Help with a pirate like Character (Party Face / combat character) Swashbuckler


Advice


As I've have mention in other post. My Group is doing a Round Robin Style Game that'll have plenty of sea Travel.

My Character Idea is a chaotic Good Pirate like character who is noble and has a Robbin Hood of seas thing going for him.

I could use some advice on what Archetype or Archetypes My Swashbuckler should be for this.

I plan to use things like the Silver tongue Racial Trait & The memorable Social Trait to boost diplomacy


The two pirate archetypes are Shackles Corsair which is a pretty stereotypical pirate Not exactly optimized but with some thematic abilities that could come in handy, as well as a focus in intimidate. With Disarming Threat Deed you could make good face use of intimidate without poisoning the well.

The other archetype is the Okayo Corsair which has more of an eastern flavor with monk weapons and some ki abilities. Kind of a Mantis clan pirate if you're familiar with legend of the five rings.


That's basically the concept for half the swashbuckler archetypes. And several non-swashbuckler archetypes. A few questions to narrow it down:

Robin Hood of the Seas: meaning an archer, and/or meaning a pirate? Please say which apply.

Do you want to be a leader or more a solo fighter in combat?

Is DPR your main concern in a fight, or is debuffing of interest? How important is survivability?

How hard do you want to push diplomacy - to the point of using feats & class features, or are silver tongue + memorable (+some Cha) enough?


@ Ryan Freire

I am wanting more of a western Pirate feel

@ AVR

1: Robin Hood of seas. is just to describe how he plunders the rich and corrupt and gives to the down-trot and poor (but yes a pirate)

2: In combat more of a solo fighter

3: Debuffing could be fun . I would like this character to last as long as he can
'
4: could you give me some examples of what it be like either way? with or with out feats and features? I don't want to be so good that i can end every encounter but i would like to be fairly good


Shackles corsair is the only direct pirate archetype then.

I'd go down the dirty trick tree and take Dastardly Trick


Ryan Freire wrote:

Shackles corsair is the only direct pirate archetype then.

I'd go down the dirty trick tree and take Dastardly Trick

What do you think of that archetype with noble fencer / Inspired Blade?


I think noble fencer AND corsair take a little too much of the combat focused deeds away. Noble fencer in particular takes away both a cha to ac, and a cha to any save option.

Inspired blade/Corsair should be good. Noble fencer also gives up something for kind of an optional system found in ultimate intrigue. I'd find out if your gm is going to use the verbal dueling rules before putting it into rotation.

If you're looking for something to mark him out as an ex noble, maybe rich parents or the scion of nobility feat.


First off, my thought is that while you might start with swashbuckler, taking it all the way is a waste of good class levels.

Human azatariel swashbuckler 3 / tidal trickster unchained rogue 3 / devoted muse X:
Feats & talents:
1: two-weapon fighting
Human: combat expertise
Swashbuckler 1: swashbuckler finesse
3: improved feint
Rogue talent 2 (L5): Sczarni smuggler
5: two-weapon feint
7: improved TWF
9: lunge
Devoted muse 3 (L9): greater feint

Feinting is a minor debuff, and you can add more to its effect at 8th+ level. Sczarni smuggler lets you take 10 when using diplomacy to bribe, among other things - this is an example of spending a feat equivalent on social stuff. If you don't like it, spend the rogue talent on something combat related. Between azateriel and tidal trickster you have 40' move, swim 30' and can ignore difficult terrain. An azateriel doesn't get the precise strike damage bonus, but between +Cha to attack/damage on a riposte, TWF, and the unchained rogue bonuses you should be fairly effective at damage.

Human noble fencer inspired blade swashbuckler 3 / spirit dancer medium 2 / rose warden X:
Feats & talents:
1: iron will
Human: fencing grace
Inspired blade 1: inspired finesse (weapon finesse & focus w/rapier)
3: combat reflexes
5: weapon trick (one-handed)
Rose warden 1 (L6): holy thorns
7: legendary influence
Rose warden 3 (L8): rogue talent (the whole time), cunning swipe (~improved disarm)
9: weapon versatility
Rose warden 5 (L10): advanced rogue talent (petrifying strike)

Rose warden is a prestige class made for you, thematically. CG required and it's about being a good guy thief/swashbuckler. It gives a 1/day debuff in holy thorns, the whole time lets you go 'who, me?' after stabbing someone, and sneak attack and petrifying strike are damage buffs. Spirit dancer gives you the choice of +1 attack/+3 damage, a few castings of a 1st level sorc/wiz or cleric spells, or 2 bonus skills - legendary influence adds a different feat to each of these options. Noble fencer is the 'do you want to sacrifice a bit of combat ability for social skills?' option here, with its social panache deed.

Edit: Noble fencer's replacement for charmed life isn't so bad because it doesn't require an action. Swashbucklers have a real problem with too many uses for their swift/immediate action and this mitigates it. Holy thorns and spirit dancer both use swift actions too, if only 1/combat each at most.


Or if you want inspired blade might be worth sticking with swashbuckler until 5, and then shackles corsair could make 7 levels vaguely worthwhile.

