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Welcome one and all to what is, hopefully, the stepping stone to something awesome. I'll try not to lore dump everything at once and only list things which are immediately relevant. Let's get to it then; there's a lot to go over. If you are familiar with the prophecies of Golarion's apocalypse, some of this might have a little more context.
The entire premise of the campaign is to have an Eastern campaign set in Tian Xia. But this isn't vanilla Tian Xia; this is Tian Xia set two millennia after the fated apocalypse of Golarion was thwarted. The campaign is going to be very anime in concept and eventually go into crazy land with mythic later down the road.
* Golarion as it was is no more. It was broken during the apocalypse known as the Great Sundering two millennia ago. During the Great Sundering, the architect of the apocalypse- Pharasma- was slain by heroes who possessed shards of the primordial god Ihys and the multiverse was spared annihilation.
*In the aftermath of the Great Sundering, the gods that were not claimed by the Darkness Beyond bound their essences to the broken shards of Golarion. This created entire new worlds and cosmologies. These worlds are known by their inhabitants as the Spheres.
* The Tian Xia Sphere is the one that will be covered in this campaign. That particular world was created when the traditional Tian deities did their part in trying to piece Golarion back together. The entirety of Tian Xia, the surrounding ocean, Sarusan, the Crown of the World, and a large chunk of the Land of the Linnorm Kings are all components of the new Tian Xia Sphere.
* The deities of Tian Xia's pantheon, sans the old "primary" gods of Golarion, are the primary gods of this world. The Primal Kami are the equivalent of the world's demigods and lesser deities.
* The powers of those who saved what remained of the multiverse occasionally crop up during history. Those who are born with a shard of Ihys within themselves possess what is known as the Eyes of Ihys. The name is not just metaphorical since the power is tied to an eye, which glows when it's power is activated. The Eyes allow one to look forward or backward in time and can allow one to break the bonds of fate. In the two thousand years since the Great Sundering, no one has inherited more than one Eye.
* There are nine primary Outer Planes that exist around Tian Xia.
* Mundane substances have gained supernatural power in this new world. Salt, for example, can burn fiends much like holy water and can be sprinkled to ward off possession.
* Some places were tainted by the Darkness Beyond during the Great Sundering. These areas hold an unfathomable evil that can twist the body and soul. While these areas are rare enough that they can be counted on one hand, they remain as reminders of the apocalypse that nearly destroyed the world.
* Resurrection is near-impossible in any of the Sphere. Only the darkest of necromancy or the most powerful of sacred rituals can bring back the dead.
* Technology exists in the setting to some extent. A wandering Numerian Technomancer was visiting for the Ruby Phoenix Tournament when the Great Sundering occurred. In the aftermath of the apocalypse, he founded a school for technological research in the Lands of Ice - formerly known as The Crown of the World. Technology has caught on slow and firearms are rare, but it still exists. The Lands of Ice, Hongal, and Kaoling incorporate technology fairly heavily. In the trade city of Goka, technology is nearly ubiquitous and exists alongside the more traditional architecture and technology of the land.
* In the aftermath of the Great Sundering, great advances were made in the understanding of Ki and Chakras. This led to the founding of monasteries dedicated to the Twenty-Seven Disciplines, mystical weapon arts that draw on both Ki and one's own martial prowess, and the Akhashic Paths, a rediscovered art that allows one to force their essence through an open chakra to accomplish superhuman feats.
* Gestalt level eight, but with exceptions. One side of the gestalt must be one of the following classes and cannot be multiclassed out of: Monk, Unchained Monk, Legendary Monk, Samurai, Legendary Samurai, Ninja, Kinetic Shinobi, Kineticist, Legendary Kineticist, Gnostic, or one of the Akhashic Mysteries, Heroes of the East, Heroes of the Jade Oath, Path of War, or Spheres of Power/Might classes. Players must pick one of their gestalt side saves; they do not gain both.
* Automatic Bonus Progression. You can stack ABP attunement bonuses on any magic weapons and armor that you find. If you gain a companion from a class feature, it gains this at two-thirds of your progression (Limit: one companion). Any weapon and armor attunement bonuses get applied to their natural attacks and natural armor respectively.
* Background Skills, but with three extra skill points for them instead of two. If you choose an extra skill point as your Favored Class Bonus, you gain an additional skill point, in addition to your normal skill point, that can only be used on Background Skills.
* 16,500 GP.
* Hit points are treated as being rolled maximum every level. Selecting HP as a Favored Class Bonus grants two hit points instead of the usual one.
