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Rules Discussion

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The Exchange

Ranger Feat questions

Does Crossbow Ace's stricture on simple crossbow for damage dice improvement only apply to a regular crossbow or does it apply to the other simple crossbows (i.e. hand crossbow and Heavy Crossbow)

Does the feat running reload apply to Heavy crossbows such that you can move and reload as 1 action


Laran wrote:

Ranger Feat questions

Does Crossbow Ace's stricture on simple crossbow for damage dice improvement only apply to a regular crossbow or does it apply to the other simple crossbows (i.e. hand crossbow and Heavy Crossbow)

Does the feat running reload apply to Heavy crossbows such that you can move and reload as 1 action

Any crossbow that's simple works, so yes, those get the feat's boost.

It's future-proofing for if and when they get the Minotaur double crossbow and/or reloading crossbows.

You can use Running Reload to do one reload action w/ a Heavy Crossbow while moving. But note that it takes two reload actions to actually reload. So you could use Running Reload again, meaning Heavy Crossbows are decent weapons when kiting. :)
(And seldom otherwise outside of their first shot.)


Castilliano wrote:

You can use Running Reload to do one reload action w/ a Heavy Crossbow while moving. But note that it takes two reload actions to actually reload. So you could use Running Reload again, meaning Heavy Crossbows are decent weapons when kiting. :)

(And seldom otherwise outside of their first shot.)

I'll note that's it's totally DM fiat if you can use Running Reload twice to reload a reload 2 weapon: "If an item takes 2 or more actions to reload, the GM determines whether they must be performed together as an activity, or you can spend some of those actions during one turn and the rest during your next turn." Since Running Reload requires movement then reload, the second move interrupts the reloading if "the GM determines they must be performed together as an activity". Now you can always Running Reload and then spend an interact action to finish reloading.


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Natural Medicine
You can apply natural cures to heal your allies. You can use Nature instead of Medicine to Treat Wounds. If you’re in the wilderness, you might have easier access to fresh ingredients, allowing you to gain a +2 circumstance bonus to your check to Treat Wounds using Nature, subject to the GM’s determination.

When this feat says you can "use Nature instead of Medicine to Treat Wounds" does that include substituting your proficiency in Nature for proficiency in Medicine to attempt higher DCs to heal larger amounts of hit points?:

Treat Wounds
...If you’re an expert in Medicine, you can instead attempt a DC 20 check to increase the Hit Points regained by 10; if you’re a master of Medicine, you can instead attempt a DC 30 check to increase the Hit Points regained by 30; and if you’re legendary, you can instead attempt a DC 40 check to increase the Hit Points regained by 50...

Cheers.

The Exchange

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rainzax wrote:

Natural Medicine

You can apply natural cures to heal your allies. You can use Nature instead of Medicine to Treat Wounds. If you’re in the wilderness, you might have easier access to fresh ingredients, allowing you to gain a +2 circumstance bonus to your check to Treat Wounds using Nature, subject to the GM’s determination.

When this feat says you can "use Nature instead of Medicine to Treat Wounds" does that include substituting your proficiency in Nature for proficiency in Medicine to attempt higher DCs to heal larger amounts of hit points?:

Treat Wounds
...If you’re an expert in Medicine, you can instead attempt a DC 20 check to increase the Hit Points regained by 10; if you’re a master of Medicine, you can instead attempt a DC 30 check to increase the Hit Points regained by 30; and if you’re legendary, you can instead attempt a DC 40 check to increase the Hit Points regained by 50...

Cheers.

The way I read that is that you can substitute "Nature" wherever it says "Medicine" in the entire paragraph. Thus, I believe that you can attempt the higher checks using nature


What is the current status of the "These aren't all the fixes we're working on" that were mentioned after the first release of errata? I'm hoping alchemist fixes are in there and that they get released sometime before the new classes get released.

Sczarni

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber
Laran wrote:
rainzax wrote:

Natural Medicine

You can apply natural cures to heal your allies. You can use Nature instead of Medicine to Treat Wounds. If you’re in the wilderness, you might have easier access to fresh ingredients, allowing you to gain a +2 circumstance bonus to your check to Treat Wounds using Nature, subject to the GM’s determination.

