High Total Skill bonuses.


Rules Questions


I am relatively new to Starfinder and a D20 system in general. I have recently created a Halfling, Ghost, Operative. Once all the skill modifiers have been totalled up ( Race + Class + Ability + Skill focus ) I have a Steakth Modifier of +12.
Is this way too high for a 1st level character or am I missing something?

Thanks in advance.


Sounds right for this combination. +13 is the highest you can get as a permanent bonus at level 1, I believe, although a biohacker could use a booster for another brief +2 enhancement bonus.


Xenocrat wrote:
Sounds right for this combination. +13 is the highest you can get as a permanent bonus at level 1, I believe, although a biohacker could use a booster for another brief +2 enhancement bonus.

Ah ok thanks,

Do you think it would make sense to maybe build it so the bonus is less?


Hofor Weaselwise wrote:
Xenocrat wrote:
Sounds right for this combination. +13 is the highest you can get as a permanent bonus at level 1, I believe, although a biohacker could use a booster for another brief +2 enhancement bonus.

Ah ok thanks,

Do you think it would make sense to maybe build it so the bonus is less?

If it's your trick attack skill I'd think it makes sense for it to be as high as possible.


Thanks, that makes sense.


When taken in a vacuum, +12 does seem pretty high.

It helps to think about it like this: The DC for trick attack is 20+CR. So against a CR 1 opponent, even with a +12, you're still looking at a pretty reasonable failure rate. So no, don't build it to be lower.


My level 1 Ysoki Wild Warden Operative (Explorer) has a +15 to trick attack with Survival - and he only has a +1 wisdom.

+1 rank, +3 class, +1 wisdom, +2 racial, +3 skill focus (insight), +1 theme, +4 operative specialization

He also has a +15 to ride his creature companion mount, with a +4 from a rider's kit (circumstance) instead of the specialization bonus. Which was actually my main concern when building this guy - the nice trick attack was a bonus.


There's a fun trick you can do with the Geneturge mystic where you can get the ability to take 10 on a particular skill at level 1.

I have an Exo-Cortex Mechanic 1/Geneturge Mystic 1 who doesn't roll for computers checks; she just gets a 24 automatically (which blows pretty much any level 2 computers check out of the water).


Dracomicron wrote:

There's a fun trick you can do with the Geneturge mystic where you can get the ability to take 10 on a particular skill at level 1.

I have an Exo-Cortex Mechanic 1/Geneturge Mystic 1 who doesn't roll for computers checks; she just gets a 24 automatically (which blows pretty much any level 2 computers check out of the water).

I feel like Expanded Skill Channeling epiphany in COM killed off most of the appeal of the Geneturge Mystic for me, but I guess that take 10 ability is still useful. And the +3 bulk arms.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

I think the highest you can get a skill at first level (outside trick attacks) is +14.

+1 Rank
+4 Ability Score of 18
+2 Lashunta
+1 Theme
+3 Skill Focus
+3 Class Skill

There are some ways to boost this temporarily as well for a particular roll (using enchantment bonuses) but I'm unaware of any other permanent boosts available at 1st level.

Operatives with +13 or higher stealth and piloting (especially piloting) seem to be pretty common in organised play.

Dataphiles

OP, do note, in relation to Stealth specifically, NPC perception bonuses scale and end up being decently high. Also, Perception works differently in relation to distance than the cumulative -2 per 10ft from Pathfinder 1E.


"Dr." Cupi wrote:
OP, do note, in relation to Stealth specifically, NPC perception bonuses scale and end up being decently high. Also, Perception works differently in relation to distance than the cumulative -2 per 10ft from Pathfinder 1E.

How does it work differently?


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Pathfinder gives a general rule of -2 per 10 ft. The only distance-based perception penalties in Starfinder that are defined in the books (GMS can obviously use other circumstance penalties as the feel appropriate) are the biome specific ones in the environment section of the CRB. Those tend to be perception-type dependent (sight based, sound based, etc)


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Xenocrat wrote:
Dracomicron wrote:

There's a fun trick you can do with the Geneturge mystic where you can get the ability to take 10 on a particular skill at level 1.

I have an Exo-Cortex Mechanic 1/Geneturge Mystic 1 who doesn't roll for computers checks; she just gets a 24 automatically (which blows pretty much any level 2 computers check out of the water).

I feel like Expanded Skill Channeling epiphany in COM killed off most of the appeal of the Geneturge Mystic for me, but I guess that take 10 ability is still useful. And the +3 bulk arms.

Last night the GM for Withering World asked for a computer check. The ability to not roll a die, look him in the eye, and say, "24" was priceless. I felt like a cat who stares into their human's eyes as they knock a glass off the counter.


HammerJack wrote:
Pathfinder gives a general rule of -2 per 10 ft. The only distance-based perception penalties in Starfinder that are defined in the books (GMS can obviously use other circumstance penalties as the feel appropriate) are the biome specific ones in the environment section of the CRB. Those tend to be perception-type dependent (sight based, sound based, etc)

Yes I see that distance is not on the perception table at all.

Another one of those things we just carried over from PF1 without ever realizing it.

Since the GM has latitude to assign modifiers I am ok keep this in place for our game.


Seems excessive, given how much more ranged combat happens in SF than in PF.

Would you allow a spotter to tell a ranged teammate which square to fire into? Otherwise a soldier with a weapon range of 100 or 120 feet is likely to have a negative to a perception roll before they even get out of the first range increment, making an already difficult perception check basically impossible.


Pantshandshake wrote:

Seems excessive, given how much more ranged combat happens in SF than in PF.

Would you allow a spotter to tell a ranged teammate which square to fire into? Otherwise a soldier with a weapon range of 100 or 120 feet is likely to have a negative to a perception roll before they even get out of the first range increment, making an already difficult perception check basically impossible.

Yes I allow spotters to tell a ranged teammate which square to fire into, provided they have the necessary equipment.

SF has all sorts of vision enhancing devices such as binoculars and scopes.

I do not necessarily make opposing sides make a perception roll unless one or both sides are taking precautions

A lot of times it is a simple take 10 for the highest perception on each side and that determines who sees who first and at what range.

It is not too difficult to see an enemy squad approaching in the open from a couple of hundred feet away (no perception needed).

If my players want to determining who the squad leader is (assuming he is not wearing gear that makes him a dead give away) then they have to make a perception check, if they want to single him out.

I use perception more to notice details on what they see as opposed to do they see it at all.


Ah, ok. That makes more sense, then.


HammerJack wrote:
are the biome specific ones in the environment section of the CRB

Wow... did I forget about those or did I never even read them?

You'd imagine the Perception entry in the skills chapter would bother to mention these.

This adds a whole new layer of complexity to Stealth vs. Perception.

Dataphiles

Correct. Now the RAW best way to snipe is to pick up an Amulet of Camouflage.

Also, if I may, I'd look at the skill unlock for Perception as a more reasonable system of Perception modifiers.

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