* Armor grants half of it's AC bonus in DR. Wearing no armor grants the benefit of your role-based AC bonus (see below).
* Wearing no armor grants you an AC bonus determined by the BAB of your "locked" gestalt side and your level. The lower the BAB, the lower the bonus. Link to the rules.
* Raise and Resurrect effects are confined to class abilities and rituals.
* Everyone gains a Ki Pool equal to 1/4 class level plus their highest mental ability score modifier. Classes with a medium or high BAB progression also gain a Stamina Pool as per Combat Tactics.
* Everyone has seven Hero Points from the start of the game. If you receive a fatal blow, you can spend a Hero Point to heal 50% of your max HP and gain a random injury.
* If you confirm a critical hit with a natural 20, you inflict a random injury on an enemy.
* There are no race restrictions on Favored Class Bonuses and you get one for each side of your gestalt.
* Firearms will use the Emerging Guns rule. I would suggest carrying something else quieter for use in some portions of the game. A gunshot in a complex/dungeon/whatever is likely to draw everything to you at once or at least put everything on alert within earshot.
* Mythic will be a part of the campaign later on. I will be using the Mythic Fixes to scale it down to less madcap levels. Any of the first party Mythic Paths can be used, plus select Paths from Legendary Games and Lost Spheres.
How are you calculating attributes?
This game will use a 40 point buy method.
interesting. This is very similar to a game (different setting though) I was in that died very quickly. Thus I have a bunch of ideas crunchwise that might or might nor work in a different setting.
interesting. This is very similar to a game (different setting though) I was in that died very quickly. Thus I have a bunch of ideas crunchwise that might or might nor work in a different setting.
Amazing how similar - 8th level gestalt, high point buy, similar classes allowed. Parallel design is an interesting phenomenon...
With such a setting, i am inclined to carefully ask....
<<, >>.
As you mentioned no specifics on race, would you consider 3PP races?
I have 3PP Deathless Ghost material. Contrary to the name, permadeath and weaknesses as per regular rules for undead. It just has different origins for being a spirit. ;)
Quite similar to a phantom, and any ghostly powers such as telekinesis require feats.
It is a racial class lvl thing, capping at lvl 3.
Endzeitgeist reviewed it positively, if it's worth mentioning.
Japan/asia/Tian Xia is filled with spirits of various kinds.....a next-gen spirit too, perhaps?
Oh, this is the juicy stuff. High power, beautiful.
You don't mention them, are the DSP Psionics (and psionic races) allowed, or are the ones you mentioned strictly the ones permitted? (Also thanks for remembering the Legendary classes, they're so underused.)
Ellioti
What did you have in mind, assuming this gets enough people to push past an interest check? It will most definitely need some retooling with mechanics and the lore would need to be tailored to the setting due to me making it pretty out there. I don't have any issues with old characters being dusted off and repurposed.
Oceanshieldwolf
It is interesting how similar the two are. A few of the ideas in the link- like the idea of gestalt mythic paths- seems a bit too abusable.
Alma the Soulborn
Can you cite a source for the Deathless Ghost race? I have never heard of it until now. Is it incorporeal? I'm a little iffy on the idea of permanent incorporeality if it is.
Grankless
I never really gave Psionics much of a thought when thinking up the setting. I would need to think over it's inclusion. It doesn't seem like it would be lore-snagging.
The Deathless Ghost is from DSP's "Monster Classes" line.
Here's Endzeitgeist's review, which explains the premise a bit neatly. https://endzeitgeist.com/monster-classes-undead/ In short, it's a class that has the racial properties of a ghost, if that makes sense, going up to 3 levels. EZG notes the main features since you don't have access to the PDF yourself.
Grankless
Thank you for letting me know. I'll try and check out the book later today once I can get on DTRPG.
Phntm 888
Tone-wise the game would be like basic Golarion fantasy, but with some of Nioh's darkness and grit at the edges and Naruto's over-the-top anime action.
Classes that gain cut feats will instead grant a bonus feat the PC qualifies for.
Grankless, thank you.
I'd have linked his review on Paizo, but you beat me to it even more directly. :)
I would definitely apply for this, although I share Phntm888’s concern... sometimes even 3pp classes that seem pretty balanced on their own have features that can be noticeably unbalanced when you gestalt them. I don’t own any 3pp stuff so I’m not sure if whatever I submitted would be able to keep up with characters who did use it but I’d apply anyway.
edit: also, I know this is just an interest check right now but would you be allowing archetypes on the fixed side of the gestalt? And, am I correct in assuming that you would still be bound by the alignment restrictions on your fixed class (like needing to be lawful if you’re a monk)?
re-edit: oh, and how does the free ki pool work if you take a class that already gets one? Do you use them separately, or maybe just gain bonus ki? If the latter would you get the full amount as a bonus or how would you calculate that?
