Buffing Spellcraft


Rules Questions


Got a low level shamman trying to be a bit better at crafting wondrous items.

Does the spell Beloved of the Forge work to improve spellcraft? We had assumed it did, but now that I think more about it, I'm not so sure.

Fortune Hex - can make 2 rolls
Guidance cantrip - gives a +1 competence bonus to any check
I'm told you can make a masterwork tool to give a +2 circumstance bonus to any skill check. However, I haven't found where that is written yet. If true, I will make one for spellcraft.
Magent Prism Cracked Ioun Stone - give a +2 competence bonus to one skill.
Gloves of Elvenkind - give a +5 competence bonus to spellcraft

Just realized that, for some reason, Fox's Cunning is not on the shamman list. But I can pay for the party wizard to learn it in his spellbook.

What other spells or items can help bump up my spellcraft rolls?


Arcane Family Workbook - 300 gp
+2 Circumstance, or +4 if you spend 1d4 hours.

And while rolling twice is neat, I'd not risk it and just go for the Take 10.

Silver Crusade

If you happen to be a Speaker for the Past shaman, Threefold Aspect is a 4th level spell for you (if 7th counts as "low level").

I'd be surprised if a GM allowed the Fortune Hex, or any shortish duration spell, to count for a crafting roll.


I'm only 4th level at this time. I will keep Threefold Aspect in mind for the future. But that is only giving the same +4 enhancement bonus to intelligence. I will have to see if he thinks the duration of the spells is an issue. I honestly never even considered that.

I like the Arcane Family Workbook. I have never seen that one before.

Silver Crusade

There's also Tears to Wine. It's a controversial and strangely worded spell, which would last 80 min for you; I would definitely run this one by your GM first. I think it may be banned in PFS.


Revolving Door Alternate wrote:
Does the spell Beloved of the Forge work to improve spellcraft? We had assumed it did, but now that I think more about it, I'm not so sure.

Beloved of the Forge wouldn't work for the same reason Crafter's Fortune wouldn't work. Spellcraft isn't a Craft check.

Revolving Door Alternate wrote:
I like the Arcane Family Workbook. I have never seen that one before.

Perfectly understandable, tbh. There's a lot of weird mundane equipment that you'd never think to look for unless someone told you about it.

Revolving Door Alternate wrote:
I'm told you can make a masterwork tool to give a +2 circumstance bonus to any skill check. However, I haven't found where that is written yet. If true, I will make one for spellcraft.

Part of the rules for Masterwork Tool, but it's up to your GM to allow new MWK tools.

====

A Portable Altar might be on the table if you're OK with asking Nethys for a favor. But it might be a lot of effort for just another +2.


Get a valet familiar if you are a crafting shaman.


Four-leaf clover, 3 750 gp for +2 luck bonus to any skill or save 3/day.

An armillary amulet is gloves of elvenkind without the concentration bonus, and costs just 2 500 gp.

Worship Aroden and an Azlant pendant gives +10 insight to a skill 1/day. 3 100 gp.

The masterwork tool for everything comes from the generic masterwork tool; it doesn't state that one such exists for every skill or every use, and IMO it's intended as a base to work from to create a real masterwork item rather than an absolute.

Also IMO - if the effect doesn't last for each day's crafting (or just apply to a skill check with no duration) it won't help. You can't IMO cast a spell which lasts 1 minute at just the right point in the 8+ hour crafting process to get the bonus from it.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Why you need to "get better at spellcraft"?

It is a class skill and you get 4 skill point level, so you are able to buy a level in spellcraft every time you advance your level.
Even with 10 intelligence, at level 4 you should be able to make any item with a DC of 17- without any trouble (you can take 10 when making magic items). That means you can make any item with a required CL of 12-.
Unless you are rolling in cash for some reason, there are very few items with a production cost within the limits of your supposed wealth with a higher CL. Even the Pearl of Power, post FAQ, is within your budget unless you want to make a peral for a level of spells you can't cast.

Even if you routinely lack the right spell, you can still make CL 7 items.

Note that the bonus should be long-lasting. Crafting something requires hours, Fortune hex and Guidance last 1 round, Fox Cunning 1 minute/level.
Crafter's Fortune is what you need. It is a +5 bonus that lasts 1 day level. It is a first level wizard spell.

My point is that generally, it is not worth spending resources for something you will need at most for a couple of levels. Unless, for some reason, you don't want to spend skill points into spellcraft. But it has plenty of uses while adventuring, so it is generally worth spending them.

Revolving Door Alternate wrote:


Just realized that, for some reason, Fox's Cunning is not on the shaman list.

Because you are a divine spellcaster. Generally, divine spellcasters don't have the complete set of stat buffing spells, but only those appropriate for their class.


The usual reason Diego is to make an item with 3 prerequisites of which you have only 1 (i.e. +10 to the DC). Some GMs see the fairly low DCs, are offended by this, and insist on your rolling rather than taking 10, too.


We aren't exactly rolling in cash, but are doing better than the WBL chart.

However, the shaman spell list has odd and significant gaps in it. Also most of the items we want crafted are CL 6 and above. That gets the total DC to higher than take 10 will guarantee a success.


