Rat-Folk Swash X Investigator (Advice on Feats and skills)


Advice


I have a build line out just need some advice on a few things

The class Is inspired blade 1 / Empiricist x

I need advice on my feats after level 1

I know at level 1 I am taking fencing grace but after words i am unsure.

I start at level 3 and will go for a while.

I wanted to not focus 100% on combat but still be able to be competent when needed to be

My Stats are Stats: STR: 10 Dex 18 CON 12 INT 18 WIS 12 CHA 7 (Stats are base on a 20 point buy after racial Adjustments)

My other request for help is i could use advice on my skills (I Have so many and I want to have a good amount but unsure what ones should i focus more on)

Like i know I want UMD for sure


I have done a very similar thing in the past (used the lamp lighter investigator archetype, worth a look).

One thing I highly recommend is combat reflexes. You’re Dex focused and you can parry, attacks of opp are treasured things to you.

Also worth considering several investigator talents are worth grabbing quick. Quick study, alchemist discoveries. It’s things worth grabbing. :) worth the feat to pick up quick.


Chromantic Durgon <3 wrote:

I have done a very similar thing in the past (used the lamp lighter investigator archetype, worth a look).

One thing I highly recommend is combat reflexes. You’re Dex focused and you can parry, attacks of opp are treasured things to you.

Also worth considering several investigator talents are worth grabbing quick. Quick study, alchemist discoveries. It’s things worth grabbing. :) worth the feat to pick up quick.

Oh could you give me a little advice on my skills. Please :)


I think for skills it kinda depends on who else is in the party.

There are ways to make diplomacy key off of Int if you need to but I wouldn’t go that route if you have a charisma character in the party cause it’s easier for the investigator to outshine people in skills.

I Is probably the best skills class in the entire game. For you focus on Dex and int skills, you should be putting points in every knowledge probably, since int is the rarest mental stat to be a key stat.


Nosta1300 wrote:
My Stats are Stats: STR: 10 Dex 18 CON 12 INT 18 WIS 12 CHA 7 (Stats are base on a 20 point buy after racial Adjustments)

I count this as a 22 point buy. Remember you have a penalty to STR. You could drop STR to 8 (10 -2 racial), or you could drop WIS to 10. I'd go with WIS because I don't like having to deal with encumberance penalties, and WIS is mainly for Will Perception and Will saves (both of which you should be good at anyway).

The Swashtigator - and especially the Empiricist - really shines in a low point buy (10-15 points). It mitigates the problems you'd have with less points to spend. With a 20 point buy I wouldn't worry about Empiricist unless you're doing it for flavour reasons. I 100% agree with Chromatic Dragon <3 that Lamplighter is an archetype you should check out.

Your 5th level feat should probably be Extra Talent: Quick Study. For others you could look at Sickening Offensive for some debuffing, or Swift Aid, or things like Expanded/Underworld Inspiration. Later there's Amazing Inspiration.

I looked at the Ratfolk FCB and it's kinda underwhelming. You'll have more than enough skills, so I'd take HP every level. Your level 3 feat could even go into Toughness if you have nothing else you want.

Remember that when you Parry you take a penalty to your roll if you're smaller than your foe, so adding a little to your defenses won't hurt.


Also I as Chromatic Dragon <3 pointed out, it's very easy for an Investigstor to make other PCs completely irrelevant for skill checks, so see what they're bringing to the table and plan your skills around them. You don't have to ignore a skill just because someone else is using it, but if you take every skill that someone else took they'll get bored/annoyed pretty quickly.

I'd put 1 point into every knowledge skill so that you can use them and make use of free inspiration - 1 point = 1d20+8+1d6 (average ~22) which is still likely the best roll in the party.


On encumbrance

Small races gear ways 1/4 so you do have some wiggle room with regards to dropping strength.


Chromantic Durgon <3 wrote:

I think for skills it kinda depends on who else is in the party.

There are ways to make diplomacy key off of Int if you need to but I wouldn’t go that route if you have a charisma character in the party cause it’s easier for the investigator to outshine people in skills.

I Is probably the best skills class in the entire game. For you focus on Dex and int skills, you should be putting points in every knowledge probably, since int is the rarest mental stat to be a key stat.

I see. Truth be told i might be able to talk the GM in to letting me take the 3.5 feat knowledge devotion so that could be fun

and I looked at Lamplighter it looks just about what i need. thank you for recommending it


@ MrCharisma

thank you! for pointing the point buy mistake.

and I actually do want empiricist for role-play as being a logical person is what my character ( Sir Artemis Shrewd )

could you recommend traits?