If it's of any consolation to Phntm888 and Giga-halfling, i've never been an optimizer.
No problem - fortunately, I just read that review like last week, haha. Kinda dug through EZG's entire back log at work, in fact...
I too will probably not be giga-optimizing beyond "have good stats". I'd much rather do something cool (that won't break my brain) than kill the sun.
Also, my only rules-related suggestion, brought about from experience and my group's houserules - ban the Seize the Opportunity feat (can do AoOs as an "attack action" from PoW) if the user is also using Spheres of Might. Some practitioner stuff can get deeply stupid if able to be used on multiple AoOs.
I'm potentially interested too. Tia Xia has always been a setting I've wanted to explore, and the premise here seems really cool.
For those who are worried about their optimization levels, if this sticks to a general anime-type feel, there's always a few 'weak PCs' that hang around the badasses. Ya know, like Krillin and Yamcha, LOL
I'm quite interested, potentially doing a Tian-La horselord-type character. I'm also far from an optimizer, and often intentionally go against the powerful options for something that fits with character flavor.
I definitely support doing some nerfs when it comes to combining PoW and SoM. Using them together can get...silly.
This could be super cool. Let me get to thinking.
[whine]But I don't wanna be Krillin or Yamcha...[/whine]
Krillin got the badass blonde though. :)
Phntm888
I plan on keeping what third party books are allowed small to keep the flavor of the game consistent. Combine that with the fact that half of one's gestalt is locked to a set of very specific classes- also to keep the Eastern flavor of the game- and that will keep the broken elements of the game down. Honestly the most broken thing in Pathfinder is the Wizard. Big damage is one of the smallest concerns when it comes to game balance when you factor in being able to petrify, stun for multiple rounds, Baleful Polymorph an enemy into a harmless animal, or Forcecage an enemy while spell-spamming point-of-origin effects inside the cage - and those are some of the more tame examples.
The PDF version of the Feat Tax rules will be used.
Alma the Soulborn
I read the book and have one concern about Deathless Ghosts when it comes to balance: Intangibility. It can provide what is basically full-on Incorporeal by level ten. That was likely to balance out that the class has no armor proficiency and I don't necessarily have a problem with that in a vacuum. When that is combined with my use of class-based AC bonuses and and the option to- through class feature, spell, or item- shroud an area in antimagic to become 100% invincible by removing the limiting factor to that miss chance, I can foresee it being a problem. What are your thoughts on this?
Giant Halfling
I plan on keeping what third party books are allowed small to keep the flavor of the game consistent. Combine that with the fact that half of one's gestalt is locked to a set of very specific classes- also to keep the Eastern flavor of the game- and that will keep the broken elements of the game down. Honestly the most broken thing in Pathfinder is the Core Rulebook Wizard. Big damage is one of the smallest concerns when it comes to game balance when you factor in being able to petrify, stun for multiple rounds, Baleful Polymorph an enemy into a harmless animal, or Forcecage an enemy while spell-spamming point-of-origin effects inside the cage - and those are some of the more tame examples.
The fixed side of the gestalt can have archetypes. Alignment restrictions are still in place for those classes that have them.
Those who gain a Ki Pool from a class just combine their pools.
Grankless
Seize the Opportunity is, along with Leadership and a few other feats, banned.
How do you feel about the rules for the kineticist from Kineticists of Porphyra?
They’re available on the Spheres wiki so they’re easily accessible.
Cool. I have a ton of ideas- let us know if/when you decide to transition this to an actual recruitment or open one.
Simeon
Which rules in particular? There are multiple books in that series.
Giant Halfling
It looks like there is a good amount of interest. I will try and get a finalized recruitment up soon. I notice that some things were missed in the write-up for this interest check and plan on making sure it's tip-top before posting.
I have an idea for a Oni-blooded tiefling Warpriest of Yamatsumi. I'll see about working up a build.
Specifically the Viscera element. Thinking of a fleshwarping-esque hobgoblin, probably a former Kaoling battle slave, and that element would complement it perfectly.
Edit: Potentially also the Kinetic Duelist archetype.
Insert
That concept hadn't crossed my mind, tbh.
