Things you assume from 3.5 / PF1 but are different in PF2!


Pathfinder Second Edition General Discussion

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Scarab Sages

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Ravingdork wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
While one use per wand per day seems pretty restrictive, there is additional space for archetypes or feats to enable a character to get more out of their wands.
That would be seriously cool.

Aw man, I could totally see a swashbuckler/gunslinger archetype that let's them draw and fire off a wand in on action, or like one of those multi coloured pens that you need to slide the coloured bit down on, but for magic.


Angel Hunter D wrote:
Ravingdork wrote:
PossibleCabbage wrote:
While one use per wand per day seems pretty restrictive, there is additional space for archetypes or feats to enable a character to get more out of their wands.
That would be seriously cool.
Aw man, I could totally see a swashbuckler/gunslinger archetype that let's them draw and fire off a wand in on action, or like one of those multi coloured pens that you need to slide the coloured bit down on, but for magic.

We already know what the Swashbuckler version of that would look like.


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Another thing that's different in this edition, melee range spells don't necessarily require an attack roll.


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Have we mentioned that you're not flat-footed in the first round of combat anymore?

Except for rogue which have an ability which specifically grants that (Surprise Attack).

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I think we should start with mentioning that surprise rounds are gone, because I've already played two PF2e games where everybody forgot about that :)


Claxon wrote:

Have we mentioned that you're not flat-footed in the first round of combat anymore?

Except for rogue which have an ability which specifically grants that (Surprise Attack).

That took one of our GMs by surprise, and turned a crit against me back into a regular hit once I pointed it out.


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The wizard discussion posted something very interesting.

Illusions spells actually have rules as to what counts as interacting. No more (or at least reduced) arguing about how useful illusions are.


Barbarian can cast most spells while raging.

Such as dirge of doom, for a singing rage.


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Mellored wrote:

Barbarian can cast most spells while raging.

Such as dirge of doom, for a singing rage.

Can they? They can't concentrate, and verbal components are concentrate. Unless you mean while using the Moment of Clarity feat.

Exo-Guardians

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Mellored wrote:

Barbarian can cast most spells while raging.

Such as dirge of doom, for a singing rage.

No they can't. Spells with a Verbal component (i.e. almost all spells) have the Concentrate trait, which means they can't be cast while raging. Using Silent Spell metamagic doesn't help since that also has the Concentrate trait.


Gorbacz wrote:
I think we should start with mentioning that surprise rounds are gone, because I've already played two PF2e games where everybody forgot about that :)

That's sort of true sort of not. I believe there's a passage in the rules that gives GMs discretion to occasionally allow a surprise round. I forget where it was said.

I only remember this because I dot into a discussion about stealth and how the events should play out.

But generally speaking, no surprise round. You just roll initiative (with some people potentially using Stealth instead of Perception, and sometimes even Deception) and if the person hiding fails to act first it's because the opposing person was able to detect them.

The fact that perception now acts as init, as well as stealth acting as init makes things a lot smoother.


Claxon wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
I think we should start with mentioning that surprise rounds are gone, because I've already played two PF2e games where everybody forgot about that :)

That's sort of true sort of not. I believe there's a passage in the rules that gives GMs discretion to occasionally allow a surprise round. I forget where it was said.

I only remember this because I dot into a discussion about stealth and how the events should play out.

But generally speaking, no surprise round. You just roll initiative (with some people potentially using Stealth instead of Perception, and sometimes even Deception) and if the person hiding fails to act first it's because the opposing person was able to detect them.

The fact that perception now acts as init, as well as stealth acting as init makes things a lot smoother.

It’s possibly possible to ‘cheat’ a surprise round into existence. I’m not certain:

Enter combat mode with everyone in stealth. Perhaps they are considering sneaking around?

The hidden party delays their actions until initiative 0, then attacks. The enemy have already passed this turn, or spent it taking non combat activities as they were unaware of impending combat.

Next turn happens as normal.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Next turn happens as normal, but with the party all at initiative zero. So that clusters initiative into all PCS. Followed by all enemies, but it's not buying anyone an extra round.


Drawing a weapon triggers attacks of opportunity.


Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Claxon wrote:
I believe there's a passage in the rules that gives GMs discretion to occasionally allow a surprise round. I forget where it was said.

CRB page 499.


HammerJack wrote:
Next turn happens as normal, but with the party all at initiative zero. So that clusters initiative into all PCS. Followed by all enemies, but it's not buying anyone an extra round.

Here is the discussion I was referring to. It was slightly different than what I recall, but in there is a quote to support traps or foes sometimes acting (as a reaction) before regular initiative is rolled.

Still it's not a surprise round in the PF1 sense and no real guidance on when it should be allowed.

Generally I would advise ambushers who catch someone unaware get a single action and the ambushers roll init using stealth and everything proceeds as normal otherwise.


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-Being prone doesn't grant you any bonus to your AC vs. ranged (it just makes you flat-footed)

-You can hide, even while being observed, as long as you have cover or concealment.

- Flanking, Prone, etc. all grant the same non-stacking penalty status of Flat-Footed.

Silver Crusade

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AsmodeusDM wrote:

-Being prone doesn't grant you any bonus to your AC vs. ranged (it just makes you flat-footed)

However, while prone you may use the Take Cover action to gain a +4 circumstance bonus to AC against ranged attacks, even without an actual object to hide behind. Still flat-footed, but a net +2 (or better if you have Deny Advantage from rogue or barbarian).

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