[Coronavirus] The best defense is ...


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I had a brother ask me a few weeks ago if we were worried about the Corona virus because we live in a large college town with an incredibly diverse campus and I told him someone is more likely to hand me a Corona then give me the corona virus.


First community transmission in the US.

It's here and we are not ready to handle it.


But this is just the sort of thing Mike Pence is great at! He'll save us!!

Sovereign Court

AngryNerdRageDemon wrote:
literallyrefusetoreadanythingbutthispartofthetitle wrote:
The best defense is...

...more FRESH FRUIT *exaggerated facial tic*!!!


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Sarcastic Smurf wrote:
But this is just the sort of thing Mike Pence is great at! He'll save us!!

[COPIOUS SWEARING DELETED]

RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32

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In the continuing saga ...


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Oh man, I just bought 6,000 wrestling masks!


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captain yesterday wrote:
Oh man, I just bought 6,000 wrestling masks!

And now I'm picturing a post-apocalyptic movie where everyone is luchadores.

G*~~$#n I want that movie.

Silver Crusade

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quibblemuch wrote:
captain yesterday wrote:
Oh man, I just bought 6,000 wrestling masks!

And now I'm picturing a post-apocalyptic movie where everyone is luchadores.

G~$+$%n I want that movie.

There's a comic.


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Keep in mind that the WHO has instructed that unless you are a health care worker, in the Wuhan province, or have flu symptoms, you shouldn't be wearing a mask - they recommend rational use of medical supplies so as not to cause shortages that will be counter productive.


Tender Tendrils wrote:
Keep in mind that the WHO has instructed that unless you are a health care worker, in the Wuhan province, or have flu symptoms, you shouldn't be wearing a mask - they recommend rational use of medical supplies so as not to cause shortages that will be counter productive.

This - as well they remind that the most important thing is wash in g hands:

1) wash hands with soap and water; primary thing that you can do and by far lays the most dividends

2) distant second is disinfect or clean areas or stuff

3) masks are a “sometimes thing” that needs to be relegated to workers or those who are actually already sick - even then they are not a magical cure-all and need to be treated properly

Remember, this is in order to maximize the benefit for you as an individual, as well as society as a whole. You got self interest? Wash hands and only get masks for workers of sick. You got societal interests? Wash hands and only get masks for workers or sick. You want to see everything burn? Don’t; that’s a loser’s attitude for losers - things may suck right now, and that’s rough, but with time and patience you can get the help you need and things will eventually get better; together. So wash your flippin’ hands, and leave the masks to medical workers and the sick.


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Rysky wrote:
quibblemuch wrote:
captain yesterday wrote:
Oh man, I just bought 6,000 wrestling masks!

And now I'm picturing a post-apocalyptic movie where everyone is luchadores.

G~$+$%n I want that movie.

There's a comic.

So, you're saying there's a chance!


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Rysky wrote:
quibblemuch wrote:
captain yesterday wrote:
Oh man, I just bought 6,000 wrestling masks!

And now I'm picturing a post-apocalyptic movie where everyone is luchadores.

G~$+$%n I want that movie.

There's a comic.

Holy s~$&.


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Tacticslion wrote:
Tender Tendrils wrote:
Keep in mind that the WHO has instructed that unless you are a health care worker, in the Wuhan province, or have flu symptoms, you shouldn't be wearing a mask - they recommend rational use of medical supplies so as not to cause shortages that will be counter productive.

This - as well they remind that the most important thing is wash in g hands:

1) wash hands with soap and water; primary thing that you can do and by far lays the most dividends

Wash your hands and practice not touching your face.

Which is hard.


Super-true!

... but my faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaace *touch-touch*


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It's the other parts of my body I'm told not to touch in public.


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Cap'n Yesterday, FaWtL Tourism wrote:
It's the other parts of my body I'm told not to touch in public.

Those dangerously sensual kneecaps of yours...

Scarab Sages

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Tacticslion wrote:

Super-true!

... but my faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaace *touch-touch*

Look on the bright side: Now's your chance to be just like this guy!!!


I am afraid I will never be like that guy.

But fun music!

Scarab Sages

"In the U.S., it’s really a fear based on media and this being something new...."


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And the first sentence of the next paragraph is:

Quote:
The coronavirus outbreak, however, is proving to be more deadly than the flu.


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That story is also nearly a month old. We now have many more cases than at that time, including untraceable community transmissions - suggesting a larger population of unknown cases.

Right now, the flu is still more of a threat in the sense that the fever you just came down is more likely to be a seasonal flu than COVID-19. That's likely to remain true for at least the next couple of weeks. I wouldn't count on it for much longer than that. This is roughly as contagious as seasonal flu, but due to the lack of vaccinations or residual immunity will circulate even faster.

