Grenades- Too Expensive for too little dmg


General Discussion


So we have been playing Starfinder for about 5 months now, and our group is lvl 7 and about to be lvl 8.

A few of us have been trying to make grenades worth it with out much success, and we have been better off just using the heavy weapons that explode.

Are we missing something or do the Starfinder devs have something against grenades?


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Grenades make nice loot, since a lot of characters are proficient in them that aren't proficient in heavy weapons. They tend to make pretty poor purchases, though a bombarding fusion can help a lot with that.

But yes, because of their accessibility, grenades are the weakest explosive option. You are not imagining that.


I have house ruled the grenade price to be for 6 grenades and you weapon specialization is allowed for grenades.

Makes them a bit more viable.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

you can't rely on grenades. They are really for specialized purposes. Fun to throw, but don't count on them to be there all the time.

And honestly, a smoke grenade is cheap and wonderful.


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Bombard fusion is really your main option if you want to be a grenadier.

Larger initial investment, but you never 'spend' any resources to use it, outside of the once/day thing.

Being the Grenadier solider option helps also (free grenade every 10 minutes you spend building one, one at a time).


Lethallin wrote:

Bombard fusion is really your main option if you want to be a grenadier.

Larger initial investment, but you never 'spend' any resources to use it, outside of the once/day thing.

Being the Grenadier solider option helps also (free grenade every 10 minutes you spend building one, one at a time).

One of the coolest Fusions. I wish there were more on the same level.


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jim reynolds 283 wrote:

So we have been playing Starfinder for about 5 months now, and our group is lvl 7 and about to be lvl 8.

A few of us have been trying to make grenades worth it with out much success, and we have been better off just using the heavy weapons that explode.

Are we missing something or do the Starfinder devs have something against grenades?

The Starfinder devs do, indeed, have something "against" grenades.

Its called "cheap grenades = easy ways to break encounters". The problem isn't one grenade, its eight grenades, per round. . . where all four party members do easy full attacks with grenades, and the opponent ( or opponents! ) get pinged to death because even a passed reflex save doesn't save them.

Basically, grenades have to be relatively expensive per damage die, because otherwise you get the damage equivalent of the old Wand of Cure Light Wounds problem.


Metaphysician wrote:
jim reynolds 283 wrote:

So we have been playing Starfinder for about 5 months now, and our group is lvl 7 and about to be lvl 8.

A few of us have been trying to make grenades worth it with out much success, and we have been better off just using the heavy weapons that explode.

Are we missing something or do the Starfinder devs have something against grenades?

The Starfinder devs do, indeed, have something "against" grenades.

Its called "cheap grenades = easy ways to break encounters". The problem isn't one grenade, its eight grenades, per round. . . where all four party members do easy full attacks with grenades, and the opponent ( or opponents! ) get pinged to death because even a passed reflex save doesn't save them.

Basically, grenades have to be relatively expensive per damage die, because otherwise you get the damage equivalent of the old Wand of Cure Light Wounds problem.

Why not expensive grenades that are worth their investment? It prevents the spamming and keeps them meaningful. Making them a full-round action to throw could also come up in play so that you couldn't throw them in surprise rounds and get a big advantage, while spellcasters (the main competitors with grenades, in my opinion) will still have their blasting capabilities being free, versatile and allows for mobility.

Sadly, the game is already balanced around grenades being firecrackers, so if they suddenly were to be rebalanced, the classes that jumps through hoops to make them work would get insanely strong (assuming they're balanced right now, which I honestly don't know).


Metaphysician wrote:


The Starfinder devs do, indeed, have something "against" grenades.

Its called "cheap grenades = easy ways to break encounters". The problem isn't one grenade, its eight grenades, per round. . . where all four party members do easy full attacks with grenades, and the opponent ( or opponents! ) get pinged to death because even a passed reflex save doesn't save them.

Basically, grenades have to be relatively expensive per damage die, because otherwise you get the damage equivalent of the old Wand of Cure Light Wounds problem.

I would disagree here. I have house ruled that you get 6 grenades for the listed price and you add weapon specialization to your damage rolls.

Even with this grenades are weak and relatively easy to save against.


