Wizard (spell-slinger ) x1 / Eldrtich Scoundrel Rogue.


Advice


So I really like Mages who uses Gun and I was curious if Such a build would be viable?

and if so how should i go about it

my Counter mage (Bullet to the face) build fell through so now i'm thinking this


Doable, yes. You're likely getting only a single shot each round with sneak attack until improved invis comes online (unless you mess around with smoke/fog) and that happens at character level 11. So not amazing, but it is reliable.

You might go into the arcane trickster PrC after 5th level for better sneak attack (the attack bonus hardly matters when you're trying to hit touch flat-footed AC anyway) and for the chance to add sneak attack to non-attack roll spells.


avr wrote:

Doable, yes. You're likely getting only a single shot each round with sneak attack until improved invis comes online (unless you mess around with smoke/fog) and that happens at character level 11. So not amazing, but it is reliable.

You might go into the arcane trickster PrC after 5th level for better sneak attack (the attack bonus hardly matters when you're trying to hit touch flat-footed AC anyway) and for the chance to add sneak attack to non-attack roll spells.

So Spellslinger 1 / ES Rogue 4 / Arcane Trickster then back to ES Rogue

I was thinking of playing like a magical hit man

Feats i considering are PBS / Precise shot / Arcane Strike and spell cartridges


I'm going to through this out there as an alternative. Nature fang druid. Here me out. You get studied target and eventually sneak attack. You also get Ashen Path as a second level spell and obscuring mist.

Edited: Take vmc rogue for more sneak attack, and the Slayer talents for ranged feats without prerequisites.


baggageboy wrote:
I'm going to through this out there as an alternative. Nature fang druid. Here me out. You get studied target and eventually sneak attack. You also get Ashen Path as a second level spell and obscuring mist.

well i really want to use a Gun I like the image

but i have never played a druid so i may look in to it at another time

but was ashen path?


Ashen Path is a 2nd spell that lasts for 10 minutes per level and lets you see through fog. Basically it will ensure you always have toal concealment. Also you can split the duration with allies. It's a really good spell for this.


baggageboy wrote:
Ashen Path is a 2nd spell that lasts for 10 minutes per level and lets you see through fog. Basically it will ensure you always have toal concealment. Also you can split the duration with allies. It's a really good spell for this.

I see can i use the Arcane Gun Feature with my Druid spells?


I beleive that technically you can use it with any spells (it was written loosly) but a lot of GM's might not like it. For what it's worth Ashen Path is on a lot of spell lists. So you if you go with a different class still keep it 8n mind.


Fyrtor Smithson wrote:
Ibelive that technically you can use it with any spells (it was written loosly) but a lot of GM's might not like it. For what it's worth Ashen Path is on a lot of spell lists. So you if you go with a different class still keep it 8n mind.

luckily for me Both GMS I know are close friends and really laxed

of course somethings are a no but I don't see it being an issue


@ baggageboy

Since you suggested it i'll ask

how dose sneak attack progress i level ie when dose it go up what levels.


So nature fang give you a single level of sneak at level 4. That's it unfortunately. On the plus side like a Slayer of you sneak attack a target you can "study" it as a free action. Taking vmc rogue will increase your sneak attack at 7, 11, 15, and 19, as well as giving you some other nice benefits, though it will cost you half your feats which is painful. The upside is that nature Fang's get Slayer talents at 4 and every 2 levels after which you can trade for feats. You also don't have wild shape or a lot of the other classic druid abilities. Overall though it makes the class simpler.


baggageboy wrote:
So nature fang give you a single level of sneak at level 4. That's it unfortunately. On the plus side like a Slayer of you sneak attack a target you can "study" it as a free action. Taking vmc rogue will increase your sneak attack at 7, 11, 15, and 19, as well as giving you some other nice benefits, though it will cost you half your feats which is painful. The upside is that nature Fang's get Slayer talents at 4 and every 2 levels after which you can trade for feats. You also don't have wild shape or a lot of the other classic druid abilities. Overall though it makes the class simpler.

well Hmmm I see well the games i am progress slow so there's no telling if i ever see my first VMC rogue sneak attack

but could you recommend me feats 1 as if i did Vmc rogue and the others if i just went with no Vmc


What level are you starting at and what level do you expect to get to? The combo that I've suggested starts pretty slow, so it may not be a great choice if you aren't going to progress a lot.


baggageboy wrote:
What level are you starting at and what level do you expect to get to? The combo that I've suggested starts pretty slow, so it may not be a great choice if you aren't going to progress a lot.

The games i play in normally start between 4 & 5 and end around level 10


Well, here's another question for a gm. Arcane strike scales based on caster level and it requires the ability to cast arcane spells take it, but it doesn't specify that the caster level must be an arcane caster level (though it is strongly implied). If your GM will let you scale arcane strike based on your druid level then I'd build like this. It's not necessarily the best build, but it would be mine.

Human:
1: Arcane strike
1 Bonus: Spell cartridges
2: nature bond: Animal companion
3: vmc rogue (trapfinding)
5: Accomplished sneak attacker
5: slayer talent, ranger combat style 1 (archery): Precise shot
7: slayer talent, ranger combat 2, improved precise shot
9: Weapon focus, gun
11:Gunslinger
11: slayer talent, ranger combat 3, rapid shot

All of that will give you a pretty solid damage with your gun, you don't have to worry about DR because of force bullets. You do give up your swift actions which can be tough.

