House-Rule Idea: Minimum Resolve


Homebrew


Seeing as Resolve is a very precious resource in Starfinder and if one were to make a more “unusual character build” could feel punished with a reduced pool compared to other players. To resolve this hypothetical situation I have come up with a housefuls: Minimum Resolve. Basically if you calculate your Resolve and it’s lower than the minimum, your maximum Resolve is equal to the Minimum.

At 1st level the Minimum Resolve is equal to 3. This number increases at 5th level and every five levels thereafter. At 5th level it becomes 5, at 10th it’s 10, at 15th it’s 12 and at 20th it’s 17. If you take the Extra Resolve feat, your Minimum Resolve increases by 1.

What do you guys think?

I’m sure someone has probably stated something like this before and if they have, I apologize for beating a dead horse.

Dataphiles

While I appreciate the motivation behind the minimum concept, if you are house ruling anyway, why not just allow the key stat to be chosen at 1st level (instead of being determined by class)?

With this rule the only situation in which your resolve would be below 3 at first level is if you put 12s in every ability.

So, unless you go out of your way to make your key stat as low as possible, you'd be pretty close to your minimums anyway.


"Dr." Cupi wrote:

While I appreciate the motivation behind the minimum concept, if you are house ruling anyway, why not just allow the key stat to be chosen at 1st level (instead of being determined by class)?

With this rule the only situation in which your resolve would be below 3 at first level is if you put 12s in every ability.

So, unless you go out of your way to make your key stat as low as possible, you'd be pretty close to your minimums anyway.

That’s fair.

Sovereign Court

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I've gone simpler and simply houseruled it to 4 + 1/2 level for everyone. Ability modifiers don't enter into it anymore.


Ascalaphus wrote:
I've gone simpler and simply houseruled it to 4 + 1/2 level for everyone. Ability modifiers don't enter into it anymore.

How has that played out at your table?


Eh, resolve is really only a precious resource for the classes that use it to fuel abilities, or specific character builds that use items that can use resolve to enhance their abilities.

If a player isn't one of those, but still burns through all their resolve enough to want more via house rules (instead of the feat, or by upping the associated stat) I'd rather encourage a smarter/better play style, or the mindset that character death happens, and its ok.


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Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Yeah, having played for a while, I can't really imagine running low on Resolve being an issue, unless the GM is running an especially brutal and lethal campaign. And if you are, the PCs should be leveling up fast, because all those APL+2 and +3 fights add up quickly, assuming you actually are giving the appropriate CR and XP for those fights, including all the circumstantial modifiers that make a fight higher CR. Note: "The PCs have been beaten up by multiple prior fights, without the chance to rest or recover" is a circumstance modifier that makes a fight a higher CR. Don't pretend that an APL+3 fight against a party with only half their HP, is actually APL+3.

( Well, okay, I suppose the PCs could constantly be running low on Resolve because they are doing stupid stuff like building Charisma 10 Solarians and Envoys, or running out in the open with no cover when facing a ton of guys with guns. In which case, the solution is "Tell your players to stop doing stupid stuff". )


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I disagree that it's necessarily "precious". Some classes have lots of options for resolve use. Others (operative, mechanic) hardly use them at all except for regaining stamina. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs a solution.

Sovereign Court

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Wingblaze wrote:
I disagree that it's necessarily "precious". Some classes have lots of options for resolve use. Others (operative, mechanic) hardly use them at all except for regaining stamina. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs a solution.

It'd be nice if every class had about equal consumption, so that when one player says "I think we should sleep, I'm dangerously low" the others aren't still at near-full capacity.

So that means that builds that don't take the brunt of the hits, should consider taking some abilities that use resolve to help the brunt-taking PC (perhaps by killing the things hurting them).


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ascalaphus wrote:
Wingblaze wrote:
I disagree that it's necessarily "precious". Some classes have lots of options for resolve use. Others (operative, mechanic) hardly use them at all except for regaining stamina. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs a solution.

It'd be nice if every class had about equal consumption, so that when one player says "I think we should sleep, I'm dangerously low" the others aren't still at near-full capacity.

So that means that builds that don't take the brunt of the hits, should consider taking some abilities that use resolve to help the brunt-taking PC (perhaps by killing the things hurting them).