Pathfinder Maps, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Metaphysician wrote:
jim reynolds 283 wrote:

So we have been playing Starfinder for about 5 months now, and our group is lvl 7 and about to be lvl 8.

A few of us have been trying to make grenades worth it with out much success, and we have been better off just using the heavy weapons that explode.

Are we missing something or do the Starfinder devs have something against grenades?

The Starfinder devs do, indeed, have something "against" grenades.

Its called "cheap grenades = easy ways to break encounters". The problem isn't one grenade, its eight grenades, per round. . . where all four party members do easy full attacks with grenades, and the opponent ( or opponents! ) get pinged to death because even a passed reflex save doesn't save them.

Basically, grenades have to be relatively expensive per damage die, because otherwise you get the damage equivalent of the old Wand of Cure Light Wounds problem.

Yeah that argument doesn't hold any water while heavy weapons with the explode trait (or other are capability) exist.


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Ravingdork wrote:
Metaphysician wrote:
jim reynolds 283 wrote:

So we have been playing Starfinder for about 5 months now, and our group is lvl 7 and about to be lvl 8.

A few of us have been trying to make grenades worth it with out much success, and we have been better off just using the heavy weapons that explode.

Are we missing something or do the Starfinder devs have something against grenades?

The Starfinder devs do, indeed, have something "against" grenades.

Its called "cheap grenades = easy ways to break encounters". The problem isn't one grenade, its eight grenades, per round. . . where all four party members do easy full attacks with grenades, and the opponent ( or opponents! ) get pinged to death because even a passed reflex save doesn't save them.

Basically, grenades have to be relatively expensive per damage die, because otherwise you get the damage equivalent of the old Wand of Cure Light Wounds problem.

Yeah that argument doesn't hold any water while heavy weapons with the explode trait (or other are capability) exist.

Heavy weapons require some str investment and some proficiency investment to get. A lot of classes start with grenade proficiency. I think they maybe erred a bit to the cautious side with grenades but I think they were concerned about people just carrying bags full of them to throw constantly. Soldiers and mechanics to some extent have the ability to basically have one free high quality grenade every fight if they want to use grenades so they do get some solid use for characters setup to want to use them. Also as a GM grenades are reasonably common consumables so everybody who can use grenades should have 1 or 2 good ones on them for emergency use.

Also a lot of the good utility greandes like smoke ones are totally fine to just buy the level 1 version to pop some cover where you need it.


I want to know how people are tossing out more then one grenade?

Move action to pull out a grenade, standard to toss a grenade.

If, if you have a grenade in each hand you could full round toss out those grenades. This is the only way to attack with more then one grenade a round as Full Attacking does not allow swift actions.

thing is, don't see very many people walking around in starfinder with a grenade in each hand. If they have grenades, it's usually a weapon and a grenade, if they even have the grenade equipped.


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Presumably the PCs don't spend all their time literally blundering into fights with zero warning, and thus have the option of spending a round or two preparing grenades in hand for an alpha strike.


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Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Additionally, if someone really wants to throw a lot of grenades if they have Quick Draw, because Quick Draw makes drawing throwing weapons into part of the attack action. This is on top of making drawing any weapon into a swift action.

I mean, I still wouldn't do it, because of the full attack penalty to save DCs, but you can do it easily with that feat.


You can also just use a grenade launcher to shoot multiple in a single round without needing Quick Draw.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

If you've got the proficiency or are willing to eat the nonproficiency penalty to your DC, that is definitely a way to do it.


HammerJack wrote:
Additionally, if someone really wants to throw a lot of grenades if they have Quick Draw, because Quick Draw makes drawing throwing weapons into part of the attack action. This is on top of making drawing any weapon into a swift action.

I see where I went wrong. Thought Quick Draw was just a swift action. Didn't know about it being able to combine with Thrown Weapons for Full Attacking.


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Anyway, don't forget the other side of the grenade spam quandary: the status effects. Sure, the save DCs may not be that high, but if the party is alpha striking with eight or more of them? Unless the opponent is categorically immune or *way* above their weight class, you can count on several failed saves. Which means, depending on the grenade selection, not only have they taken a whole lot of dice of damage, but they are also blinded, staggered, entangled, burning, etc.

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