Hopefully the CDC will get its act together on testing and we'll have a better idea where we stand soon.

Wash your hands.
Work from home if you can.
Avoid large social gatherings.


thejeff wrote:
Wash your hands.

I can do that.

Quote:
Work from home if you can.

I can't do that.

Quote:
Avoid large social gatherings.

Look at where I live!

Scarab Sages

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Fumarole wrote:

And the first sentence of the next paragraph is:

Quote:
The coronavirus outbreak, however, is proving to be more deadly than the flu.

...which says very little by itself. Statistics are a PITA like that.

If there's one thing the last 20 years should have taught EVERYONE, it's that terror is a far greater danger than any supposed reason for it.

Fear makes you stupid. Fear makes you evil. Fear makes you submissive...and it does not even help you solve real problems. A great leader - arguably the greatest his country ever had - famously said "the only thing we have to fear is fear itself". Who in all the world is daring to say that now?


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I'm Hiding In Your Closet wrote:
Fumarole wrote:

And the first sentence of the next paragraph is:

Quote:
The coronavirus outbreak, however, is proving to be more deadly than the flu.

...which says very little by itself. Statistics are a PITA like that.

If there's one thing the last 20 years should have taught EVERYONE, it's that terror is a far greater danger than any supposed reason for it.

Fear makes you stupid. Fear makes you evil. Fear makes you submissive...and it does not even help you solve real problems. A great leader - arguably the greatest his country ever had - famously said "the only thing we have to fear is fear itself". Who in all the world is daring to say that now?

On the other hand complacency and denial are pretty dangerous themselves.

Yes, we need to avoid panic, but we also need to recognize reality and prepare. This is going to get bad. It's not going to be as catastrophic as some paint it, but it's almost certainly going to be worse than any epidemic we've seen in my life.

Amplified by how badly this has been handled so far by the US government - and by some others, especially Iran.

It's still possible we could contain this and avoid or at least delay a major US outbreak - South Korea seems to be doing a good job - but we're not yet taking the steps necessary to succeed.


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The only remedies for fear and ignorance are respect and education.

RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32

Freehold DM wrote:
The only remedies for fear and ignorance are respect and education.

War Is Peace!

Freedom Is Slavery!
Ignorance Is Strength!


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Every time this is reported on the news, they should take 45-60 seconds to remind people:

* Wash your hands frequently and thoroughly

* Don't touch your face.

* If you are sick and can stay home/work from home, do so.

* Make sure you and your kids are up to date on all your vaccinations, including your annual flu shot. If you aren't don't wait: Do It Now.

Every time. Make it more prevalent and unforgettable than the most annoying TV commercial.

And fire this idiot.


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Paizo offices are in Redmond, King County, Washington.

First two US deaths are from "community transmission", (no known contact with anyone else with the virus) in King County, Washington.

Wash your hands frequently
Don't touch your face.
Cover your cough.
Stay home if you're sick
Wash your hands

Stay safe Paizo people.


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Washington county recommends all 2.2M residents to work from home

Hopefully people that can work remotely do so. Stay safe, Paizo.

Scarab Sages

ProTip: Beware of ibuprofen (if you happen to catch the scourge, that is).


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I'm Hiding In Your Closet wrote:
ProTip: Beware of ibuprofen (if you happen to catch the scourge, that is).

The data on ibuprofen is mixed. The current position, based on an exhaustive study by the German response to the crisis, is that ibuprofen may exacerbate a small number of cases but also may help more.

Where the headache occurs is that people on ibuprofen for inflammatory conditions are also in the category of most at-risk for COVID-19 infection, so in this case there is a correlation effect which may not be causal. Obviously this is something they're looking at with alacrity, given how many people pop ibuprofen the second they feel slightly unwell (especially if they are intolerant to paracetamol).


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West Virginia is the only state without any official cases of corona virus, thus proving my theory that no one actually goes TO West Virginia, people only LEAVE West Virginia.


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*steps up onto a soapbox, clears throat*

"MAINTAINING SOCIAL DISTANCE IS GREATER THAN THREE FEET AWAY. IF YOU CAN EXTEND YOUR ARMS AND TOUCH SOMEONE, YOU ARE TOO CLOSE TO THEM!" *gives a slight bow, steps down*

Please, seriously, for the love of whatever for the folks who haven't figured this out yet, please be considerate of everyone else.

On the flu shot:

I had a horribad experience with 'flu' shots when I was in the Service. For two separate forward deployments the crew was given a battery of them. We did 'okay' until we ate at dinner time, then we'd cross-pollinate and everything would mutate and by the time we hit port we'd already be sick, and we wouldn't be immunized against what we were given the battery for.