When this feat says you can "use Nature instead of Medicine to Treat Wounds" does that include substituting your proficiency in Nature for proficiency in Medicine to attempt higher DCs to heal larger amounts of hit points?:

Treat Wounds
...If you’re an expert in Medicine, you can instead attempt a DC 20 check to increase the Hit Points regained by 10; if you’re a master of Medicine, you can instead attempt a DC 30 check to increase the Hit Points regained by 30; and if you’re legendary, you can instead attempt a DC 40 check to increase the Hit Points regained by 50...

Cheers.

The way I read that is that you can substitute "Nature" wherever it says "Medicine" in the entire paragraph. Thus, I believe that you can attempt the higher checks using nature

Also wondering whether this can combine with Battle Medicine.

I imagine a lot of people saying "no", based on all of the other threads about Battle Medicine.


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Nefreet wrote:

Also wondering whether this can combine with Battle Medicine.

I imagine a lot of people saying "no", based on all of the other threads about Battle Medicine.

That's a big no: natural only works "to Treat Wounds" and battle medicine isn't that but a medicine check that uses the same DC. It's the same reason healer's tools do nothing for battle medicine as it only helps with specific medicine actions.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I posted this question to reddit, but I figure I should put it here as well, as there is some technical lack of clarity.

The question is about what happens when you combine Sneak, Follow-The-Leader, and FollowTheLeader's auditory trait, with side reference to "quiet allies".

Question here: https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder2e/comments/e1v9pl/sneaking_and_follow_t he_expert/


I have a question regarding things like called shots and coup de grace. Do you ever plan on making them return in a Game Mastery guide or some related material or such mechanics are officially "gone"?

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16

What is the range of the leshy's seedpod unarmed attack?

Can the leshy's seedpod be used for rogue sneak attacks?


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Cyrad wrote:
Can the leshy's seedpod be used for rogue sneak attacks?

"If you Strike a creature that has the flat-footed condition (page 620) with an agile or finesse melee weapon, an agile or finesse unarmed attack, or a ranged weapon attack, you deal an extra 1d6 precision damage."

It doesn't differentiate between a melee or ranged "agile or finesse unarmed attack" however the attack lacks "agile or finesse" so it's not compatible as the other option would be "ranged weapon attack" and the unarmed traits says "An unarmed attack isn’t a weapon"...

So it boils down to seedpods not being able to be used in sneak attacks.


Just wanted to know if the bandolieritem was meant to:

- be 1x character: giving players a choice in terms of "what to have ready to be used" ( 8 consumables or 1 among the existant kits ).

Or

- be 2/3/4x character: having no intent to be another choice in terms of balance.

...

The point is to also understand if, whereas a bandolier could have the same use of belt pouch for storing:

- scrolls
- potions
- alchemical stuff

Because if you can use belt pouches as bandoliers for consumables ( not only for storing, but to have items in easy reach ), then you will be using a bandolier ( or more if allowed ) as a tool holder.

And the whole thing wouldn't be meant to give players a choice.

Not saying it is a bad or good thing.

Just want to understand if Paizo though about the bandolier as something meant to offer alternatives in terms of game mechanics ( with both advantages and disadvantage regards what you decide to put into ).

No rp involved.

The Exchange

The Horse animal companion support ability adds to attack damage if it moves. The rules do not limit it to melee weapons. Is the benefit added to ranged weapons? I would have thought no (in line with Sudden Charge) but the rules do not specify. Also, the Deer Instinct mentions Charge as a trait but I cannot find the definition of that trait


The question that has been debated since the Playtest.

Can a Whip be used to Trip using Dex instead of Str?

The Exchange

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Do characters with the MCD into Druid have to adhere to the base druid anathemas (no metal armor, no teaching druidic etc) in addition to the specific ones or are they only required to adhere to the order specific anathemas (e.g. don't kill animals for fun)


I'm confused about Archetypes. On page 219 it states "Applying an archetype requires you to select archetype feats instead of class feats". Does this mean you can no longer take class feats at all after choosing an archetype? If so there do not appear to be enough archetype feats to replace all the class feats especially at higher level...which leads me to believe that the answer to my question is no and the rule is just poorly worded.

Sczarni

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber

The focus word in that sentence is "Applying".

If you wish to apply an archetype, you do so by selecting archetype feats instead of class feats.

If you do not wish to apply an archetype, all of your standard options are still available to you.


Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

In particular the dedication feat is an archetype feat, not a class feat.