Indeed. Something to remember: Resolve sitting in your pool unused isn't really *doing* much of anything for you. While Resolve has value as a contingency, past a certain point, unspent Resolve is missed opportunities.

Dark Archive

Wingblaze wrote:
I disagree that it's necessarily "precious". Some classes have lots of options for resolve use. Others (operative, mechanic) hardly use them at all except for regaining stamina. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs a solution.

You don't think being alive is important?


Zero the Nothing wrote:
Wingblaze wrote:
I disagree that it's necessarily "precious". Some classes have lots of options for resolve use. Others (operative, mechanic) hardly use them at all except for regaining stamina. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs a solution.
You don't think being alive is important?

That's not really an acive use so much as having a hitpoint pool. it's also not nearly as much of an issue for an envoy in the back with a gun as it is a tank on the front lines either.

I do love off model builds, but not being as good or focused at your job is part of the price you pay for making something better. Its easily avoidable with a one level dip into another class (such as the ubiquitous soldier dip for soldiervoys)

Sovereign Court

Zero the Nothing wrote:
Wingblaze wrote:
I disagree that it's necessarily "precious". Some classes have lots of options for resolve use. Others (operative, mechanic) hardly use them at all except for regaining stamina. I'm not sure this is a problem that needs a solution.
You don't think being alive is important?

Are you really burning through 8-11 resolve per day just staying alive? Because I usually need only 2-3 for stamina regaining.

If I can spend some of the rest to defeat monsters faster then that can save me or my allies some resolve spent on healing.


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Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Yeah. Again, how many fights are you getting into, that a single character is burning 8-11 resolve just staying alive? That would require either 8-11 short rests, between at *least* as many combat encounters; or else you are getting incapped 2-3 times in a single day.

The former is not a normal level of activity, seeing as that's enough action that you should be more than leveling up in a single day's time, possibly twice. The latter is not exactly expected either, unless either the players are doing something *very* wrong, or the GM is throwing nothing at you but APL+3 or harder fights. Which, note, you aren't really supposed to *do* APL+4 or higher. Not unless the deliberate dramatic intent is "everyone is likely to die". Because against an unmodified APL+4 fight, *everyone is very likely to die*.


Metaphysician wrote:

Yeah. Again, how many fights are you getting into, that a single character is burning 8-11 resolve just staying alive? That would require either 8-11 short rests, between at *least* as many combat encounters; or else you are getting incapped 2-3 times in a single day.

The former is not a normal level of activity, seeing as that's enough action that you should be more than leveling up in a single day's time, possibly twice. The latter is not exactly expected either, unless either the players are doing something *very* wrong, or the GM is throwing nothing at you but APL+3 or harder fights. Which, note, you aren't really supposed to *do* APL+4 or higher. Not unless the deliberate dramatic intent is "everyone is likely to die". Because against an unmodified APL+4 fight, *everyone is very likely to die*.

This is just not my experience. It seems the players routinely get through encounters with relative ease.

We recently played In Pursuit of the Scoured Stars.

The PCs were 6 4th level characters (human mystic, human envoy, elf ranger {class from Starfarer's Companion}, human soldier, human mystic and human envoy) all built with standard point buy and all were within wealth by level.

The final two encounters are a CR 6 and a CR9.

The party split into the ranger and operative and took on the CR 6 encounter while the other 4 took on the CR9 encounter.

I played the enemies pretty much as described in tactics for the encounter.

The PCs won without getting overly damaged. One player did go to 0 wounds and had to use RP to stabilize and others were pretty wounded.

But they won. No outstanding or poor dice rolling by either side.

This has happened across our campaign across all levels 1 to 9.

I just cannot get the challenge rating to actually be challenging.


The PCs were 6 4th level characters

Crs are built around parties of 4.

6 pcs not only increases things linearly (more HP in the party, more damage, more action economy) but since other roles are covered (computers guy, talky talk guy, healer) the extra people tend to be higher on the beatstick scale, increasing the parties damage even more than you'd expect.


BigNorseWolf wrote:

The PCs were 6 4th level characters

Crs are built around parties of 4.

6 pcs not only increases things linearly (more HP in the party, more damage, more action economy) but since other roles are covered (computers guy, talky talk guy, healer) the extra people tend to be higher on the beatstick scale, increasing the parties damage even more than you'd expect.

Yes I understand that CRs are built around a party of 4.