Afaik, anti-magic works on (attempted) spells and ongoing magic effects. Magic weapons would still very much be legit in an anti-magic zone? Imbued and such. +# Bows fired outside of such fields could hit just fine, as well. I reckon we'd encounter intelligent enemies who are creative, would i assume correct?
I haven't yet seen casters throw anti-magic fields at leisure, and i've seen some high level casters in play. (lvl 9-10)
I wasn't planning on being a full caster, frankly speaking. No such spell coming from me.
That aside, who's to say i make it to lvl 10 (un)alive? ^^
To be more clear, Antimagic field shuts down supernatural abilities as well (which, as an example, would include most of the things that monks can do) in addition to spellcasting.
While it doesn't actually dispel effects inside of it, it does prevent them from working at all.
I know that I personally like to cast AM field if I'm playing a high level caster, cause it's good enough to shut down pretty much any caster in existence, but it's better to cast from a scroll as a fighter type with UMD.
Should note Seize is fine *in general* but only busted if you're a practitioner (sphere of might user) but hey, it's still strong and makes reach builds silly so that's fine.
I'd be interested in submitting a character for this campaign.
Seeing how the children of the gods are littered in many japanese and chinese myths, what are your thoughts on allowing Rogue Genius's godling, or maybe just the Great Hero fighter archetype?
And to give the campaign that anime feel you were looking for might I recommend the Horrifically Overpowered feats?
[Knowledge on topic anti-magic updated]
Huh, good to know.
GM, would i be right to assume anti-magic zones are a part of the game setting itself, not just a mere concern of what PCs might do.
While anti-magic field says supernatural abilities don't affect the space within it, it doesn't say it prevents creatures' innate traits from not working.
Bearing both your concerns and the above into account, would it be an option that the zones are influential to the extent, that the hit/miss chance is but 50% against non-magical weapons.
For my submission, I am going to be entering a Samurai 8 | Bard 8.
Definitely Dot, been wanting to try out the PoW stuff for a while.
After a quick review I might do something with Warder/harbinger
GM, what are your thoughts on clerics who adhere beliefs, instead of a specific deity?
From what i gather, a cleric that chooses to follow their beliefs, picks two domains of choice, and gives up a deity's favored weapon.
I am thinking of a supportive combination, with either oracle or cleric.
Are traits and drawbacks allowed?
TerrorOfDeath submission, more or less worried that i might have missed something on creation.
Simeon
There is no true fleshwarping in Tian Xia.
I have no issues with the Viscera element or the Kinetic Duelist being used.
I would like to state that I agree with Endzeitgeist on Kinetic Duelist's Kinetic Assault being TOO good as-written. Double damage on a a Kinetic Blade charge from 4 Burn isn't a problem, but adding in ways to stack damage before that doubling makes it a problem. Just based on a charge-oriented damage build I threw together, you can deal 2,158 damage in one attack- as-written- when you first gain the ability at 13th level.
End's advice on the subject per his old review was to just make the damage increase a fixed value. I'm not going to be that harsh because 4 Burn hurts. So my compromise is this: it doubles the base damage of your Kinetic Blade, then applies everything else damage-based after that. Other effects that multiply damage besides a critical hit do not apply. That takes my thrown-together build's damage down from 'one shot great wyrms at 13th level' to 'a well-played spellcaster multinuke' round of damage. I'll listen to alternate fixes if you think that is too harsh, but that's where I'm at on it right now.
Alma the Soulborn
I might be willing to come up with some changes to Intangibility. It has some strange interactions the way that it is written now. The antimagic one was just the one that was an immediate concern. It also brings up questions of what happens if it is temporarily negated. Do you turn back to flesh and blood, but with a STR score of 0? Do you just lose it and somehow become more tangible despite losing intangibility? Lots of weirdly niche cases that I would like ironed out before I give it the okay.
Divine magic hasn't really changed from Golarion's setting. Clerics still need deities for their spells. The Primal Kami grant spells and domains just like deities, so just let me know which two Domains you want and I'll write something up.
Corrik
I'm not sure if Gorum's Obediences would fit Yamatsumi. I can look into some refluffs of other Obediences if you need that once the recruitment goes up.
Two traits, no drawbacks, no campaign traits.
TheWaskally
Godly power is very well-defined and specific in this setting. Mortals with access to it are beyond normal heroes in scope and power. So I would not allow Godlings to preserve that dynamic. I might allow the Great Hero because- unlike the Godling- it's not specifically tied to mortal divinity. The Great Hero is imbued by fate and allows a mortal to draw on that blessing to do great things instead of drawing on inner divine power.
