will probably still just be a horse carriage though...
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I suggest being more specific about which of Batman's qualities you want to emulate. Agility? Punching? Disguises? Detective work? Lack of powers? Lots of money?
I recall a PF1 thread where someone got annoyed at the idea of making Batman as a Wizard.
If you think of Batman as a guy who's physically weak and fragile compared to his allies (such as Wonder Woman), but smart and prepared for anything, a Wizard does the job. But if you think of Batman as a guy at peak physical prowess with no special powers, Wizard is clearly the wrong answer.
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Investigator may very well be great, though we should wait for the APG to see. The playtest version was terrible mechanically in combat and thus not a great fit. Likewise, the Vigilante Archetype, available in the same book, may be a must have.
Absent that, Rogue muticlassing into Monk actually does most of what Batman needs to do mechanically, at least by high enough level. Wolf Style makes this a solid mechanical option as well (what with a d8 attack usable with Sneak Attack and all).
He wouldn't and shouldn't have any Focus Spells or other spellcasting, but might well have some Crafting Skill Feats along with those for other social and mental skills. For combat, unarmed combat, magic items appropriate to his level, and Sneak Attack really cover most of it pretty well.
Hi Batman, I'm dad.
I ran one back in first edition using the Martial Artist archetype. For the most part, you're probably looking at a very non-mystical monk, while using skills and skill feats to follow the investigator part. I managed to stretch quite thin on that character and get by on pure game tactic -including making use of some niche consumables- which felt quite appropriate, but there is little way to reproduce the fighting style outside of a monk chassis.
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Investigator is probably the way to go - maybe with some multiclassing into monk for the unarmed combat as people have said.
Multiclassing into alchemist may be a good idea also to get the ability to make alchemical items on the fly (so that you can pull off the "I just happen to have that in my utility belt" trick).
Also, you need to find the most tragic background (literally, you need to select a tragic background). If you can get lore (the theatre) that is especially thematic.
When playing the character, you also need to be completely against anyone using firearms, but then mount firearms on your wagon or horse or any vehicle you have (it is okay for batman to have firearms mounted on vehicles, but not for anyone to have handheld firearms). This is the most important element of roleplaying batman.
I suggest being more specific about which of Batman's qualities you want to emulate. Agility? Punching? Disguises? Detective work? Lack of powers? Lots of money?
Yes.
XD
I don't care too much about the money, just the perception of any one or more of Batman's themes.
In short, I don't want to limit your possible suggestions by narrowing it down. Hearing what makes Batman Batman is part of this process.
I think that having a huge number of skills is pretty core to being Batman, which makes me look at either a rogue or investigator base.
An alchemist dedication old serve as a great way to get the Utility Belt effect, eventually. I don't think it works that we'll today, but if there was a release like Lost Omens Science and Alchemy, reintroducing Alchemical Tools, then I think it would do the job nicely.
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Wouldn't human ancestry feats such as Clever Improvisor and Incredible Improvisation help with skill coverage?
That would allow you to get away with a lower skill class like monk.
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Wouldn't human ancestry feats such as Clever Improvisor and Incredible Improvisation help with skill coverage?
That would allow you to get away with a lower skill class like monk.
It helps, certainly, but it's not really necessary on a Rogue (or, probably, Investigator) aside from for having a good bonus on every possible Lore.
A high Int Rogue (and Batman needs high Int) winds up with almost every skill anyway, after all.
It's not really enough to make him as a Monk though, simply because the doubled Skill Feats and getting several different skills above Trained are as important to Batman conceptually and mechanically as the high bonus one everything.
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I'd also like to say that I very much don't think getting shuriken is necessary just for batarangs. They're not really any closer to batarangs than daggers are, and a returning would work fine to model batarang use conceptually (at least until we get an actual boomerang or something like it).
The Vigilante Archetype is coming with the Advanced Players Guide later this year. I'd imagine that will have some really great Batman themed options. Outside of that I'd probably suggest a Monk of some kind.
I think part of the difference in priorities (skills vs unarmed prowess vs gadgets) comes down to the question of which Batman is your main image of the character.
Batman from a comic? What run?
Batman from a movie? Which one?
Animated Batman? Which series/film?
This coukd change whether you would want to use something like rogue/investigator as the base class, or whether you want that monk core to the build.
I've always been partial to Batman from Batman: The Animated Series.
