The question I have for playtest community is it the minority or the majority who believe that the new spell casting classes need their own spell list?
I personally believe that some of them need new spell lists and some of them can use Spell lists from other classes.
The other question I have about these spell lists should they change the level of some of the spells for the classes like the bard and the summoner?
My question for Paizo is are they hard set against new spell lists for some of these classes?
Now from my point of view which I will be first to admit isn’t the be all end all just my point of view about each class and its need or lack of need for a spell list
Arcanist I do not believe this class needs its own spell list since it a merging of two classes and their spell list which both have the same spell list.
Bloodrager The bloodrager is the class that I think needs its own spell list more than any other class in the playtest. The magus has all kinds of touch spells because of spell combat but without spell combat these spells are a waste. If they really don’t want to do a new spell list maybe just spells from a certain schools based on their bloodline choices.
Hunter I would like to see this class have its own spell list that helps its self and their animal companion more much like the summoner. I would like to see this class be one of the best buffers in the game.
Investigator I do not believe this class needs its own spell list it’s an Alchemist so it should use their list.
Shaman I don’t believe this class needs its own list either I like the idea of spirits adding extra spells like the witches familiar and the Oracles Mysteries
Skald I do not believe this class needs its own spell list it’s a Bard so it should use their list.
Warpriest I would like to see this class have its own list that plays to its war and melee combat focus.
So as a playtest community what do you guys think?
If we want new spell lists then as a community I think we should start to make these new spell lists.
Sounds about rigth. At least the NeardRager need detect magic, and read magic on his list i think.
Before I spend the time to start to work out spell lists I want to make sure that its wanted by the community for these classes
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New spell lists need to be considered very carefully. I don't think the magus spell list is right for the bloodrager, but beyond that I still need to test more before I formulate opinions. New spell lists have a major disadvantage in the form of poor backwards compatibility with Golarion setting specific material. A bloodrager using the magus spell list can use magus spells from Inner Sea Magic, for instance. If the class gets its own brand new spell list, those spells will forever be off limits. That might be fine, but it needs to be tested and considered very carefully.
I will say that if it gets its own spell list, some sort of mechanic that allows it to add to that list from the wizard list would be a major boon.
Im not making excuses but I feel it kinda pointless to make something no one but me agrees with or desires and Paizo isnt interested in
They might have them, but they just weren't quite ready for the play test. I would suggest waiting for the actual book to come out before putting in all the work for you homebrew rules. Remember this is a play test, if you are using different rules than everybody else then your playtest is not going to be very helpful.
Yeah, I think there probably already is a vague "list" of allowed spells for each new class planned out, they just didnt want to clutter up the current release. I think it's needed (the warpriest should get mosrt paladin spells) but it will take a while.
Yeah I dont want to homebrew a list what I wanted was to help Paizo with what the community thought about these classes and their spell lists and to give them more information about what we thought
Sean K Reynolds has stated that there will be no new spell lists for these classes, and that this isn't changing.
Sean K Reynolds has stated that there will be no new spell lists for these classes, and that this isn't changing.
Thanks for that, now I wont waste my time on it
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Arcanist - No.
Bloodrager - Yes. It will suffer from late-access.
Hunter - Yes, ditto the late-access issues.
Investigator - No.
Shaman - Yes. The options that "make sense" for the class are Druid, Cleric, or Witch, but none of them really quite get it right. I think the best thing would be to take where the Adept list is going and blow it up into a list that's big enough for a PC class (a mix of arcane and divine, but done differently than Witch.) I would settle for Witch, personally, however.
Skald - No.
Warpriest - Already seeing playtested proof of how late-access to spells is making the class inherently weaker than a base Cleric, so absolutely yes.
I hope Paizo changes their mind about the spell lists
Arcanist- No, sorc/wizard list is perfectly appropriate.
Bloodrager-Absolutely, 4 levels is not 6, and the magus is very different in theme and mechanics from the blood rager. The two dont match up enough for even a 4 level version of the magus list to be appropriate in my opinion.
Hunter- Yes, 6 levels is not 9, it needs its own list for the same reason all the other 6 level casters have their own list.
Investigator - No, alchemist list is fine.
Shaman - also fine, its a full caster with a full list.
Skald - theme and focus is similar enough to the bard where I wouldnt be unhappy about this not getting its own list but I wouldnt be unhappy about it getting its own list either.