Great Hero might be interesting too because the canon, now dead goddess of fate was Pharasma. The same Pharasma who was also canonically the multiverse-destroying nihilist who intentionally built her spire high enough to tear open reality and let in a deeper void than the Negative Energy Plane. That prophecy from Concordance of Rivals was actually what inspired part of this setting's ancient history.
Horrifically Overpowered Feats are cool. I don't know if everyone has access to them, so I'm going to give it a no for now.
...you can deal 2,158 damage in one attack...
Yeah... that’s exactly the kind of stuff I was worried about. I recognize (and respect) that you’re making some effort to curb that, but even a quarter of that damage would one-shot the tarrasque...
This doesn’t seem like a game where a paizo-only character would be able to contribute anything, so I’m going to withdraw my interest. Happy gaming to those who do play.
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GM,
I wouldn't turn to flesh & blood, i never had a corporeal form. :)
On the disruption of tangibility, i propose the miss chance for nonmagic weapons reduces to 50% in antimagic zones? Still a fair chance of getting hit.
This doesn’t seem like a game where a paizo-only character would be able to contribute anything, so I’m going to withdraw my interest. Happy gaming to those who do play.
To be fair, my paizo only character (minus gestalt and the class defense bonus) is probably going to be one of the tankiest builds I've ever played, with little to no gaps in his abilities.
If you're still interested in the campaign, I'd be happy to help you with building the character you want to build to be super effective at whatever you want it to be effective at.
Yeah, Giant Halfling, don't go! I'm using a 3PP archetype in my gestalt. It's cool. Submit a character!
Just updated for Traits and other things.
As a tangent, I'd like to see the math on your charge build, but here's what I can come up with for most damage (assuming average on all dice):
physical composite blast (say Autumn Blast cause it was the first one on the list):
Base damage for Autumn Blast, assuming a +8 Con bonus, would be 14d6+14+con mod (8), for an average of (3.5x14)+22, or 71 damage
Kinetic Blade must be a one handed or light weapon, but we can power attack with it for +8 damage (assuming that one side of our gestalt is full bab). Kinetic Blade also disallows elemental overflow for damage.
This brings us up to 79 base damage.
Now we'll throw in Rhino Hide armor for 2d6, or 7 more damage, for a new total of 86
Spirited charge doubles damage, and kinetic assault doubles damage, so that means triple damage, or 258 damage.
Let's assume, for argument sake, that we have paladin as our other side and we're smiting something evil. that would give us another 13x3, or 39 damage, for a new total of 297 damage. This would double on the first attack to get us to a total of 336 damage.
Finally Toss in the Dwarven fcb, and you end up 12 extra damage, bringing our grand total to 348 damage.
That's what I can get to, which might be missing something along the way, and doesn't include party or self buffs. Keep in mind that this will cost us 4 burn for kinetic assault +2 burn for Autumn Blast, -3 burn for infusion specialization and -1 for synchronous charge, for a total of 2 burn from 1 attack.
So a character with a con mod of 8 can have 11 burn max per day. As Autumn is a mix of earth and wood elements, you'll likely want to put some of your burn cap into your defensive abilities. To max out both Earth (we'll presume that's our character's primary element) and Wood, you would want 7 points for earth (to get your DR/Adamantine up from 6 to 13) and 3 points in wood (to max our your nat armor bonus), meaning that you would not be able to afford the cost of your super charge more than once (because you could use internal buffer to soak the extra 2 burn).
Thanks for okaying those materials. My character wouldn’t be doing true fleshwarping, more like psychic powers that allow for almost total manipulation of the body.
I’m also taking Adaptive Shifter for the other half of my gestalt, but I was wondering if you’d be alright if I give up Druidic as a bonus language. It doesn’t really fit with a body-morphing hobgoblin.
As per your concerns with Kinetic Duelist, I’m not sure I’d be able to build a character like that even if I wanted to. That said, there’s very little that would make me want to build a character like that.
Kinetic Duelist had appealed to me as a melee-focused kineticist, not as a multi-thousand point damage dealer.
To the various people who my request may have perturbed, my intent was never to bring up a game-breaking design. I’m probably as off-put by power-gaming as y’all are, and third party appeals to me purely for the wider array of interesting options. Being the guy on the sidelines while everyone else does awesome stuff sucks.
All that said, I’ll have my character ready soon.
Hmmm, gestalt in Tian Xia... I have some definite ideas. :)