That does not apply to Society Scenarios. They are specifically designed around parties of 6.

Each encounter has a comment box called "Scaling the Encounter" which tells the GM how to weaken the encounter if there is only 4 PCs in the group.

Take a look at a Society Scenario and you will see what I am talking about.

Also the party of 6 took on 2 separate encounters at the same time.

So it was 2 4th level PCs against a CR6 encounter and 4 4th level PCs against a CR 9 encounter.

Neither the 2 PCs nor the 4 PCs helped in the other's encounter.

I ran "Live Exploration Extreme" on the highest Tier with 4 appropriate PCs and they blew right through it.

I have designed CR +2, +3, +4 for four PCs with point buy stats and appropriate wealth by level and they pound the encounters regularly.

The CR system at my table has been an utter flop.

Not that the PCs mind.


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

OTOH, even with that extra oomph, I am looking *really* hinky-eyed at a party of six Level 4s easily winning a fight with a CR 6 and a CR 9 simultaneously. Even alone, even against an oversized party ( two extra PCs should be worth roughly one extra level ), a CR 9 foe should be an overwhelming fight that incapacitates at least one PC per round, on average. *Something* is not actually adding up.

Without knowing more about the PCs or the villains, I can't really make any better guesses, though.


Sure the scenario was "In pursuit of the Scoured Past".

The CR 6 encounter was 3 CR 3 Hellknights.

40 HP EAC 14 KAC 16 Move: 40

Melee: Tactical Pike: +8 (1d8 +4 P)

Ranged Ifrit Flamethrower (15 Ft Cone): +11 (1d6 f, crit burn 1d6) or
MK I Incendiary Grenade (20 ft range): +11 (5ft 1d6 f, crit burn 1d4, DC12 Ref)

Init: +8 Perception +8 FS: +5, RS: +3, WS: +4

The encounter calls for one of the hellknights to only have 10 HP left and the sickened condition.

All three were at 100% for this scenario.

The 2 PCs (No magic items save MK 1 Healing Serum and No fusions)

L4 Operative: 24 SP 28 HP EAC: 18 KAC: 18

Melee: Tac Sword Cane 1d4+2 Crit Bleed 1d3 Trick Attack +1d8

Ranged: Multistage Dual Sniper Rifle: 1d10 +4 p or Tac Pistol (1d6 +2 p)

Init: +10 FS: +3, RS: +8. WS: +5

L4 Ranger: 32 SP 32 HP EAC: 18

Melee: Survival Knife +8 (1d4 +2 s)

Ranged: Azrmuth Laser Rifle: +8 (1d8 +4 f, crit 1d6 burn)

Init: +8 FS: +5, RS: +8 WS: +2

The lay out. The 3 Hellknights are in a control room over looking a library (this is where the other 4 PCs struck. The double doors to the control were shut.

The operative stated 60 feet away on crouching on the stairs with the sniper rifle only her upper third of her body is showing so she has cover. The ranger went to the right door and opened it placing himself along the wall with the door covering him.

Surprise round: Hellnight 1 hit for average damage.

Round 1: Operative reloads and shoots Hellknight 1 again and hits for average damage.

Ranger delays.

Hellknights move up 40 feet 1 uses perception and does not spot the operative.

The other 2 throw grenades at the stairs (logically believing it is the only place the shots could have come from). Both hit but operative save on both and takes no damage.

Ranger now moves the door a bit so he can see and gets ready to fire.

Round 2: Operative reloads and misses Hellknight #1

Hellnight 1 spot operative and directs other 2 forward.

The Hellknights 2 and 3 move up 10 feet and let loose with flamethrowers. Both hit for about 6 points on operative.

Ranger: fires twice at Hellknight #1 who I ruled to be flat footed to the ranger (we use facing in our games).

Ranger hits twice and Hellknight 1 is down and out.

Round 3: Operative drops sniper rifle, draws sword can and takes a swing missing

Hellknight realize that pikes do better damage and each one tags the operative for an additional 16 or so points.

The Operative is almost out of stamina.

The Ranger fires twice, hitting Hellknight 2 for average damage.

Round 4: Operative successfully trick attacks Hellknight 2 for average damage.

Hellknight 2 takes a guarded step back and hits the operative with the tactical pike for above average damage. The operative is now out of stamina and has lost hit points.