Human inspired blade noble fencer shackles corsair swashbuckler 7 / exciter fractured mind spiritualist X:
Feats:
1: combat reflexes
Human: fencing grace
Inspired blade 1: inspired finesse (weapon finesse & focus w/rapier)
3: dazzling display
5: weapon trick (one-handed)
Inspired blade 5: improved critical (rapier)
7: shatter defences
9: disheartening display

Grand Lodge

avr wrote:
First off, my thought is that while you might start with swashbuckler, taking it all the way is a waste of good class levels

You're not wrong in basis, but I'll put out some disclaimer into it. If dipped, the class could get away with not having more than two levels, Charmed Life is what matters most. Or there's just a single level, and two feats for a single level ain't bad.

I'm playing an almost solo-classed Inspired Blade, and I perfomed just okay. I had to dip one level of Avenger Vigilante and one of Cavalier, but that was for the saving throws because they aren't aplenty, but other than that 15 swash levels. Not mandatory, but I chose these because several of the abilities are level-dependent like Nimble or the precision damage. I do also like the weapon training, although it doesn't combine with gloves of dueling (sigh)

I could have gone Devoted Muse or Rose Warden, but I wanted a simpler playstyle (these two prestige classes were more complicated to me)

If the pirate feel is that important, then one might go Dawnflower archetype (I don't have the proper name off it), and take the cutlass instead, due to it working as exactly as a scimitar, followed by any other piece of outfit suiting the blurb. I don't think any class/archetype would properly fit roleplay-wise, pirates are rarely robin hoods ...

If there's something I would deem bad on the original post, it would be the Silver-Tongued target. It doesn't worth losing 1 SP/level in the longer run, especially with the cloak of the diplomat fitting a similar task later.


@ AVR.
With out Mix / Maxing to much how should I do his stats. 20 point buy
Human noble fencer inspired blade swashbuckler 3 / spirit dancer medium 2 / rose warden X: I mean


@ AVR

question. why should I take weapon trick? what am i getting out of it? o3o

Sovereign Court

Looks to be for Stylish Riposte, basically another source of opportunity attacks.

Weapon Trick: Stylish Rispote wrote:
Stylish Riposte (Combat Reflexes, base attack bonus +4): When your AC exceeds the result of a foe’s melee attack against you by 5 or more, that foe provokes an attack of opportunity from you. Once you make such an attack of opportunity against a foe, you can’t again use this trick against the foe that day.


Without pushing the minimums or maximums I'd go for something like Str 8, Dex 14+2=16, Con 14, Int 14, Wis 12, Cha 14.

& what Firebug said about weapon trick.


@ AVR ]

My one friend was wondering if some Dip of swash on an Arcane duelist bard could be worth while so i said i would ask?


Can be. With a bard you want to go as close to single-classed as possible usually, but one level in swash can make many 3/4 BAB classes work better in melee (q.v. Swashtigator).


avr wrote:
Can be. With a bard you want to go as close to single-classed as possible usually, but one level in swash can make many 3/4 BAB classes work better in melee (q.v. Swashtigator).

Could you help me put it together

thinking Inspired noble fencer 1 / Arcane duelist X


That can work. You get a few odd bonus feats as an arcane duelist which push you in different directions, and bards have different tricks so it might end up as

Spoiler:
1: combat reflexes
Human: fencing grace
Inspired blade 1: inspired finesse (weapon finesse & focus w/rapier)
Arcane duelist 1 (L2): arcane strike
3: riving strike (adds a debuff to arcane strike)
Arcane duelist 2 (L3): combat casting
5: spellsong (conceal spellcasting in a performance, use bardic performance to concentrate on a spell)
7: weapon trick (one-handed)
Arcane duelist 6 (L7): disruptive
9: encouraging spell (apply to heroism)


avr wrote:

That can work. You get a few odd bonus feats as an arcane duelist which push you in different directions, and bards have different tricks so it might end up as

** spoiler omitted **

so I found the finale spells

are they worth it

what would be some good spells for him?


Saving finale is worth it, so are heroism and haste. It's good to have one of the invisibility spells available starting with vanish, but you don't need the lot. Beyond that it depends on your preferences, illusions (starting with silent image) and mind-affecting disabling spells (starting with hideous laughter) and utility spells all have their points.

Edit: oh yeah, get mirror image too.


avr wrote:

Saving finale is worth it, so are heroism and haste. It's good to have one of the invisibility spells available starting with vanish, but you don't need the lot. Beyond that it depends on your preferences, illusions (starting with silent image) and mind-affecting disabling spells (starting with hideous laughter) and utility spells all have their points.

Edit: oh yeah, get mirror image too.

so is there a way to keep a performance (planing oratory / epic speeches) and still be able to be in melee?


Yes, that's how bardic performance works. A standard action to start it (later levels just a move or a swift), a free action each round to maintain it. It works just fine in melee.


Can I get some advice on the name

Human Female (Swash / Bard ) (Noble fencer & inspired Blade / Arcane Duelist)

I'd like something french that has lion-est sound to it with a musical like surname that sounds strong and leader like


Lyonette is the easy answer to (female, French, lion-ish). It could be first name or surname.

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