Ok, the more I think about, the more I agree that short term buff spells shouldn't be applicable. I'm not even going to ask the GM. So for this purpose, I'm only looking at long term buffs. I think hours/level would work, so if there any spells that are in that range they would apply.

So what I have so far is:
Circumstance
1) If available, a masterwork spellcraft tool _ +2 circumstance bonus to any skill check. (I would have to check if GM will allow.)
2) Masterwork Portable Alter (Nethys) _ +2 circumstance bonus.
3) Arcane Family Workbook _ +4 circumstance bonus to spellcraft

Competence
4) Magent Prism Cracked Ioun Stone _ +2 competence bonus to one skill.
5) Gloves of Elvenkind _ +5 competence bonus to spellcraft
6) Armillary Amulet _ +5 competence bonus to spellcraft

Insight
7) Azlant Pendant (Aroden) _ +10 insight bonus (not sure if this would count as long term for crafting items or not)

My PC worships Pharisma so 2) and 7) won't work for me, unfortunately.
So it looks like the best I can do is the Arcane Family Workbook and the Gloves of Elvenkind (I don't have the book for the Armillary Amulet but it would work). I will get the cracked magenta prism ioun stone until I can afford the gloves.

Can anyone else think of anything that should be added to the list?


Revolving Door Alternate wrote:
So it looks like the best I can do is the Arcane Family Workbook

Circumstance bonuses are one of the few types that stacks, so you can have the MWK tool and the book. Since a MWK tool for spellcraft is literally the example given when designing new MWK tools, it shouldn't be hard to convince your GM.

====

Revolving Door Alternate wrote:
However, the shaman spell list has odd and significant gaps in it. Also most of the items we want crafted are CL 6 and above. That gets the total DC to higher than take 10 will guarantee a success.

Lowballing your Int we have a +7 Spellcraft bonus at lv 4. With a Magenta Prism, MWK Tool, and Arcane Family Workbook that's +15. Couple that with a take 10 and your total is 25. Considering the base DC check is just CL+5, it's a pretty respectable amount.

Pay a couple hirelings for some Aid Another checks if possible, and you should be able to craft pretty much anything except corner cases.


Holy Carp!
I totally forgot the circumstance bonuses stack.
Wohoo!!!
I think that now gets me everything we were wanting to craft in the wondrous category.


Revolving Door Alternate wrote:

Got a low level shamman trying to be a bit better at crafting wondrous items.

Does the spell Beloved of the Forge work to improve spellcraft? We had assumed it did, but now that I think more about it, I'm not so sure.

Beloved of the Forge (or Crafter's Fortune) will work if you use a Craft skill instead of Spellcraft to make a magic item. If you want to still leverage your ranks in Spellcraft when using Craft, then you can use the spell Arcane Reinforcement , at least if you have some way of accessing it, such as through using the Arcane Enlightenment hex. That would just be ranks in Spellcraft, though, rather than any bonuses that apply to Spellcraft specifically.

Tears to Wine has been mentioned. Heroism has a similar duration, and is a Morale bonus so it should stack with just about anything, so if you can figure out a way to arrange for Tears to Wine to be up for the full length of time, you can probably do the same for Heroism, too.


I wrote in Magic items or Feats that increase Craft and williamoaks guide to construct crafting the following:

I wrote:

I have been looking into this as well. This is what I have noted:

Items
250 gp Traveler's Any-Tool +2 circumstance for many craft skills
3,000 gp Fortunate Charm get a re-roll
3,100 gp Azlant Pendant worship associated god and get 1/day +10 insight on a skill check
3,750 gp Four-leaf Clover 3/day +2 luck skill
8,750 gp Monocle of Flawlessness +5 competence on trained craft skills

Spells
2 Beloved of the Forge 1H/L +5 luck on trained skills
2 Crafter's Fortune 1D/L +5 luck on next craft check
2 Visualization of the Mind 24H +5 untyped on skill checks of selected mental attribute
2 Visualization of the Body 24H +5 untyped on skill checks of selected physical attribute

EDIT: These items (and spells) may do more than just crafting, so check the links.

Later in the threads, mention is made of Skill Focus, Spirit Ridden, Prodigy, and Cooperative Crafting.

Amazing Tools of Manufacture gives +4 circumstance.
A Cyclops Helm gets a +20 once per day.

I also wrote:

Got some more spells for skills:

+1/3CL untyped: Genius Avaricious (one month & 1.500 gp)
+2 morale: Heroism (10 min./level)
+2d4 competence: Gallant Inspiration (retroactive)
+3 to +6 competence: Toilsome Chant (1H/CL, need bard 3+)
+4 competence: Grand Destiny (10 minutes/level or until discharged)
+1/5CL (max 3) competence: Timely Inspiration (retroactive)
+CL insight: Moment of Prescience (1 hour/level or until discharged)
+1/4CL insight: Rags To Riches (10 minutes/level)
+3 racial: Ignoble Form (24 hours, drow target)

Later, I wrote about a bunch of traits here.

/cevah

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Buffing Spellcraft All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.