Hellknight 3 moves 40 feet towards the ranger and fires the flamethrower hitting for minimal damage.

The ranger fires 2 shots at Hellknight 3 hitting twice for average damage.

Subsequent Rounds:

Hellknight 2 and the operative trade attacks until the operative is dropped

Hellknight 3 and the ranger trade attacks until the third to last round, but both are pretty wounded.

Third to last Round.

Hellknght 2 turns and moves 50 feet toward Hellknight 3 and the ranger.

The Operative spends 2 RP to stabilize.

The ranger drops hellknight 2.

Second to last round.

Operative spends 1 FP to regain consciousness.

Hellknight 2: stabs the ranger with pike. Ranger has 2 hp left.

Ranger's rifle breaks (nat 1 and critical fumble deck result).

Last round.

Operative shoots hellknight 2 in back with tac pistol and drops him.

That's how that went down. I look forward to your comments both good and bad.


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I've only skimmed the round-by-round, but my immediate thoughts:

1. I had assumed, mistakenly, that it was a single CR 6 opponent. Multiple foes makes it a *little* more lenient, since while multiple foes equal multiple attacks, it also means those attacks are weaker and less accurate. Also, multiple foes lose "power" as they lose HP, because downed foes don't fight anymore. By the book, 3 CR 3s are a CR 6, but its a little softer CR 6 than a single tough opponent, IME.

2. According to the stats you give, those Hellknights were not doing the damage they should be. NPCs get "specialization" damage equal to their level, so those flamethrowers should be 1d6+3, and those pikes should probably be 1d8+7. ( Unless I am misremembering, and area weapons don't get specialty damage. )

3. That is a *lot* more damage than your initial description implied. "One PC is down to 2 hit points and the other got incapped" is a lot more than "moderate damage", its "skin of their teeth victory". Which since this is more or less a APL+4 fight, makes sense.

Of course, since this is the most lesser fight, it leaves me wondering about the CR 9 fight. . .


Metaphysician wrote:

I've only skimmed the round-by-round, but my immediate thoughts:

1. I had assumed, mistakenly, that it was a single CR 6 opponent. Multiple foes makes it a *little* more lenient, since while multiple foes equal multiple attacks, it also means those attacks are weaker and less accurate. Also, multiple foes lose "power" as they lose HP, because downed foes don't fight anymore. By the book, 3 CR 3s are a CR 6, but its a little softer CR 6 than a single tough opponent, IME.

2. According to the stats you give, those Hellknights were not doing the damage they should be. NPCs get "specialization" damage equal to their level, so those flamethrowers should be 1d6+3, and those pikes should probably be 1d8+7. ( Unless I am misremembering, and area weapons don't get specialty damage. )

3. That is a *lot* more damage than your initial description implied. "One PC is down to 2 hit points and the other got incapped" is a lot more than "moderate damage", its "skin of their teeth victory". Which since this is more or less a APL+4 fight, makes sense.

Of course, since this is the most lesser fight, it leaves me wondering about the CR 9 fight. . .

1. Yes, my bad it is was a CR 6 encounter not creature.

2. The Hellknight stats where as presented in the scenario. I did not adjust them.

3. These are the two that got walloped. The 4 in the CR 9 encounter virtually unscathed.

Edit: double checked the Hellknight stats and the pike damage is correct +1 STR plus +3 weapon specialization = +4.

I agree that the flamethrower should have had a +3 to its damage.


OK for the CR 9 encounter: Stats a per the scenario

3 CR 3 Hellknights.

40 HP EACH 14 KAC 16 Move: 40

Melee: Tactical Pike: +8 (1d8 +4 P)

Ranged: Ifrit Flamethrower (15 Ft Cone): +11 (1d6 F, crit burn 1d6)

This should have ben played with +3 to damage

or

MK I Incendiary Grenade (20 ft range): +11 (5ft 1d6 +3 F, crit burn 1d4, DC12 Ref)

I have house ruled that grenades get weapon specialization, forgot that in 1st example

Init: +8 Perception +8 FS: +5, RS: +3, WS: +4

Loomarch (unique devil) CR 5

70 HP 17 KAC 19 Move: 30

Melee: Armored Claw: +12 (1d10 +10 S plus grab)

