Acrobatics for initiative ?


Swashbuckler Playtest


So this class allows you to gain panache if you roll acrobatics for initiative

In what circumstances would this ever happen?
Perhaps there is a more general or general rules question here about “common” situations that can use “alternate initiatives”

But does anyone have any ideas ?


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Swing down from the chandelier to the lower floor

Walk across a wooden beam into a room

Rush up a a hill of loosely and unstable gravel.

Etc

Basically, any sort of acrobatics activity, if it was what you were doing before an encounter begins.

Grand Lodge

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Be OoT Link. Tumbel is your primary form of movement. Otherwise take "hardcore parkour!" as a lifestyle mantra.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I can’t easily justify it in exploration mode, but I’d definitely let a PC start combat during a social interaction by leaping on a table, swinging from a chandelier, or sliding down a bannister.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

There's definitely nothing you could do constantly to ensure acrobatics as an initiative skill, and attempts to do things like constantly somersault everywhere deserve to be shot down immediately. Fatigue is also justified for more absurd tactics.

I think this is a great idea for a feature in a void (because swashbucklers getting a bonus if they start the fight by ropes wing dramatically in through the window is great), that doesn't survive contact with players (who will expect a way to make it a baseline ability that's usually in effect).


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscriber

i feel any sufficiently derring do jump into the fray could use acrobatics, but it has to be like it is in the movies.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Unnecessary combat rolls for everyone!


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I think they need to describe examples of how you might roll many of the skills for initiative-- deception, athletics, acrobatics, intimidate, and perhaps some even weirder ones like performance, or survival.

Grand Lodge

I think its easy for people to imagine Acrobatics where players INITIATE the initiative against known enemies that you surpise.

It's just not very clear for when you need to use "What is your Exploration Activity that would trigger Acrobatics as initiative versus unknown enemies?"


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Varun Creed wrote:

I think its easy for people to imagine Acrobatics where players INITIATE the initiative against known enemies that you surpise.

It's just not very clear for when you need to use "What is your Exploration Activity that would trigger Acrobatics as initiative versus unknown enemies?"

I don't think there's a need for one though?

I mean, Panache is supposed to be the boost you get from your flamboyant, over the top, risky, actions. Not something you have permanently "on" as you walk from point A to point B.

Silver Crusade

4 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Arguably this won't happen often if the party is surprised, but in every occasion that the PCs can in any way prepare for the coming fight, you declare that you're going to dangle from the chandelier.

Now we need a create chandelier spell...

Silver Crusade

5 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Gorbacz wrote:

Arguably this won't happen often if the party is surprised, but in every occasion that the PCs can in any way prepare for the coming fight, you declare that you're going to dangle from the chandelier.

Now we need a create chandelier spell...

Or play a Catfolk and jump with fright when you’re surprised.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I think it's easy to justify, personally. I had a player during combat with a villain say he wanted to try to convince the villain that they were there to join him, not fight. The other characters said they'd give him a shot, but if he moved funny they'd attack. I let this player roll Deception while everyone else did a regular Perception roll

If a Swashbuckler wanted to, say, start their turn by leaping into action I'd regularly allow them to do an Acrobatics check for initiative provided they started their turn with a tumble or a long jump or whatever in circumstances where they can't leap from a platform or swing from a chandelier. I think the initiative rules are fluid enough for that

Of course if it doesn't make sense then it doesn't make sense. But I'm all about letting players explain alternatives to me to use a different skill for initiative


I need more help with this topic too. I am DM'ing a group and already find it hard to accommodate the Rogue getting Stealth initiatives in any situation except coming out of Exploration mode where he used Avoid Notice. I can't see these situations ever coming up for swashbucklers in an ambush or surprise combat, only in situations where the PCs have an opportunity to react before initiative kicks off. Am I doing it wrong? Alternative initiatives in general could really use more examples and support from the designers! I'd love to see a blog post about it!

Edit: quick note that I do see how deception, intimidate, etc work when a social situation turns into combat. They just don't happen as much as standard dungeon crawl type combats, at least with my PCs. Maybe the players need to do things like rush into the next room shouting intimidatingly? :)


I think it would help if whatever Swashbuckler Style you choose it reads “you may roll (skill) for initiative.”

One of the WotC Star Wars rpgs did a similar thing and it wasn’t game breaking.


Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscriber
Puna'chong wrote:


If a Swashbuckler wanted to, say, start their turn by leaping into action I'd regularly allow them to do an Acrobatics check for initiative provided they started their turn with a tumble or a long jump or whatever in circumstances where they can't leap from a platform or swing from a chandelier. I think the initiative rules are fluid enough for that

long jumps are athletics though. arcobatics handles balancing, tumbling, flying and squeeze. have them do something cooler than just jumping at the start of combat.

I can't wait for someone to try to start combat by crawling through a fireplace.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
LizardMage wrote:
I think it would help if whatever Swashbuckler Style you choose it reads “you may roll (skill) for initiative.”

I think the "if you roll [skill] for initiative, gain panache" is not intended to be a thing you rely on, but instead to represent "if your character acts with panache, they gain panache."

Like if you didn't gain panache when you initiated combat by swinging on a rope through a window, that would feel wrong. But we're not going to just leave ropes and windows everywhere.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, Pawns, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
PossibleCabbage wrote:
LizardMage wrote:
I think it would help if whatever Swashbuckler Style you choose it reads “you may roll (skill) for initiative.”

I think the "if you roll [skill] for initiative, gain panache" is not intended to be a thing you rely on, but instead to represent "if your character acts with panache, they gain panache."

Like if you didn't gain panache when you initiated combat by swinging on a rope through a window, that would feel wrong. But we're not going to just leave ropes and windows everywhere.

Hey! It's a legitimate strategy! :)

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder Second Edition / Advanced Player’s Guide Playtest / Swashbuckler Playtest / Acrobatics for initiative ? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.