But don't let that limit your suggestions. :)
The issue I'm running into off the bat is that I don't have enough class feats. Batman is too much of a polymath for one character to easily encompass. I can get it most of the way there with a ruffian rogue, but I run out of class feats before I can get the monk for the unarmed stuff.
BatmanRogue 20
NGMediumHumanSkilled HeritageHumanoid
Perception +32;
Languages None selected
Skills Acrobatics +31, Arcana +27, Athletics +36, Crafting +27, Deception +32, Intimidation +35, Lore: Genealogy or Heraldry +27, Lore: Underworld Lore +33, Medicine +26, Nature +26, Occultism +27, Performance +26, Religion +26, Society +33, Stealth +35, Survival +28, Thievery +32
Str +5, Dex +4, Con +3, Int +5, Wis +4, Cha +4
Items Bracers of Armor III, Cloak of the Bat (Greater), Dread Blindfold, Handwraps of Mighty Blows (+3 Major Striking), Diadem of Intellect, Armbands of Athleticism (Greater), Daredevil Boots (Greater)
AC 43, Fort +30, Ref +35, Will +33; Improved Evasion, Slippery Mind
HP 228
Trickster's Ace Requirements When you make your daily preparations, you must specify a trigger for this reaction using the same restrictions as the triggers for the Ready action. You also choose a single spell from the arcane, divine, occult, or primal list of 4th level or lower. The spell can’t have a cost, nor can its casting time be more than 10 minutes. The spell must be able to target a single creature, and you must be a valid target for it. Trigger You specify the trigger when you make your daily preparations (see Requirements below). Whether from jury-rigged magic items, stolen magical essence, or other means, you have a contingency in your back pocket for desperate situations. When the trigger occurs, you cause the spell to come into effect. The spell targets only you, no matter how many creatures it would affect normally. If you define particularly complicated conditions, as determined by the GM, the trigger might fail. Once the contingency is triggered, the spell is expended until your next daily preparations.
Sidestep Trigger The attack roll for a Strike targeting you fails or critically fails. You deftly step out of the way of an attack, letting the blow continue to the creature next to you. You redirect the attack to a creature of your choice that is adjacent to you and within the reach of the triggering attack. The attacker rerolls the Strike’s attack roll against the new target.
Keep Up Appearances Access regional requirement Trigger You are affected by an emotion effect. Roll a Deception check and compare the result to any observing creatures’ Perception DCs. On a success, that creature believes you were unaffected by the emotion effect. A creature tricked in this manner can’t benefit from the emotion effect and can’t use abilities that require you to be under this emotion effect; for example, if you successfully use this ability to trick a will-o’-wisp into believing you aren’t under a fear effect, it can’t use its Feed on Fear ability on you.
Hidden Paragon Frequency once per hour Prerequisites legendary in Stealth Trigger You successfully use Stealth to Hide and become hidden from all of your current foes, or use Stealth to Sneak and become undetected to all your current foes. When you put your mind to slipping out of sight, you disappear completely. You become invisible for 1 minute, even if you use a hostile action. Not even glitterdust, see invisibility, or similar effects can reveal you, though creatures can still use the Seek action to locate you as normal.
You're Next Prerequisites trained in Intimidation Trigger You reduce an enemy to 0 hit points. After downing a foe, you menacingly remind another foe that you’re coming after them next. Attempt an Intimidation check with a +2 circumstance bonus to Demoralize a single creature that you can see and that can see you. If you have legendary proficiency in Intimidation, you can use this as a free action with the same trigger.
Master Strike Trigger Your Strike hits a flat-footed creature and deals damage. The target attempts a Fortitude save at your class DC. It then becomes temporarily immune to your Master Strike for 1 day. Critical Success The target is unaffected. Success The target is enfeebled 2 until the end of your next turn. Failure The target is paralyzed for 4 rounds. Critical Failure The target is paralyzed for 4 rounds, knocked unconscious for 2 hours, or killed (your choice).
Speed 25 feet
Melee +3 Major Striking Speed Keen Grevious Special Unarmed Crane Wing +34 (Agile, Finesse, Nonlethal, Unarmed), Damage 4d6+11 (B)
Spring from the Shadows Leaping out from hiding, you assail your target when they least expect it. You Stride up to your Speed, but you must end your movement next to an enemy you’re hidden from or undetected by. You then Strike that enemy; you remain hidden from or undetected by that creature until after you Strike. You can use Spring from the Shadows while Burrowing, Climbing, Flying, or Swimming instead of Striding if you have the corresponding movement type.