Warpriest - absolutely, the cleric list is sort of a slow starter to begin with, it isnt going to be particularly effective without its own list.
I really didnt have all that much I was more trying to see if there was a desire for this, and everyone wanted to work on it together and do some of the work for Paizo and they could take it and run with it.
I'm on the side of not wanting custom spell lists for the new classes. Sharing spell lists makes it so that I don't have to make a case-by-case decision on every spell from third party books, Campaign Setting and Player Companion books as to whether or not the new class should be able to use a spell.
edit* That said there's no stopping 3rd parties from making spells that only function with the new classes. I'd buy that.
I agree with Sean and the Dev team's reasoning. Though I would prefer Shaman use Druid or Witch list and Investigator use Inquisitor list.
What is there reasoning please link it for me so I can see what they are thinking
I agree with Sean and the Dev team's reasoning. Though I would prefer Shaman use Druid or Witch list and Investigator use Inquisitor list.
I can see Shaman with the Witch list, but why Inquisitor list for Investigator? Wouldn't Alchemist work better considering that they are extracts?
So I read Seans Reply it makes sense but I think its nerfing these classes to make things easier in the amount of type space they are using
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I agree with Sean and the Dev team's reasoning. Though I would prefer Shaman use Druid or Witch list and Investigator use Inquisitor list.I can see Shaman with the Witch list, but why Inquisitor list for Investigator? Wouldn't Alchemist work better considering that they are extracts?
Lot of good divination/investigation spells not on Alchemist list. Interrogate for example.
Lot of good divination/investigation spells not on Alchemist list. Interrogate for example.I agree with Sean and the Dev team's reasoning. Though I would prefer Shaman use Druid or Witch list and Investigator use Inquisitor list.I can see Shaman with the Witch list, but why Inquisitor list for Investigator? Wouldn't Alchemist work better considering that they are extracts?
I disagree because the Inquisitor list doesn't properly represent the 'science guy' aspect, but it is compelling to allow Investigator access to investigation 'spells'.
I do want to reiterate my support of Witch list over Cleric list. Thematically Witches and Shaman should have similar power sources and I think too many classes have the Cleric list. Not to mention that Shaman is everything I wished a Witch was.
The question I have for playtest community is it the minority or the majority who believe that the new spell casting classes need their own spell list?
To me a best case scenario is that they get the spell lists they have already in the play test documents and then specific paizo spells that would fit the class concept that are from other classes called out for each.
The reason to keep the existing spell selections as listed in the playtest documents is for ease of integration of 3.x and third party material for people who want to do so.
Paizo has always wanted Pathfinder to be (for the most part) backwards compatibale and doing the spell lists as they have so far allows that.
What I don't understand is why the spell [bhave][/b] to be spread out over all the levels.
Take the Hunter for example, it's a Druid without 7-9th level spells. Making them wait so long for 6th level spells make losing the high level ones all the more painful. Just give them 1-6 at the normal rate but at a certain point they don't get any more.
My first thougts on the Blood Rager is the too many touch spells using the Magus. But testing it out the magus spell works quite well for the blood rager though I pretty much ignored all the touch spells. I took list of known spells like this:
1 Enlarge Person, Expeditious Retreat, Feath Fall, Magic Missle, Shield, True Strike
2 Alter Self, Bulls Strength, Blur, web, gust of wind
3 Discplacement. Fireball, Haste, Water Breathing
Remember the Blood Rager is not really a caster. It's martial class with spell access like the Paladin and Ranger. Only real difference is the blood rager can cast fewer spells per day than the ranger and paladin at 20th level. Otherwise much the same. No need to focus to heavily on spell list if the Magus works fine. What other spell would you like?
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Do the new classes need their own spell lists?
Yes.
They need new spell lists for the same reason the Bard needed one different from Wizards or Clerics. Or Rangers and Paladins have differing spell lists from the classes they're "hybrids" of (fighter/druid and fighter/cleric). Or the Magus. Or the Witch.
It is for class balance and for the feel of these classes.
And ignoring this and just doing a slapdash job will end up with classes that are fundamentally broken rather than something worthy of being considered Pathfinder classes.