There are a lot of other options, but it's a fun option.


baggageboy wrote:

I may very well consider it


Nosta1300 wrote:
avr wrote:

Doable, yes. You're likely getting only a single shot each round with sneak attack until improved invis comes online (unless you mess around with smoke/fog) and that happens at character level 11. So not amazing, but it is reliable.

You might go into the arcane trickster PrC after 5th level for better sneak attack (the attack bonus hardly matters when you're trying to hit touch flat-footed AC anyway) and for the chance to add sneak attack to non-attack roll spells.

So Spellslinger 1 / ES Rogue 4 / Arcane Trickster then back to ES Rogue

I was thinking of playing like a magical hit man

Feats i considering are PBS / Precise shot / Arcane Strike and spell cartridges

For class levels I meant spellslinger 1 / ES rogue 4 / arcane trickster X. Not going back into rogue, no. You're taking 1 shot a round and you don't need attack bonus, so the BAB hit is nothing to you, and AT advances spellcasting at each level, sneak attack every other level (twice as fast as ES).

The one rogue talent in that plan is ninja trick (vanishing trick) which you can power with 1st level spell slots as an eldritch scoundrel.


@ Avr

I see.

what feats would you recommend ?

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32

baggageboy wrote:
So nature fang give you a single level of sneak at level 4. That's it unfortunately.

You can get more with the Crocodile domain and the Accomplished Sneak Attacker feat. That gets you 3d6 at level 7, 4d6 at level 11. If your campaign ends around level 10, then that's a pretty good amount.


I'm going to suggest an alternative. Instead of going into Rogue to do sneak attack damage, how about going into Magus (Eldritch Archer archetype)? While you won't get sneak attack damage, you'll be able to channel ranged touch spells into your firearm.

The major benefit from taking a 1 level dip into Spellslinger is being able to feed spells to the gun to get an enchantment bonus. While it is heavily implied you need to feed wizard spells to use the Mage Bullets ability, you should be able to convince your GM to allow Magus spells to be used as well. Combined with the Eldritch Archer's ability to burn pool points to enchant their weapon you'll be able to add enchantments like flaming, frost and shocking. If you add all 3 that is an additional +3d6 damage to most targets that doesn't require you hide between shots.

When you get serious you can throw on a Snowball or Shocking Grasp depending on your build. With the appropriate meta magic feats and traits (use extra traits feat to grab Magical Lineage and Wayang Spellhunter) your first level (ranged) touch spell can be set up to do 10d6 and change to acid as a first level spell, or 15d6 as a second level spell. This build does require 4 feats to pull this off (extra traits, Intensify Spell, Empower Spell and Elemental Spell (acid)) which makes the dip into Spellslinger worth it for the extra feats provided.

This build works better with a single firearm. Two guns means burning twice as many resources to enchant both barrels, and 4 swift actions instead of 2. If you start as a 5th level character see if you can afford a +1 shadowshooting musket. That will save you from reloading. Even if creatures disbelieve your musket damage, the damage from all of your other sources should be unaffected.

Most rounds you'll use 1 normal shot, then 1 spell combat shot. Probably from Icy Ray or Acid Splash. Once you get a lot more feats you'll be able to take Rapid Fire for a 3rd shot. You could sacrifice some of the feats used for metamagic to get Rapid Fire earlier. Like taking the traits as your starting traits and skipping Elemental Spell or Empower spell. If you do that you'll start with 3 attacks per round at -4. Not bad, but 2 attacks at -2 might be better.

Something to point out is this build doesn't need a high int. If you get a 14 int you should be able to afford an item to boost int before it becomes a problem. Spend more stat points on dex and con will go a lot further than int for this sort of build.


@ Meirril

I've played that build before :) and really enjoyed it got to level 8 with it but then the game ended.

This time I wanted to try something diff

I was actually trying to get a similar feel to 3.5's Spellwarp sniper


Nosta1300 wrote:

@ Avr

I see.

what feats would you recommend ?

Point blank shot and precise shot because that's just basic for any archer-type. Accomplished sneak attacker at level 5 to meet the prereqs for AT. Arcane strike, spell cartridges and infused spell cartridges at L7, 9, 11 because you wanted those and they're workable.

Meirill's plan works too. As does baggageboy's.


@ AVR

well I wanted to be more assassin with a magic Gun lol

Meirill's Idea is Actually close to one of my favorite character I did Accept i focused on De-buff spells and raising there Dc as I as I could

Baggageboy's idea dose intrigue me as I've always wanted to play a druid but don't have access to the animals information so cutting out wildshape for my first druid could be nice


That's probably my favorite thing about the nature fang druid, you don't haVe to track all the wildshape stats. It's a downgrade in power if you would have used wildshape, but if you're like me it's worth it because wildshape is too much work. I like Kurald's suggestion if the cocodile domain. If you really want to max out your sneak attack dice it's a solid choice.

I picked the animal companion so that you can have a meat shield/mount. You can still attack while moving if you are mounted, though at a penalty, but if you're sooting at touch flat-footed ac, well you can handle a pretty big penalty and still hit consistently. If you can get a gun that has shadowahooting you can skip the spell cartridges and pick a couple other feats. There's a fair bit of wiggle room depending on starting level and goals within the outlined build.

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