Kip Up Prerequisites master in Acrobatics You stand up. This movement doesn’t trigger reactions.
Reveal Machinations Prerequisites legendary in Deception You reveal that you played a minor but recurring role in another humanoid’s life—or at least convince them that’s the case. Attempt a Deception check against the target’s Will DC. On a success, the revelation makes them frightened 2, and on a critical success they are frightened 3. In addition, you gain information about the subject as though you had attempted to Recall Knowledge about them using an appropriate skill and received the same result on your roll. You can’t use this ability against the same humanoid again until 1 day has passed and you’ve also successfully disguised yourself as a different person.
Debilitating Strike Trigger Your Strike hits a flat-footed creature and deals damage. You apply one of the following debilitations, which lasts until the end of your next turn. Debilitation The target takes a –10-foot status penalty to its Speeds. Debilitation The target becomes enfeebled 1.
Flurry of Blows Make two unarmed Strikes. If both hit the same creature, combine their damage for the purpose of resistances and weaknesses. Apply your multiple attack penalty to the Strikes normally. As it has the flourish trait, you can use Flurry of Blows only once per turn.
Cloak of the Bat (Greater) Activate command, Interact; Frequency once per day; Effect You can either transform the cloak into bat-like wings that grant you a fly Speed of 30 feet for 10 minutes, or have the cloak turn you into a bat by casting a 4th-level pest form spell on you.
Dread Blindfold Activate command; Frequency once per minute; Trigger You damage a creature with a Strike; Effect Your target is gripped by intense fear. This has the effect of a DC 37 phantasmal killer spell, but it is an enchantment instead of an illusion. The creature is then temporarily immune for 24 hours.
Diadem of Intellect Activate envision; Frequency once per hour; Effect You gain the effects of hypercognition.
Daredevil Boots (Greater) Activate command; Frequency once per day; Effect The boots cast freedom of movement on you.
Sneak Attack Deals 4d6 extra precision damage to flat-footed creatures.
Addtional Feats Additional Lore, Alchemical Crafting, Alchemist Dedication, Assurance, Backup Disguise, Blank Slate, Brutal Beating, Cat Fall, Cloud Jump, Courtly Graces, Dread Striker, Experienced Tracker, Foil Senses, Group Coercion, Intimidating Prowess, Lasting Coercion, Legendary Codebreaker, Legendary Linguist, Legendary Sneak, Legendary Thief, Monk Dedication, Monk's Flurry, Multilingual, Pickpocket, Quick Climber, Rapid Mantel, Skilled Heritage, Sneak Savant, Steady Balance, Streetwise, Swift Sneak, Terrified Retreat, Titan Wrestler, Trap Finder
Addtional Specials Assurance (Athletics), Deny Advantage, Double Debilitation, Great Fortitude, Infused Reagents, Light Armor Mastery, Master Tricks, Powerful Fist, Rogue's Racket (Ruffian Racket), Skilled Heritage (Acrobatics), Sneak Attack, Surprise Attack, Weapon Tricks
Nice! Thanks for putting in all the efforts.
...he should use Wolf Style rather than Crane...
Wrong. You clearly need a Bat stance there!
Yeah batman's martial arts is a very minimalist 1-2 combo attack style. He does the slight dodges that minimizes how much he moves. He also takes advantage of his cape. Pf1 had quite a few good ways to build him.
Okay, Batman typically fights solo, or occasionally with a lower level sidekick. That makes him a good candidate to use the Gestalt rules in the forthcoming GMG. Let's call him a Monk/Rogue. And since we've got more feats to use now, we can probably fit in the Alchemist dedication/some of those feats as well. Bat Shark Repellant is probably an uncommon alchemical item, but the access condition is "Be Batman", so I think we're good there.
I'd personally say the batsuit counts as armor of some sort (probably studded leather) rather than him using Bracers, and might argue he should use Wolf Style rather than Crane, but that otherwise seems quite good to me.
I actually meant to give him armor and just forgot. The bracers were meant to represent his bracers, but they could probably be replaced with something else.
And I actually decided against using a a stance at all in the end. Batman is famous for the whole 127 martial arts styles thing, rather than having single style he focused on. If I'd had unlimited class feats, I would have give him every style instead. I just forgot to remove the Crane Strikes.