Of course, this goes deeper than just spell lists. This also works true for class abilities. You can't just toss together abilities from two classes and call it a done deal. You have to modify things so that the alloy is strengthened instead of weakened.
I would love for the bloodrager to have its own list, instead of "levels 1-4 of the magus list". Why? So it will keep people from comparing the bloodrager to the magus, instead of comparing it to the class's actual counterparts, the paladin and ranger. And also keeping people from saying it needs to be more like the magus and get a 3/4 BAB and d8 hit dice.
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Sorta, I like the idea of giving classes like the bloodrager access to wizard schools instead of spell list. Instead of using the magus spell list, you would use conjuring, necromancy, and transmutation spells up to 4th level. (Note: I just pulled those schools of magic out of my ass, I don't know which schools would work the best). It still saves time and ink, but still adds a little something to differentiate the new classes from the old.
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Arcanist - No.
Bloodrager - Yes.
Hunter - Yes.
Investigator - No.
Shaman - Yes.
Skald - No.
Warpriest - yes.
Agreed with this guy
Note that they have also said there will be no spells in the book. One of the developers said we would for instance be seeing some more inquisitor esq spells for the alchemist list, to help augment the Investigator.
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I don't think they need new spells just for the class themselves (at least not at the moment), but I think out of the spells that are currently available it shouldn't just be "oh just use the sorcerer's already established list". There are a lot of spells out there that would work for each of the classes that are on other lists than just what we're being told to use right now. So, while the sorcerer list might work fine, there could be a cleric only or witch only spell that also fits thematically. Maybe a paladin spell or a half dozen would work well for the warpriest as well?
When the time comes, I think they should have a more thorough list.
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When I said (in the past in multiple occasions) that these classes need their own spell lists, I don't mean all-new spells. I mean they need their own UNIQUE listings of spells. Thus the Shaman may have a combination of wizard and cleric spells from the other books. The Bloodrager may have some sorcerer and some magus spells. The Warpriest and Hunter will have their own spells taken from the cleric and druid spell lists and leveled appropriately for them.
If this is what Paizo plans (and yes, I know the Arcanist doesn't really need its own spell list in that situation, but the other classes would!) then that deals with one major problem I've had with these classes.
The other problems... well, hopefully the playtest will deal with them, just as it is doing with the Arcanist.
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Seems to me like a happy medium would be 1) rely more on spell lists designed for half/3/4, not full casters, 2) just expand those as needed, and 3) just don't add new spells.
The thing with spell lists designed with less-than-full casters is they were a little more balanced to be with a less-than-full casting class. Trying to shoehorn a square full caster list into a round partial-caster hole is the problem.
I tried doing a "warpriest spell list." I started with the Paladin Spell List, and then combed the cleric and inquisitor lists for appropriate spells, particularly for 0, 5th, and 6th level (removing anything that was obviously intended to be class-specific).
This is what I ended up with:
Warpriest Spell List
Orisons
Bleed: Cause a stabilized creature to resume dying.
Create Water: Creates 2 gallons/level of pure water.
Daze: A single humanoid creature with 4 HD or less loses its next action.
Detect Magic: Detects spells and magic items within 60 ft.
Detect Poison: Detects poison in one creature or object.
Disrupt Undead: Deals 1d6 damage to one undead.
Guidance: +1 on one attack roll, saving throw, or skill check.
Light: Object shines like a torch.
Mending: Makes minor repairs on an object.
Purify Food and Drink: Purifies 1 cu. ft./level of food or water.
Read Magic: Read scrolls and spellbooks.
Resistance: Subject gains +1 on saving throws.
Sift: See area as though examining it.
Spark: Ignites flammable objects.
Stabilize: Cause a dying creature to stabilize.
Virtue: Subject gains 1 temporary hp.
1st Level
ALIGN Weapon*: Weapon strikes true against foes of one alignment.
Bless: Allies gain +1 on attack rolls and saves against fear.
Bless Water (CURSE water): Makes holy water.
Bowstaff: A shortbow may double as a club, or a longbow as a quarterstaff.
Challenge Evil(GOOD/LAW/CHAOS)*: Sickens creature if it refuses to fight you.
Compel Hostility: Compels opponents to attack you instead of your allies.
Create Water: Creates 2 gallons/level of pure water.
Cure Light Wounds: Cures 1d8 damage + 1/level (max +5).
