3 Action Heal


Rules Discussion

Envoy's Alliance

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We have a question about the three action heal from a druid. It states that it heals all willing, living creatures. Does this just heal the allies or does it also extend to healing the enemy that we are fighting as well?


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Enemies too.


It affects all willing living creatures with the heal, and all undead with the damage.

(As the wording is "this targets all" with the aoe version, and the normal version says "if the target is a willing living creature", the willing component is preserved despite it looking like it isn't at first glance).

Of course, I don't see many situations in which a living creature is unwilling to be healed, unless they have a deathwish.

Long story short, just like if you shoot a fireball you can accidentally hurt your allies, you can accidentally heal some enemies with an aoe heal (though in many cases it is worth it in both situations)


You can take a look to the corebook pages 304 and 455:

"Some spells restrict you to willing targets. A player can declare their character a willing or unwilling target at any time, regardless of turn order or their character’s condition (such as when a character is paralyzed, unconscious, or even dead)."

"Some effects require a target to be willing. Only you can decide whether your PC is willing, and the GM decides whether an NPC is willing."


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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

Typically I'd think an enemy would be unwilling unless they were able to identify the spell as it was being cast. Just because the player/DM knows it's heal and beneficial doesn't mean the NPC does.


Tender Tendrils wrote:


Of course, I don't see many situations in which a living creature is unwilling to be healed, unless they have a deathwish.

If the enemy targets you with an unknown spell, are you willing? Possibly not.

Also, the paranoia spell makes the target unwilling to accept any spells.


It is just a way to exploit a mechanic.

A lvl 1 aoe can heal a full party 4d8, if we assume there are 4 members.

It simply means that it have to be used in a tactical way.

Also all the "willingfully creature" stuff is meant to anything good.

For an instance you tell your friend you can turn him into a frog to pass through the guards, but he refuses and decide to go just with stealth.

A campaign with aoe healing stuff spam with no enemy consideration, eventually leaving apart the enemy will save which would be overkill, would be hylarious.


Anguish wrote:
Typically I'd think an enemy would be unwilling unless they were able to identify the spell as it was being cast. Just because the player/DM knows it's heal and beneficial doesn't mean the NPC does.

That is a very good point I had never considered. Does the enemy get any idea of what the spell is when they have to decide if they are willing? Is the default stance "unwilling" to accept spells cast by the other side and you only change to willing if you recognize the spell? Do they have some idea of what is going on since no hostile spells require willing targets?

Of course a cleric can take the Selective Energy class feat (https://2e.aonprd.com/Feats.aspx?ID=283), which seems to imply that 3 action heals do heal enemies or there wouldn't be a feat to avoid it. I didn't see a similar class feat for druids though.


Penthau wrote:
Anguish wrote:
Typically I'd think an enemy would be unwilling unless they were able to identify the spell as it was being cast. Just because the player/DM knows it's heal and beneficial doesn't mean the NPC does.

That is a very good point I had never considered. Does the enemy get any idea of what the spell is when they have to decide if they are willing? Is the default stance "unwilling" to accept spells cast by the other side and you only change to willing if you recognize the spell? Do they have some idea of what is going on since no hostile spells require willing targets?

Of course a cleric can take the Selective Energy class feat (https://2e.aonprd.com/Feats.aspx?ID=283), which seems to imply that 3 action heals do heal enemies or there wouldn't be a feat to avoid it. I didn't see a similar class feat for druids though.

It could go any way "you feel the healing energy wash over you, but you can choose to resist it and reject it" or "the enemy spellcaster casts a spell at you, you can choose to resist it or to let it happen" are both valid interpretations.


Penthau wrote:
Anguish wrote:
Typically I'd think an enemy would be unwilling unless they were able to identify the spell as it was being cast. Just because the player/DM knows it's heal and beneficial doesn't mean the NPC does.

That is a very good point I had never considered. Does the enemy get any idea of what the spell is when they have to decide if they are willing? Is the default stance "unwilling" to accept spells cast by the other side and you only change to willing if you recognize the spell? Do they have some idea of what is going on since no hostile spells require willing targets?

Of course a cleric can take the Selective Energy class feat (https://2e.aonprd.com/Feats.aspx?ID=283), which seems to imply that 3 action heals do heal enemies or there wouldn't be a feat to avoid it. I didn't see a similar class feat for druids though.

A druid could go with cleric dedication

As for any other class which wants to improve his abilities.

Want power attack?
Go fighter
Want swipe?
Go fighter or barbarian
Want occult spells?
Go bard or sorcerer.

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