The one time I took a private industry one, I ended up far more ill during the 'flu season' than if I had gone without, during a 'mild' year.

They do not work for everyone.

RPG Superstar 2015 Top 8

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"Because sometimes you need a very British person to tell you to CALM DOWN."

(Note: the linked to video is, while sassy, well researched and informative, with the caveat that she is a layperson and not a medical professional. Still it's one of the few things I've watched on coronavirus that I have found helpful and also yet made me smile. If you have contacts who are spreading various coronavirus myths, this is a good counter to that.)


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DeathQuaker wrote:

"Because sometimes you need a very British person to tell you to CALM DOWN."

(Note: the linked to video is, while sassy, well researched and informative, with the caveat that she is a layperson and not a medical professional. Still it's one of the few things I've watched on coronavirus that I have found helpful and also yet made me smile. If you have contacts who are spreading various coronavirus myths, this is a good counter to that.)

That was bloody brilliant, DQ. Thanks for that! :)

RPG Superstar 2015 Top 8

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My pleasure. :)


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Things have gone from Freaky, to Super Freaky here in NY.

New York State, with 6 percent of the U.S. population, now accounts for around half of all cases in the country.

Here are the highlights of Mr. Cuomo’s executive order, which takes effect Sunday at 8 p.m.:

Healthy people under 70 should limit outdoor activity to getting groceries and medicine, but they may exercise, walk outside and participate in other noncontact physical activities if they stay six feet away from others.

Mass transit will keep running, but people should not use it unless they absolutely must. Roads will remain open.

Nonessential gatherings of any size for any reason are banned.

There are stronger restrictions for people who are 70 and older, have compromised immune systems or have underlying illnesses. Those rules include wearing masks when in the company of others and not visiting households with multiple people.

Businesses considered nonessential must keep all of their workers at home.

Essential businesses that can stay open include: grocers and restaurants, health care providers, pharmacies, gas stations, convenience stores, banks, hardware stores, laundromats and cleaners, child-care providers, auto repair shops, utility companies, warehouses and distributors, delivery services, plumbers and other skilled contractors, animal-care providers, transportation providers, construction companies and many kinds of manufacturers.

Snake Plissken is the new Emperor of New York.
All hail the New Ruler of New York!

Businesses that violate the order will be fined and forced to close. The state does not plan to fine people who violate the regulations, Mr. Cuomo said.

“These provisions will be enforced,” the governor said at a briefing in Albany. “These are not helpful hints.”

There is more, but that's the main stuff. And to be clear, this is not just NYC. This is the entire State of New York!

Be well out there folks!


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It's going to come everywhere. Be ready. Probably the sooner it comes to you, the better off your area will be. (Unless it comes sooner because it's already bad, which is what it currently looks like.)

Hopefully we're going to get some financial support at least - both for individuals and for (small) businesses that need to shut down. None of this is going to be short term.

And I hope those restaurants that stay open are only doing take out.


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Fergie wrote:

Things have gone from Freaky, to Super Freaky here in NY.

New York State, with 6 percent of the U.S. population, now accounts for around half of all cases in the country.

Here are the highlights of Mr. Cuomo’s executive order, which takes effect Sunday at 8 p.m.:

Healthy people under 70 should limit outdoor activity to getting groceries and medicine, but they may exercise, walk outside and participate in other noncontact physical activities if they stay six feet away from others.

Mass transit will keep running, but people should not use it unless they absolutely must. Roads will remain open.

Nonessential gatherings of any size for any reason are banned.

There are stronger restrictions for people who are 70 and older, have compromised immune systems or have underlying illnesses. Those rules include wearing masks when in the company of others and not visiting households with multiple people.

Businesses considered nonessential must keep all of their workers at home.

Essential businesses that can stay open include: grocers and restaurants, health care providers, pharmacies, gas stations, convenience stores, banks, hardware stores, laundromats and cleaners, child-care providers, auto repair shops, utility companies, warehouses and distributors, delivery services, plumbers and other skilled contractors, animal-care providers, transportation providers, construction companies and many kinds of manufacturers.

Snake Plissken is the new Emperor of New York.
All hail the New Ruler of New York!

Businesses that violate the order will be fined and forced to close. The state does not plan to fine people who violate the regulations, Mr. Cuomo said.

“These provisions will be enforced,” the governor said at a briefing in Albany. “These are not helpful hints.”

There is more, but that's the main stuff. And to be clear, this is not just NYC. This is the entire State of New York!

Be well out there folks!

it seems that I am "vital".

See you at work on Monday.


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You are vital, FH!