Detect Poison: Detects poison in one creature or small object.
Detect Undead: Reveals undead within 60 ft.
Diagnose Disease: Detect and identify diseases.
Divine Favor: You gain +1 per three levels on attack and damage rolls.
Endure Elements: Exist comfortably in hot or cold regions.
Ghostbane Dirge: Incorporeal creature takes half damage from nonmagical weapons.
Grace: Movement doesn't provoke attacks of opportunity.
Honeyed Tongue: Roll 2 dice when using Diplomacy, take higher roll.
Horn of Pursuit: Create three notes heard miles away.
Knight's Calling: Forces target to move toward you and fight you.
Know the Enemy: Gain +10 on a monster Knowledge check.
Liberating Command: Target makes an Escape Artist check as an immediate action and gains a bonus on it.
Litany of Sloth: Single target cannot make attacks of opportunity for 1 round.
Longshot: Grants a +10-foot bonus to the range increment for any ranged weapon fired.
Magic Weapon: Weapon gains +1 bonus.
Protection from Chaos/Evil/Good/Law: +2 to AC and saves, plus additional protection against selected alignment.
Protection from Chaos/Evil/Good/Law: +2 to AC and saves, plus additional protection against selected alignment.
Rally Point*: Square gives good/EVIL/CHAOTIC/LAWFUL creatures bonuses.
Read Magic: Read scrolls and spellbooks.
Resistance: Subject gains +1 on saving throws.
Restoration, Lesser: Dispels magical ability penalty or repairs 1d4 ability damage.
Sanctify Corpse: Prevent a corpse from becoming an undead.
Summon Monster I: Summons extraplanar creature to fight for you.
Sun Metal: Weapon touched bursts into flames.
Tactical Acumen: You gain an additional +1 on attack rolls or to AC due to battlefield positioning.
Veil of Positive Energy: +2 AC, +2 on saves vs. undead.
Virtue: Subject gains 1 temporary hp.
Word of Resolve: Ally rerolls a save against charm or fear.
2nd Level
Arrow of Law/Chaos/Evil/Good*: Harm and possibly daze creatures of chosen alignment*.
Bestow Grace: Subject gains bonus on saving throws equal to Cha modifier.
Bestow Weapon Proficiency: Grants a creature proficiency in a single weapon for short period of time.
Blessing of Courage and Life: Grants a +2 bonus on saves vs. fear and death.
Bull's Strength: Subject gains +4 to Str for 1 min./level.
Corruption Resistance: Protects creature against damage from alignment-based attacks.
Delay Poison: Stops poison from harming subject for 1 hour/level.
Eagle's Splendor: Subject gains +4 to Cha for 1 min./level.
Effortless Armor: Armor you wear no longer slows your speed.
Endure Elements, Communal: As endure elements, but you may divide the duration among creatures touched.
Holy Shield: Lend your shield's protection to another.
Instant Armor: Summon armor temporarily replacing your current attire.
Light Lance: Creates a soaring beacon of light.
Litany of Defense: Doubles armor's enhancement bonus.
Litany of Eloquence: Fascinates a single creature for 1 round.
Litany of Entanglement: Entangles a creature for 1 round.
Litany of Righteousness: A single evil creature takes more damage from creatures with a good aura.
Litany of Warding: You gain two additional attacks of opportunity for 1 round.
Magic Siege Engine: Siege engine gains +1 on targeting and damage rolls.
Owl's Wisdom: Subject gains +4 to Wis for 1 min./level.
Protection from Chaos/Evil/Good/Law, Communal: As protection from chaos/evil/good/law, but you may divide the duration among creatures touched.
Remove Paralysis: Frees one or more creatures from paralysis or slow effect.
Resist Energy: Ignores 10 or more points of damage per attack from specified energy type.
Righteous Vigor: Boosts attack bonus with each hit.
Sacred BondF: Cast touch healing spells from a distance.
Saddle Surge: Bonus damage for moving on mount.
Shield OtherF: You take half of subject's damage.
Summon Monster II: Summons extraplanar creature to fight for you.
Undetectable Alignment: Conceals alignment from magical detection for 24 hours.
Weapon of Awe: Weapon gets +2 on damage rolls.
Zone of Truth: Subjects within range cannot lie.
3rd Level
Blessing of the Mole: 1 ally/level gains darkvision and a +2 Stealth bonus.