The Exchange

Howard de Wied wrote:
I'm confused about Archetypes. On page 219 it states "Applying an archetype requires you to select archetype feats instead of class feats". Does this mean you can no longer take class feats at all after choosing an archetype? If so there do not appear to be enough archetype feats to replace all the class feats especially at higher level...which leads me to believe that the answer to my question is no and the rule is just poorly worded.

p219

"Once you have the dedication feat, you can select any feat from
that archetype in place of a class feat as long as you meet its
prerequisites." (my bolding)

Notice that it does not say you "must" only that you "can"

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Ifusaso wrote:

Source

Are you able to Sustain a Spell on the same spell multiple times per round, for spells like Flaming Spehere to cause their effects more than once?

Did this ever get answered from way back in August?


Nope, same with most of the questions.


Many spellcasting monsters do not have a component pouch or focus with which to cast their spells that require material components. It would strike me as very off-theme to say that a greater shadow would require a component pouch or religious symbol to cast its innate spell *darkness*, so I think it would be a good idea to add to future printings of the Bestiary (and/or possibly the CRB's Game Mastering chapter?) a general rule that most monsters, at the GM's discretion, can replace material components with somatic components. Perhaps the rules could note that most humanoids do not have this ability, and GMs should add pouches or foci to their inventories as appropriate if they are not already present in their statblocks, but that may be rather fiddly.

Slamy Mcbiteo wrote:
Ifusaso wrote:
Are you able to Sustain a Spell on the same spell multiple times per round, for spells like Flaming Spehere to cause their effects more than once?
Did this ever get answered from way back in August?
When asked this question about flaming sphere, Pathfinder designer Mark Seifter answered,
Quote:
Many spells should have a Sustain a Spell limited to once a round, though spells were way too long and had some last minute copyfitting. I wouldn't be surprised if some of them accidentally lost that reminder text with the thought that it was clear or maybe mistakenly believing once per round was the default.

It seems safe to infer that flaming sphere is one of the "many spells" he is referring to.

The Exchange

Animal Companion specifically Bear question

The bear appears to be unable to use the Intimidate skill it is trained in to demoralize an opponent.

The bear had a trained skill of Intimidate however demoralize is not one of the actions that animals can perform (they appear limited to basic actions list on page 249) nor is it an advanced maneuver.

It appears that by the rules, the bear cannot be commanded to use the Intimidate action to demoralize. If it can use the skills it is trained in, does that mean that it can also use the shove action (or the Disarm) since it is trained in Athletics

*EDIT* The rules appear to say that animals can use any action unless it needs a high intelligence such as with coerce. Thus, they appear to be able to Long Jump, Shove, Swim, TRIP, DISARM, tumble thru without needing the support benefit (renders Knockdown advanced maneuver slightly less valuable)


Question regarding the Aldori Parry and Aldori Riposte compared to the Fighters Dueling Parry and Dueling Riposte. The entries for both feats appear to be almost identical. Would that mean that a Fighter would be able to take Dueling Parry at level 2, the Aldori Duelist dedication at level 4, and then attain the Aldori Riposte at level 6, or would they be required to specifically have the Aldori Parry for Aldori Riposte? And from that, if a Fighter did specialize in the Aldori Parry and Aldori Riposte, would that satisfy the requirements of have Dueling Parry and Dueling Riposte in order to take Improved Dueling Riposte and Guiding Riposte?


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Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Can a spellcaster cast, from a scroll, a spell of a higher level than he is normally able to cast? I couldn't find anything prohibiting it in the CRB.

Grand Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, Pawns Subscriber

If you have both the finesse and either trip, grapple, or disarm traits on a weapon, does the Athletics check for these actions suddenly use dexterity and become a dexterity check instead of a strength one?


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zer0darkfire wrote:
If you have both the finesse and either trip, grapple, or disarm traits on a weapon, does the Athletics check for these actions suddenly use dexterity and become a dexterity check instead of a strength one?

Short answer: Yes

Long answer:
Here

And here

Grand Archive

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, Pawns Subscriber
theservantsllcleanitup wrote:
zer0darkfire wrote:
If you have both the finesse and either trip, grapple, or disarm traits on a weapon, does the Athletics check for these actions suddenly use dexterity and become a dexterity check instead of a strength one?