... but I'm sorry you're forced to go to work, because that sucks and seems... like a poor choice on your management's part.


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Minnesota has added grocery store employees to the list of emergency workers, which makes them eligible for state provided child care.


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That means IL still has a lot to learn.


Further to my last comment, the consensus is now that ibuprofen makes the symptoms worse because it encourages inflammation, but the body's natural response to coronavirus is inflammation, so it can increase it to dangerous levels.
The recommendation now is that paracetamol is more effective in treating the symptoms of coronavirus safely (but to be careful with dosage).


If we run low on masks, we can check costume stores. Hmm..I heard that the local adult store has masks with zippers...


Latex masks can be disinfected, right?


There are vast differences here in the twin cities as to what retailers are employing for social distancing...

I went to a liquor store and they had employees guarding the door. You had to wait in line to go in. At the checkout they set up an additional barrier table so the shop keep only scanned your items and didnt touch your card or cash. When I left the line to get in was around the building, which made me glad that I bought a ton of booze to hold me over for awhile...

After grabbing groceries and other mentioned essentials, there were just a few key items I wanted. I headed to a specialized food store and they had no measures in place. Dozens of people were crammed into the small space. The cashier had gloves on but was handling cash and cards...

Thankfully I am working from home until at least May. After todays experience im going to limit going out as much as possible.

Take care, be safe, and wash yo filthy hands!


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

And whatever you do, don't touch your face. No matter how hard it is.


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Irontruth wrote:
Phillip Gastone wrote:
If we run low on masks, we can check costume stores. Hmm..I heard that the local adult store has masks with zippers...
Latex masks can be disinfected, right?

You might as well just go all out.

RPG Superstar 2015 Top 8

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Werthead wrote:
Further to my last comment, the consensus is now that ibuprofen makes the symptoms worse because it encourages inflammation, but the body's natural response to coronavirus is inflammation, so it can increase it to dangerous levels.

Wait, wait, wait, wait, no. First, ibuprofen is an NSAID -- a non-steroidal ANTI-inflammatory drug. It explicitly reduces inflammation, not the opposite. In general, people take it for pain and fever because it lowers the inflammation associated with these symptoms.

Secondly, there is absolutely no "consensus" anywhere.
While France's health minister warned against the use of anti-inflammatories*, the World Health Organization is NOT currently recommending against use of ibuprofen and report that no studies report this.

The one set of studies people link to when talking about this point to articles in https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanres/article/PIIS2213-2600(20)30116-8/ fulltext]the Lancet, which suggests there may be something that improves chances of infection correlated to anti-inflammatory use BUT THESE STUDIES ARE IN PATIENTS WHO HAVE HYPERTENSION AND DIABETES and were already ON course of anti-inflammatory drugs (probably at high dosages) for these purposes. These people may also be susceptible to increased infection due to their poor health to begin with.

Unfounded speculation:
(If an anti-inflammatory DOES increase risk of infection--total non informed guess is that inflammation is an immune system response, so reducing inflammation could in extreme circumstances be immunosuppressive??)

It is important to please look up sources and cite them before sharing what can be bad information. Right now I think studies are still being done.

Quote:
The recommendation now is that paracetamol is more effective in treating the symptoms of coronavirus safely (but to be careful with dosage).

The reason you take either anti-inflammatories like ibuprofen (e.g., Advil, Motrin or aspirin or analgesics like acetaminophen/paracetamol (e.g., Tylenol) in the case of respiratory illness is to reduce fever and aches (it is not and will never do a damn thing for the actual respiratory infection). And certainly, acetaminophen is totally effective for that anyway, so if you're in any doubt take it (excepting of course people who are told by their doctor not to take acetaminophen/paracetamol because they have a liver condition or something). No one should ever, for any reason, be taking more than the dose indicated on the package (typically, two every four hours) or than what their doctor tells them they can take. Overdosage of NSAIDs can cause kidney damage and acetaminophen can cause liver damage to even totally healthy people. (I know people take more than the dose on the package all the time, but quite frankly they're stupid and they deserve any longterm harm they are doing to themselves by not being able to follow simple instructions, especially since often for drugs like these, more beyond the recommended dose doesn't much amplify the effect.)

And the one thing the Health Minister of France said that is absolutely true: if you are taking anti-inflammatories or if you are in doubt, contact your doctor.

While doctors are human and can make mistakes, their best interest is your health and survival and will not advise something that could unnecessarily hurt you.

* Rough translation of the linked Tweet:

"Taking anti-inflammatories (ibuprofen, cortisone, ...) could be a factor that aggravates infection. In case of fever, take paracetamol (acetaminophen). If you are already taking anti-inflammatories or if in doubt, consult with your physician."

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