Burst of Speed: You gain increased speed, and your movement ignores attacks of opportunity and allows you to move through the space of creatures larger than you are.
Cure Moderate Wounds: Cures 2d8 damage +1/level (max. +10).
Daybreak Arrow: Targeted ammunition exudes radiant energy.
Daylight: 60-ft. radius of bright light.
Deadly Juggernaut: Your might increases with every kill you make.
Deeper Darkness: Object sheds supernatural shadow in 60-ft. radius.
Delay Poison, Communal: As delay poison, but you may divide the duration among creatures touched.
Discern Lies: Reveals deliberate falsehoods.
Dispel Magic: Cancels one magical spell or effect.
Divine Transfer: Transfer hit points and give DR/evil to target creature.
Ghostbane Dirge, Mass: As ghostbane dirge, but affects multiple creatures.
ALIGNED Whisper*: Whisper sickens creatures of one alignment, gives creatures of opposite alignment bonuses.
Litany of Escape: Teleports a friend out of a grapple.
Litany of Sight: You can see invisible creatures and objects within 30 feet of you.
Magic Circle against Chaos/Evil: As protection from chaos, but 10-ft. radius and 10 min./level.
Magic Weapon, Greater: Weapon gains +1 bonus/four levels (max +5).
Marks of Forbiddance: Makes 2 creatures pass Will saves in order to attack each other.
Prayer: Allies get +1 bonus on most rolls, enemies –1 penalty.
Remove Blindness/Deafness: Cures normal or magical blindness or deafness.
Remove Curse: Frees object or person from curse.
Resist Energy, Communal: As resist energy, but you may divide the duration among creatures touched.
Summon Monster III: Summons extraplanar creature to fight for you.
Wrathful Mantle: Subject shines and gets +1/four levels on all saves.
4th level
Air Walk: Subject treads on air as if solid (climb or descend at 45-degree angle).
Break Enchantment: Frees subjects from enchantments, transmutations, and curses.
Cure Serious Wounds: Cures 3d8 damage + 1/level (max +15).
Death Ward: Grants bonuses against death spells and negative energy.
Dispel Chaos/Evil/Good/Law: +4 bonus against attacks by creatures of chosen alignment.
Freedom of Movement: Subject moves normally despite impediments to movement.
King's Castle: Instantly switch places with a single ally.
Magic Siege Engine, Greater: Siege engine gains +1 on targeting and damage rolls for every four caster levels.
Neutralize Poison: Immunizes subject against poison, detoxifies venom in or on subject.
Reprobation: Marked target is shunned by your religion.
Resounding Blow: Melee attack deals 1d6 more damage.
RestorationM: Restores level and ability score drains.
Planar Adaptation: Resist harmful effects of other plane.
Sacrificial Oath: Take damage for an ally for many rounds.
Stay the Hand: Subject cannot attack with melee weapon.
Summon Monster IV: Summons extraplanar creature to fight for you.
Symbol of Healing: Triggered rune heals living creatures.
Zealot’s Sword [Holy sword realigned*]: Weapon becomes +5, deals +2d6 damage against chosen alignment.
5th level
Astral Projection, Lesser: Limited astral travel.
AtonementFM: Removes burden of misdeeds from subject.
Banishment: Banishes 2 HD/level of extraplanar creatures.
Breath of Life: Cures 5d8 damage + 1/level and restores life to recently slain creatures.
Cleanse: Cures 4d8 damage +1/level (max +25) and also removes several afflictions.
Command, Greater: As command, but affects one subject/level.
CommuneM: Deity answers one yes-or-no question/level.
Cure Light Wounds, Mass: Cures 1d8 damage + 1/level, affects 1 subject/level.
Disrupting Weapon: Melee weapon destroys undead.
Flame Strike: Smites foes with divine fire (1d6/level damage).
Geas/Quest: As lesser geas, but affects any creature.
Ghostbane Dirge, Mass: As ghostbane dirge, but affects multiple creatures.
HallowM: Designates location as holy.
Inflict Light Wounds, Mass: Deals 1d8 damage + 1/level, affects 1 subject/level.
Litany of Thunder: A single target is deafened until the condition is removed, and is confused for 1 round.
Litany of Vengeance: Allies attacking the target of the spell gain a +5 bonus on damage rolls for 1 round.