Short answer: Yes

Long answer:
Here

And here

I see a lot of no in those links and people have been asking for an FAQ on this since release so you pointing out random people saying yes doesn't mean anything.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

If I want to scribe a 5th level fireball scroll, which of these is correct?
A) I need a formula called "Level 5 Magic Scroll" (can be used for any 5th level spell)
B) I need a formula called "5th Level Fireball Scroll"
C) I need a formula called "Fireball Scroll" (used for level 3+)


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Under Avoid Notice it says, "If you’re Avoiding Notice at the start of an encounter, you usually roll a Stealth check instead of a Perception check both to determine your initiative and to see if the enemies notice you."

So you roll a Stealth Check and compare it to the Perception DCs of creatures you pass while Avoiding Notice. With regard to "and to see
if the enemies notice you", does this mean that when an encounter begins you do not roll an Initiative Check and instead use the Stealth Check you already rolled for your initiative? Or does it mean you roll Stealth again and use it both for initiative and to see if anyone detects you after the encounter begins?

I've seen a lot of comments from the player-base about this (on both sides of the fence), but would really love to hear from an official source how it is intended to work. Thanks.


FunkamusPrime wrote:

If I want to scribe a 5th level fireball scroll, which of these is correct?

A) I need a formula called "Level 5 Magic Scroll" (can be used for any 5th level spell)
B) I need a formula called "5th Level Fireball Scroll"
C) I need a formula called "Fireball Scroll" (used for level 3+)

None of the above. "When you begin the crafting process, choose a spell to put into the scroll. You have to either Cast that Spell during the crafting process, or someone else must do so in your presence. Casting that Spell doesn’t produce its normal effects; instead, the magic is trapped inside the scroll. The casting must come from a spellcaster expending a spell slot."

So there is no formula per se, it's cast a spell and that spell is what determines the scroll level. So it's requirements are just the Magical Crafting and a spellcaster casting a spell: done. The crafting is trapping the spell' in the scroll, so the particular spell doesn't matter.


FunkamusPrime wrote:

If I want to scribe a 5th level fireball scroll, which of these is correct?

A) I need a formula called "Level 5 Magic Scroll" (can be used for any 5th level spell)
B) I need a formula called "5th Level Fireball Scroll"
C) I need a formula called "Fireball Scroll" (used for level 3+)

I would say that each level of scroll has its own formula and the spell depends on what the crafter has cast into it. So A) for me.

"If an item has multiple types of different levels, each type has its own formula, and you need the formula for the specific type of item you want to Craft. For example, if you have a formula for a type I bag of holding but not for a type II bag of holding, you must acquire a separate formula to Craft a type II bag of holding."


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Paizo Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

The "formula" for a scroll is the spell. So a caster who knows the spell has the formula for the scroll.

That's how I see it, anyway.

Liberty's Edge

Yeah, I know there is some somewhat reasonable objections and points raised but the RAW here is very clear, every different level of Scroll needs its own Formula since they each have different prices and Item Levels.

So in this situation Option A is the correct answer I believe, but it may also be Option B.

One could even argue for Option B in that each specific combination of Scroll Level + Spell actually needs its own Formula as well but I feel like that is unintended overkill and likely not an intended consequence of the need to buy/learn independent Formulas for each item that isn't printed in the Equipment Chapter and also Tagged as Common.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I appreciate everyone chiming in, and think this is a fine example of why we need an official answer. 4 people have 3 different answers to the same question, and all of them seem completely reasonable in their own rights.

That said, I did notice that in Hero Lab (which is quasi-official?), you can purchase Scroll Forumulas, but they're strictly named by level. "Scroll Formula (1st)", "Scroll Formula (2nd)", etc. In its system you do not specify the spell's name... only what level it is. Which gives some tiny credibility to answer A.

Sczarni

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Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber

Never trust HeroLab.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

*nods*

It's an assistant, not a valid rules source.


Rysky wrote:

*nods*

It's an assistant, not a valid rules source.

Especially since PF2e and herolab online, herolab classic has gone through many iterative changes to bring it closer into line with the rules and PFS. But Herolab online is just too young and with too many other other issues.


Is the Swift Block Caobochon (p. 569) really supposed to be activated as a free action with a defined trigger, or is that an error and should it instead be activated as a reaction?

Thanks in advance!

Also I second the questions about casting from higher level scrolls and whether scrolls need different formulae at different levels.

Grand Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, Pawns Subscriber
The Penecontemporaneous One wrote:

Is the Swift Block Caobochon (p. 569) really supposed to be activated as a free action with a defined trigger, or is that an error and should it instead be activated as a reaction?

Thanks in advance!

Also I second the questions about casting from higher level scrolls and whether scrolls need different formulae at different levels.

