[PEACH] Alternate mechanic for Study Suspect


Investigator Playtest


Like others, I'm not a fan of the Study Suspect mechanic for Investigators, and I've been thinking of a homebrew change for it. It keeps the need for Perception checks, and keeps the variability of the Study Suspect roll, but it assures that the Investigator always gets some form of damage bonus.

- Once a round, an Investigator can make a DC 22 Perception check against one target (not against the target's Will DC). The numbers below are based on the assumption that the Investigator's starting Perception bonus will be +7 (+2 to Wisdom, expert in Perception, +1 for level) and a 20th level Investigator can have a +30 (+20 for level, +8 for legendary, +2 for Wisdom). Using the four stages, the Investigator gets:

Critical Success: The Investigator can make 3 Studied Strikes this round, each at +4d6 damage.
Success: The Investigator can make 2 Studied Strikes this round, each at +3d6 damage.
Failure: The Investigator can make 2 Studied Strikes this round, each at +2d6 damage.
Critical Failure: The Investigator can make 1 Studied Strike this round at +1d6.

I realize that it's very spikey, but that can be a good feature to differentiate the class from the Rogue. It also negates the need to state that the Investigator's damage goes up at certain levels, because the Perception bonus increase will push them up to those levels more naturally. At 1st level, the Investigator will most often 'fail' and still get decent DPR; by level 20, the Investigator will get critical success on anything but a 1. It's not perfect, but I thought I should throw it out there for people to see.


EberronHoward wrote:

Like others, I'm not a fan of the Study Suspect mechanic for Investigators, and I've been thinking of a homebrew change for it. It keeps the need for Perception checks, and keeps the variability of the Study Suspect roll, but it assures that the Investigator always gets some form of damage bonus.

- Once a round, an Investigator can make a DC 22 Perception check against one target (not against the target's Will DC). The numbers below are based on the assumption that the Investigator's starting Perception bonus will be +7 (+2 to Wisdom, expert in Perception, +1 for level) and a 20th level Investigator can have a +30 (+20 for level, +8 for legendary, +2 for Wisdom). Using the four stages, the Investigator gets:

Critical Success: The Investigator can make 3 Studied Strikes this round, each at +4d6 damage.
Success: The Investigator can make 2 Studied Strikes this round, each at +3d6 damage.
Failure: The Investigator can make 2 Studied Strikes this round, each at +2d6 damage.
Critical Failure: The Investigator can make 1 Studied Strike this round at +1d6.

I realize that it's very spikey, but that can be a good feature to differentiate the class from the Rogue. It also negates the need to state that the Investigator's damage goes up at certain levels, because the Perception bonus increase will push them up to those levels more naturally. At 1st level, the Investigator will most often 'fail' and still get decent DPR; by level 20, the Investigator will get critical success on anything but a 1. It's not perfect, but I thought I should throw it out there for people to see.

From a design standpoint I really like it. From the standpoint of how DCs seem to work in 2e I don't think it jives that well. That's forgetting how it changes the action economy.

Again....I like it. But I wouldn't feel comfortable adding it to my games as you have it. I'd probably say the damage you have listed is good but the number of allowable attacks is where it gets wobbly


That's a good change but if you Study Suspect as a free action you can't capitalize on a critical success and move unless you're giving the investigator extra actions?

I've leaned towards make Study Suspect an automatic success and Studied Strike 2 actions to preserve action economy.


Elmdorprime wrote:
That's a good change but if you Study Suspect as a free action you can't capitalize on a critical success and move unless you're giving the investigator extra actions?

Yeah, it's only going to be used to its maximum potential when it's able to attack its Case Subject when it starts its turn. As I understand it, you can use Studied Strike with ranged weapons, so the Investigator does not need to linger in melee reach of the Case Subject, waiting to crit their Study Suspect.


EberronHoward wrote:
Elmdorprime wrote:
That's a good change but if you Study Suspect as a free action you can't capitalize on a critical success and move unless you're giving the investigator extra actions?
Yeah, it's only going to be used to its maximum potential when it's able to attack its Case Subject when it starts its turn. As I understand it, you can use Studied Strike with ranged weapons, so the Investigator does not need to linger in melee reach of the Case Subject, waiting to crit their Study Suspect.

That was my reading as well - my investigator is using Studied Strike with bombs so being able to use it on ranged is key to that concept. I just tend to move first at least as often if not more as I attack first 2when I play thanks to the way the 3 actions has given me mobility.


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I still would prefer more non-damage effects, that could shared with the party.

Silver Crusade

It is a rare event for an investigator to have the subject be his case study, since most combats occur as one of a series of combats, which is too broad an area for the Take the Case benefits to apply, as I read it. Therefore it will almost never be a free action to study the opponent. For that matter, having to study the subject every round seems absurd in context. It is a forced mechanic to use up an action and makes it more difficult to gain the benefit, since you need 2 good rolls in the round to gain that benefit. Unwieldy.

Taking Mellored's advice, why couldn't a successful study give the entire party the benefit, as your character will be sharing this information?

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