Raise DeadM: Restores life to subject who died as long as one day/level ago.
Resounding Blow: Melee attack deals 1d6 more damage.
Righteous Might: Your size increases, and you gain bonuses in combat.
Spell Immunity, Communal: As spell immunity, but you may divide the duration among creatures touched.
Spell Resistance: Subject gains SR 12 + level.
Summon Monster V: Summons extraplanar creature to fight for you.
Telepathic Bond: Link lets allies communicate.
True SeeingM: Lets you see all things as they really are.
UnhallowM: Designates location as unholy.
Unwilling ShieldM: Subject shares wounds you receive.
Wall of Stone: Creates a stone wall that can be shaped.
6th level
Air Walk, Communal: As air walk, but you may divide the duration among creatures touched.
Blade Barrier: Wall of blades deals 1d6/level damage.
Blasphemy: Kills, paralyzes, weakens, or dazes nonevil subjects.
Bull's Strength, Mass: As bull's strength, affects 1 subject/level.
Circle of DeathM: Kills 1d4/level HD of creatures.
Cleanse: As heal, but only cures 4d8 damage +1/level (max +25).
Cure Moderate Wounds, Mass: Cures 2d8 damage + 1/level, affects 1 subject/level.
Dictum: Kills, paralyzes, staggers, or deafens nonlawful targets.
Dispel Magic, Greater: As dispel magic, but with multiple targets.
Find the Path: Shows most direct way to a location.
ForbiddanceM: Blocks planar travel, damages creatures of different alignment.
Harm: Deals 10 points/level damage to target.
Heal: Cures 10 points/level damage, all diseases and mental conditions.
Heroes' Feast: Food for one creature/level cures and grants combat bonuses.
Holy Word: Kills, paralyzes, blinds, or deafens nongood subjects.
Inflict Moderate Wounds, Mass: Deals 2d8 damage + 1/level, affects 1 subject/level.
Joyful Rapture: Negate harmful emotions.
Legend LoreMF: Lets you learn tales about a person, place, or thing.
Litany of Madness: A single target is confused for at least 1 round.
Planar Adaptation, Mass: As planar adaptation, but affects multiple creatures.
RepulsionF: Creatures can't approach you.
Summon Monster VI: Summons extraplanar creature to fight for you.
Undeath to DeathM: Destroys 1d4/level HD of undead (max. 20d4).
Word of Chaos: Kills, confuses, stuns, or deafens nonchaotic subjects.
Word of Recall: Teleports you back to designated place.
Would that be worth testing out? It is definitely a quick and dirty job and needs tweaking I'm sure.
Is understandable why they have no specific lists; can create problems with spells published after the book.
I think many of the problems of lists inappropriate for the hybrids can be cleared with specific early access and a adding a few spells of other lists.
Something like;
Blood Rager use the Magus spell lists, but change the spell level of <list of spells and spells levels> and adds those spells to the lists.
I hope that something like that could be done with one or two paragraphs and would help greatly those classes.
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I rather sacrifice a few pages of other stuff so these classes got the spells the should have and they seem like full fledged classes not fancy archtypes
Spell lists:
Arcane:
Full- Sorcerer/Wizard, Witch,
6/9- Bard, Summoner, Magus
4/9-
Divine/Deity:
Full- Cleric/Oracle
6/9- Inquisitor
4/9- Paladin
Divine/Nature:
Full-Druid
6/9-
4/9-Ranger
Science:
Full-
6/9- Alchemist
4/9-
Looking at it like this I would say there needs to be a shared list for 4/9 Arcane casters, 6/9 for Nature casters, Science full 'casters', and 4/9 Science 'casters'.
Preferably I'd like to see a full, 6/9, and 4/9 list for each of those categories and have classes all share those spells (deviating using permanent choices like patrons or domains) but we're far past happening. I think I wouldn't be too choked up if Warpriest had the Inquisitor spell list rather than the cleric so I think the 6/9 Nature caster is the only thing that hasn't been filled and would deserve a custom list. Probably a 4/9 arcane list would work out but I think going 4/9 on the Magus list is useful enough.
For backwards compatibility I wouldn't go for custom list but I think overall filling the gaps I mentioned would open design space.