This seems fine to me, the rulebook says you can have free actions with triggers. Also, if it was a reaction, you couldn't actually use the item, it would take your reaction, then tell you to take a reaction you couldn't take anymore since you've used your one* reaction for the turn.


What happens when I cast enlarge, or use the giant instinct power to enlarge myself when I’m in a tight space, or even when I’m surrounded by allies or enemies?


I have not been able to look through and see if this has been addresses, but my PC's want to drag monsters around (and if they are small enough, throw them) I'm doing my best improvising here, but not really sure what this should look like. I can't see very much for advanced grappling options so I'm leaning on athletics/acrobatics a lot for these shenanigans!

Thanks for a really fun game!

Grand Archive

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, Pawns Subscriber
RaptorBonz wrote:

I have not been able to look through and see if this has been addresses, but my PC's want to drag monsters around (and if they are small enough, throw them) I'm doing my best improvising here, but not really sure what this should look like. I can't see very much for advanced grappling options so I'm leaning on athletics/acrobatics a lot for these shenanigans!

Thanks for a really fun game!

There is no rules for dragging a creature and moving ends a grapple, but throwing people is easy (for monks) using this feat. Pay attention to the fact that it doesn't have the attack trait so no MAP.

Grand Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Maps, Pawns Subscriber

Two part question:
1) Does weapon specialization apply to Spiritual Weapon?
2) If yes, do you use your weapon proficiency or your spell proficiency?

The Exchange

If a PC is a 5th level Occult spellcaster and picks up only the initial cleric MCD, can they cast the Heal spell from a Healing staff?

The rules say they need to 1) have the spell on their list (check) and 2) be able to cast spells of the appropriate level (check he can cast 3rd level spells). The rules do NOT say he needs to be able to cast spells of the appropriate level from that list (very easy to have put those 3 words into the original ruleset if that was the intent).

Also, would an Impossible Polymath bard who has Divine spell Heal in their book only be able to use the Healing staff when they have added that spell to their repertoire for the day?

This has been discussed elsewhere so I am putting this here to see if it can be put in the "hopefully to be answered" queue and not just weighing opinions about how it should work.


The barbarian feat "No Escape" reads:

Quote:
Stride up to your Speed, following the foe and keeping it in reach throughout its movement until it stops moving or you’ve moved your full Speed.

With the trigger:

Quote:
A foe within reach attempts to move away from you.

Say an enemy is trying to flee from the barbarian and uses two actions to move, but the barbarian has a higher land speed. Would the barbarian with No Escape:

A) Only be able to pursue for enemy's the first (move) action, because this feat gives the barbarian the ability to "stride" once, or B) be able to pursue for multiple (move) actions by the enemy even beyond a single action (on the enemy's part) so long as the barbarian does not exceed the maximum limitations in the feat?

Thanks in advance!


For example, Thurible of Revelation has the traits: Divination and Divine. So, I must use Religion to attempt to Identify Magic. But Everburning Torch has the traits:Evocation, Light and Magical. Which skill can I use in this case?


Quote:

RECKLESS ABANDON

BARBARIAN CLASS FEAT
16
Free Action
BARBARIAN,RAGE
Trigger Your turn begins, and you are at half or fewer Hit Points.

Your blood boils when you take a beating, and you throw caution to the wind to finish the fight. You gain a +2 circumstance bonus to attack rolls, a –2 penalty to AC, and a –1 penalty to saves. These bonuses and penalties last until your Rage ends or until you are above half Hit Points, whichever comes first.

If I gain enough temporary HP to put me over half, does Reckless Abandon end?


Aratorin wrote:
Quote:

RECKLESS ABANDON

BARBARIAN CLASS FEAT
16
Free Action
BARBARIAN,RAGE
Trigger Your turn begins, and you are at half or fewer Hit Points.

Your blood boils when you take a beating, and you throw caution to the wind to finish the fight. You gain a +2 circumstance bonus to attack rolls, a –2 penalty to AC, and a –1 penalty to saves. These bonuses and penalties last until your Rage ends or until you are above half Hit Points, whichever comes first.

If I gain enough temporary HP to put me over half, does Reckless Abandon end?

Temporary Hit Points: Core Rulebook pg. 461

"Some spells or abilities give you temporary Hit Points. Track these separately from your current and maximum Hit Points."

As such NO amount of temp hp has any affect on your number of hp.

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