D20 Modern Guns


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


Are the D20 Modern guns overpowered, in regards to Pathfinder?


d20 is underpowered compared with Pathfinder, but those guns can be quite powerful. Remember d20 Modern has automatic guns that can fire bursts and spreads. Those grenades do a good deal more damage than a vial of Alchemist Fire.

I guess it depends on what you are comparing with what.


doc chaos wrote:
Are the D20 Modern guns overpowered, in regards to Pathfinder?

Despite both being d20, they aren't that compatible. There is a Gunslinger class in d20 Modern, but it works very differently than the one in Pathfinder.

A d20 Modern firearm normally does double the Pathfinder equivalent. A typical revolver deals 2d6 damage, for instance, while a Pathfinder revolver deals 1d8 damage.

Furthermore, d20 Modern is set in the modern era, so you have weapons that can dish out autofire attacks, such as the tactical machine pistol. This lets you do area of effect attacks, or double tap (in d20 Modern, this is -2 to hit and +1 dice) or burst fire (-4 to hit, and +2 dice). In d20 Modern you could use a powerful rifle and dish out four burst attacks (4d10 damage) five times before you run out. Note that a character with high BAB could potentially fire all four bursts in the same round! (Very unlikely as the final attack, with a -4 penalty, would not hit the broad side of a barn, but it's theoretically possible.)

That's overpowered at 1st-level, and there's no direct translation of weapon costs, either. If you can somehow make those attacks into touch attacks, it's even more ridiculous.

D20 Modern firearms don't fire hand-crafted ammunition, so you would run out. So maybe a single pistol with 15 bullets, that must be carefully managed, would be balanced. There are people today who can make muskets and the ammo thereof, but even the most primitive 100-year old revolver would require some sort of factory that simply would not exist on Golarion.


Well, I'm doing a (Lvl 4)LOTR meets Star Trek thing. I was looking for a modern or Sci-fi weapon or weapons to be found in a spaceship.The characters will have the tech to manufacture advanced equipment and vehicles.
D20 Star Wars guns are way too powerful as well, I guess.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Companion Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
doc chaos wrote:

Well, I'm doing a (Lvl 4)LOTR meets Star Trek thing. I was looking for a modern or Sci-fi weapon or weapons to be found in a spaceship.The characters will have the tech to manufacture advanced equipment and vehicles.

D20 Star Wars guns are way too powerful as well, I guess.

Pathfinder Campaign Setting Technology Guide.

Pathfinder rules for sci-fi items.


Oh yeah, I forgot to add G.I.Joe to that equation. Maybe I'll add some templates and magic to existing firearms. Not ready for different manufacturers.


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Use the high tech weapons from the Technologist Guide. The base weapons are appropriate enough to use at low levels to high levels.

Something important to keep in mind is that tech based weapons can be enhanced using the enchantment rules just like any other weapon. The Technologist guide specifically calls out that high tech "modifications" follow the same rules as other enchantments and while they aren't magical in origin they work exactly the same way, and have the same limitations. You just alter the explanation a bit to make it techy instead of magical.

Like lets say you want to give the Pirate Captain a special blaster. You start with a normal Laser Pistol, make it +2 and give it the flaming special quality. Alter the name a bit to make it special. Now its a Hotshot Mk2 Laser Pistol with targeting assist. It doesn't detect as a magic item, since it isn't "enchanted" but it counts as a total of +3 in enhancement bonuses if someone wants to magic (or tech) it up later.

And if you have tech commonly available I'd get rid of the burn out rules for batteries. Otherwise I'd keep the costs the same for everything just so you don't wreck the Pathfinder economy. If the high prices really bother you, make a list of "common items" and reduce them down to 10% of the listed cost. Make sure you keep items you don't want to see a ton of at the listed price. Especially rocket launchers.


Yes, Meirril! That's what I'm talking about. Thanks for the name branding.

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