God I am horrible at posting
"Note that they have also said there will be no spells in the book. One of the developers said we would for instance be seeing some more inquisitor esq spells for the alchemist list, to help augment the Investigator."
That should say:
Note that they have also said there will be new spells in the book. One of the developers said we would for instance be seeing some more inquisitor esq spells for the alchemist list, to help augment the Investigator.
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Yeah, I'm beginning to think that the bloodrager needs its own spell list or there needs to be a better way to organize his spells.
There are many problems with creating new spell lists. The least of which is filling up the book with more text. Taking a look at the magus, we have a simple and easy format for presenting the basic spell list for the class.
The other problems have to deal with spell presentation and aspects of backward compatibility, not only in our core rulebook, but also the other Pathfinder lines (and by extension, third party publishers).
All of that said, we are looking into the possibilities, their pros and cons, and will make the right decision for the classes and the game.
To expand my previous post, my idea would seem something like that;
BloodRager uses the Magus spell list, but have altered the level of the next spells:
1- Detect Magic, Elemental Body I, Mage Hand, Monstrous Physic I
2- Elemental Body II,Monstrous Physic I
3- Monstrous Physic I
4- CloudKill, Monstrous Physic I
Also, the BloodRager add the following spells to those he can casts, even if those aren't Magus Spells:
1- Anticipate Peril, Ant Haul, Break
2- Boiling Blood, Mad Hallucination
3- Pain Strike, Rage, Unadultered Loathing
4- Primal Scream
Of course, that list is only to express better my idea, nothing more. I think that way the new classes could have more interesting spell list, only with some few more paragraph for each one.
PD: Please, I love the BloodRager, but change the name of the class. Is horrible.
Yeah, I'm beginning to think that the bloodrager needs its own spell list or there needs to be a better way to organize his spells.
There are many problems with creating new spell lists. The least of which is filling up the book with more text. Taking a look at the magus, we have a simple and easy format for presenting the basic spell list for the class.
The other problems have to deal with spell presentation and aspects of backward compatibility, not only in our core rulebook, but also the other Pathfinder lines (and by extension, third party publishers).
All of that said, we are looking into the possibilities, their pros and cons, and will make the right decision for the classes and the game.
Glad to hear this.
Though Hunter could use this as well, Bloodrager is in even heavier need of a proper spell list!
Also, the backwards compatibility for some spellcasting classes could always be fixed up by some occasionally updated free web enhancement doc/the prd- though, that does leave third party as sadface. Hm...
The Hunter strongly needs this. So does the Shaman. I mean, the Witch has a different spell list; it only took part of a page to list the spells. So why not do that with the Shaman and the Hunter? (And also very likely the Investigator but I'm not touching the alchemy-based classes with a ten-meter cattleprod. I don't like the class. That's just me though, it's probably too outside "classic" AD&D for my tastes.)
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I'm a little surprised nobody cared for the suggestion on the thread Playtest Data: Thoughts on the bloodrager. A poster there going by, The dragon, made a interesting suggestion. His suggestion was to take a cue from the old Suel Arcanamach prestige class, and give a limited selection to around 3 or 4 schools of magic, to the bloodrager, that seemed most appropriate. I know I'm reiterating, but I thought it was a cleaver halfway point between a custom spell list and a already standardized one.
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I'm a little surprised nobody cared for the suggestion on the thread Playtest Data: Thoughts on the bloodrager. A poster there going by, The dragon, made a interesting suggestion. His suggestion was to take a cue from the old Suel Arcanamach prestige class, and give a limited selection to around 3 or 4 schools of magic, to the bloodrager, that seemed most appropriate. I know I'm reiterating, but I thought it was a cleaver halfway point between a custom spell list and a already standardized one.
That is actually one of the options I'm looking at.
I'm a little surprised nobody cared for the suggestion on the thread Playtest Data: Thoughts on the bloodrager. A poster there going by, The dragon, made a interesting suggestion. His suggestion was to take a cue from the old Suel Arcanamach prestige class, and give a limited selection to around 3 or 4 schools of magic, to the bloodrager, that seemed most appropriate. I know I'm reiterating, but I thought it was a cleaver halfway point between a custom spell list and a already standardized one.That is actually one of the options I'm looking at.
That... would not suck. I don't know if I'd actually like it, but it would not suck.
Still leaves the others, though!