Student of Philosophy is the obvious choice.

I'd with LIFE OF TOIL or something similar because your Fort save is going to Suck =P (honestly I'd drop your INT to 17 and up your CON to 14 as well, but again it depends how well it fits your character concept).


MrCharisma wrote:

Student of Philosophy is the obvious choice.

I'd with LIFE OF TOIL or something similar because your Fort save is going to Suck =P (honestly I'd drop your INT to 17 and up your CON to 14 as well, but again it depends how well it fits your character concept).

I see.

Well I could do my stats like that and give the +1 at level 4 to my INT.

can i have my lamp-lighter torch be my ioun torch?

or do i need to hold the torch and if so can i do it in my tail?


Yeah that's what I'd do with my INT.

I think your torch (which you use to burn extracts) has to be a fire of some kind. Your character can see in the dark, so you'l only use this for burning extracts or helping others. I wouldn't bother with an Ioun torch, I'd just grab a regular torch since you can light it at will as a standard action.

And yea I think you can hold the torch in your tail. You might need to spend a feat/trait to do it though, I'm not that familiar with Ratfolk.


MrCharisma wrote:

Yeah that's what I'd do with my INT.

I think your torch (which you use to burn extracts) has to be a fire of some kind. Your character can see in the dark, so you'l only use this for burning extracts or helping others. I wouldn't bother with an Ioun torch, I'd just grab a regular torch since you can light it at will as a standard action.

And yea I think you can hold the torch in your tail. You might need to spend a feat/trait to do it though, I'm not that familiar with Ratfolk.

well there's nothing stopping me from holding it my hand right? I keep thinking it effects some of swashbuckler features


I think it affects fencing grace, so a prehensile tail ability will help. This only matters if you plan to hold the torch while attacking though.

Silver Crusade

For stats, I suggest:

Str 8 (I presume weight and encumbrance is being tracked)
Dex 18
Con 14
Int 16
Wis 12
Cha 8

You could start with Int 17, if you wanted to stat dump more aggressively.

Traits: Student of Philosophy, one more (Resilient is good for fort saves).

Feats:
1. Fencing Grace
3. Great Fortitude (I like shoring up my weak save).

Skills:
Max ranks Acrobatics
Max ranks Diplomacy
Max ranks Perception
Max ranks Stealth
Max ranks Spellcraft (for copying spells/formulae)
One rank of Climb
One rank of Swim
One rank of Knowledge Skills

Optional: Max ranks Bluff, ranks of Craft Alchemy, more ranks of key knowledge skills.


For my character I carried around a oil lamp dangling on the end of a rod.

Silver Crusade

Chromantic Durgon <3 wrote:
One thing I highly recommend is combat reflexes. You’re Dex focused and you can parry, attacks of opp are treasured things to you.

Note that the riposte from Opportune Parry and Riposte is an Immediate Action, so you're limited to one/round.

MrCharisma wrote:
Your 5th level feat should probably be Extra Talent: Quick Study.

IMHO, you don't really need Quick Study until 8th lvl, when you get an iterative attack. My experience is that Move Action(study), 5ft step, Standard Action (attack) works fine in most cases. That being said, your talent at 8th lvl (Investigator level 7) will probably be Amazing Inspiration, so you effectively want Quick Study by 7th lvl. You likely want to work Alchemist Discovery (Infusion) in there as well.

Here's my Tiefling Inspired Blade Swashbuckler 1/ Empiricist Investigator progression, from my Curse of the Crimson Throne character. Feats are bolded.

Traits: Missing Child (campaign trait), Student of Philosophy
1. Grasping Tail (houserule: one extra feat at 1st), Weapon Finesse (Inspired Blade bonus feat), Weapon Focus (Rapier) (Inspired Blade bonus feat), Fencing Grace
3. Great Fortitude
4. Investigator Talent: Alchemist Discovery (Mutagen)
5. Extra Investigator Talent: (Expanded Inspiration)
6. Investigator Talent: Quick Study
7. Extra Investigator Talent: Alchemist Discovery (Infusion)
8. Investigator Talent: Amazing Inspiration
9. Extra Investigator Talent: Rogue Talent (Rogue Crawl)
10. Investigator Talent: Combat Inspiration

Some explanation: we're using fumble rules for this game, which had made Grasping Tail very helpful for picking up my dropped rapier (I always seem to roll drop weapon)! Rogue Crawl is for when I fall prone from a fumble: 5ft crawl away before standing up.

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