Ranged: Pyre Class Flamethrower (30 Ft Cone): +15 (1d10 +4 F, crit burn 1d6)

This should have ben played with +5 to damage not +4

or

MK II Incendiary Grenade (20 ft range): +15 (10ft 2d6 +5 F, crit burn 1d6, DC13 Ref)

I house ruled that grenades get weapon specialization, forgot that in 1st example

Init: +3 Perception +11 FS: +7, RS: +7, WS: +6

The PCs

L4 Soldier: 32 SP 32 HP EAC: 17 KAC: 17

Melee: Survival Knife +7 (1d4 +3 S)

Ranged: Azmuth Laser Rifle: +7 (1d8 +4 F, crit 1d6 burn)

Init: +7 FS: +5, RS: +4. WS: +4

L4 Envoy: 28 SP 28 HP EAC: 16 KAC: 16

Melee: Survival Knife +5 (1d4 +2 S)

Ranged: Tac Pistol +5(1d6 +2 P)

Init: +8 FS: +2, RS: +6 WS: +4

L4 Mystic (Star Shaman): 28 SP 28 HP EAC: 16 KAC: 16

Melee: Survival Knife +5 (1d4 +2 S)

Ranged: Tac Pistol +5(1d6 +2 P)

Init: +6 FS: +2, RS: +3 WS: +7

2 first level spell slot, 2 2nd level spell slots left and 2 1st level spell gems left

L4 Tecnomancer: 24 SP 24 HP EAC: 16 KAC: 16

Melee: Survival Knife +5 (1d4 +2 S)

Ranged: Tac Pistol +5(1d6 +2 P)

Init: +6 FS: +2, RS: +3 WS: +4
2 first level spell slot, 3 2nd level spell slots left, spell cache, and 2 1st level spell gems left

The PCs entered the SW corner of the library (which is elevated 10 feet with a walkway all the way around the library and were unnoticed as the enemies were all gleefully burning books.

Surprise round.

Envoy moves 30 feet towards Hellknight #1 and goes un noticed.

Soldier moves 15 feet following envoy.

The Mystic and Techno each fire 2 magic missiles at Loomarch for 16 points of damage.

Round 1:

Envoy calls out get 'em on Hellknight #1 and shoots missing.

Mystic and Techno; each fire 3 magic missiles as a full round action at Loomarch dealing 21 points of damage.

Hellknight 1 : moves within range of envoy and hits with flamethrower for minimal damage.

Hellknight 2 & 3: fail their perception checks and continue to burn books.

Soldier fires once at Hellknight #1 and hits for 9.

Loomarch attempts to summon hellhounds and fails. He moves 30 feet towards Techno and Mystic.

Round 2:

Envoy calls out Get on Hellknight #1 and move 30 feet further away from Hellknight and Soldier

Techno and Mystic each fire 3 magic missiles at Loomarch for 13 points of damage. Techo has expended spell cache and Mystic spell gem.

Hellknight #1 moves within range of soldier and hits him with flamethrower for minor damage.

Hellknight #2 realizes their is trouble and moves 30 feet towards Mystic and Techo tossing a grenade that hits but they both save and take minor damage.

Hellknight #3 gleefully continues to burn books

Soldier shoots Hellknight #1 for 10 points of damage.

Loomarch moves 30 feet towards Techo and Mystic. Loomarch hits the Mystic for decent damage but fails the grab.

Round 3:

Envoy move 30 feet back towards Hellknight #1 and calls out Get'em

Techno and Mystic each take a guarded 5 foot step away from Loomarch and each fire 2 magic missiles dealing 20 points of damage. Loomarch is dead. The mystic expends her last spell gem and the techno has expended 1 spell gem.

Hellknight #1 hits soldier with flame thrower for minimal damage.

Hellknight #2 gets into flame thrower ranger and hits the mystic for minimal damage.

Hellknight #3 moves 80 across library to confront Techno.

Soldier fires hitting Hellknight #1 for 7.

Subsequent rounds.

The PCs basically moved 30 and shot once all at the same hellknight unit it went down moving to the next. The hellknights would move and check a grenade for minimal effect. When a hellknight did get in flame thrower range they only ever could get 1 PC at a time.

The combat ended after 8 rounds with no PC taking hit point loss. The Envoy did have to give inspiring boost to the Soldier and Mystic however.

This is how are fights usually go.

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