Permanent Dragon Druids?


Rules Discussion


I am not seeing a bunch of threads on this topic, so I can only assume I am not reading the rules right.

Is it true that if I take "Dragon Shape" at 12, and "Perfect Form Control" at 18, that I can stay in the shape of a Dragon permanently?

Since Dragons live forever, do I need "Timeless Nature" at 14 any more?

Since (some) Dragons can cast spells, can't I too cast spells while wildshaped?

Since some dragons can shape into human, can't I use that to perform my human duties?

My gut says I have the first one wrong, so the rest are moot, but I don't know why.


You can stay in the shape of a dragon permanently. The shape. Just because you change into the form of a dragon doesn't mean you are a dragon. You don't live forever or gain the ability to turn into a human; you just get what the spell says you get. You can cast spells, because the spell specifically calls out being able to take manipulate actions. You're using magic to pretend that you're a dragon.


Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscriber

looking at it the only thing dragon form overrides is you have hands and can use them to perform manipulate actions.

otherwise

Quote:

Polymorph

These effects transform the target into a new form. A target
can’t be under the effect of more than one polymorph effect
at a time. If it comes under the effect of a second polymorph
effect, the second polymorph effect attempts to counteract
the first. If it succeeds, it takes effect, and if it fails, the
spell has no effect on that target. Any Strikes specifically
granted by a polymorph effect are magical. Unless otherwise
stated, polymorph spells don’t allow the target to take on the
appearance of a specific individual creature, but rather just a
generic creature of a general type or ancestry.
If you take on a battle form with a polymorph spell, the
special statistics can be adjusted only by circumstance bonuses,
status bonuses, and penalties. Unless otherwise noted, the
battle form prevents you from casting spells, speaking, and
using most manipulate actions that require hands. (If there’s
doubt about whether you can use an action, the GM decides.)
Your gear is absorbed into you; the constant abilities of your
gear still function, but you can’t activate any items.

and dragon is a battle form


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Which, since it specifically says it stops casting spells and the dragon form does not say it allows spell casting, you just have the ability to do manipulate actions. Which is pretty sad. But 'balance' I guess.

Sadly, the shapechange spells don't use common sense, they use meta sense. You battle form and unless the spell says otherwise, you get to do nothing but attack with its given attacks.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens Subscriber

As Dragons can talk, I don't see why a druid could not cast magic while transformed and to be clear the spell Humanoid form does not say you could talk either.


Dragons are not immortal in Golarion. They do in fact die of old age. There's no listed maximum age, but according to Dragon's Revisited, apparently Daralathyxl is a 'major concern' to the Conclave of Dragons because he's over two thousand years old and hasn't died of old age yet. So it's apparently less than 2k years, to take from that.

Even in 3.5e they weren't immortal. In the Draconomicon, metallic dragons had a lifespan of about 4500-6500 years and chromatics were about 1k-2k shorter.

So even if Dragon Form assumed the age rate of a dragon, you'd still die eventually.


Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscriber
Bluevd wrote:
As Dragons can talk, I don't see why a druid could not cast magic while transformed and to be clear the spell Humanoid form does not say you could talk either.

1. dragons are a battle form, so apperently you don't know how to speak properly with your new mouth *shrug*

2. humanoid form DOES NOT give you a battle form and thus doesn't limit your actions.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Bluevd wrote:
As Dragons can talk, I don't see why a druid could not cast magic while transformed and to be clear the spell Humanoid form does not say you could talk either.

Specific rules say, battleforms can not cast spells. I would agree they can talk AND cast spells, but the specific rules say no. Humanoid form is not a battleform so it allows normal actions.


Dragon Form gives you the dragon trait. I don't have the Beastrary infront of me but I think it lists dragons speaking there. thus I would rule being poloymorphed into a dragon would let you speak.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder Second Edition / Rules Discussion / Permanent Dragon Druids? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.