Summoned Monsters:


I am starting a new game and i want to play as a Summoning focused Wizard, but looking at the summon spells, by level 7 i will be summoning monsters with my level -4.

The summoned creatures only have 2 actions, and i need to use one action every turn to keep the summoned creature up.

Making some rough math, it seems like summons are unlikely to be as efficient as other spells because of the level of monster being summoned.

If it was Level-3 it would be ok... At level-2 it would be overpowered if optmized, but at level-4 it feels weak.

Any different opnion? Any math that i am failing to see?
I am basing myself on the monsters on bestiary, their hit and defenses and the hit and defenses of a character of my level as comparison.

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Summoned monsters start out ok, become very mediocre in the mid levels and fall off drastically once you're past level 13 or so.

Their numbers (attack, AC, saves, DCs, etc.) become increasingly worse. The Conjurer's Augment Summoning can make them last a tiny bit longer but doesn't really salvage the situation.

Summoned creatures at high levels are mostly walls of HP between you and the enemy. The best summons have special abilities that don't rely too much on numbers. Summons with buff spells are always nice, as are summoned dragons with a breath that hits enemy weaknesses (even though those enemies might have a 40% chance of critical success).

But yeah, as much as Summons needed to be weaker compared to PF1, I think Paizo overdid it, making summons too weak at the higher levels. Making them cost you an action each turn while only having two actions (and no reaction) themself on top of being up to 5 levels behind the caster is just too much.

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No, you don't miss something. Summons are just freaking bad.

Anyone can help me with proper math about it?

I would like to know how much they would need to be buffed to be better balanced.

Right now i think the list should be:

1 Circle: Level -1.
2 Circle: Level 1.
3 Circle: Level 2
4 Circle: Level 4
5 Circle: Level 6
6 Circle: Level 8
7 Circle: Level 10
8 Circle: Level 12
9 Circle: Level 14
10 Circle: Level 16

Anything that disable your turn will end your summon. And having two summons active becomes really hard, so i don't know much is needed to make summons work.

On the other hand the game right now is based on group buffs, so summons might be buffed and could in theory be overpowered if they are good enough alone. (The more targets for buffs, the more efficient each buff becomes, so it may tip the balance...)

They do have a lot of HP though, I think a good fix would be a feat that have large bonuses but sacrificed most of the summons hp.

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