Rituals and worldbuilding: brooms are the new zombies?

[Colette Brunel]

There is a weird little piece of world-building present in the animate object and create undead rituals. The ritual subsystem is mostly GM-facing, so rituals are handed out almost purely at the GM's discretion. They are also supposed to be world-building tools that explain precisely how NPCs accomplish tasks of mind control, undead-raising, magical imprisonment, and so on and so forth. But how well do they hold up as the latter?

The create undead ritual says, "There are many versions of this ritual, each specific to a particular type of undead (one ritual for all zombies, one for skeletons, one for ghouls, and so on), and the rituals that create rare undead are also rare." So a 2nd-level create undead ritual could be keyed to create all types of zombies.

But why bother with raising the dead? It has the evil trait, and people get histrionic over it. Instead, why not turn to animate object for the exact same price per creature, and create some animated objects instead? Animated brooms are the same level as plain old zombies, and they are significantly less evil-trait-saddled and socially acceptable. Are animated brooms the new zombies, as far as lowest-level mooks are concerned? Animated armor and animated statues can be useful, too, for more humanoid servitors with opposable thumbs.

[Bandw2]

I mean, on a fundamental level, I feel like this makes sense.

of course, undead attack troops aren't as non-threatening as brooms.

[Darigaaz the Igniter]

Mainly because of this one sorcerer's apprentice mucking things up

[Paradozen]

The evil trait only matters if you care. Socially acceptable also only matters if you care. You raise zombies instead of brooms because you don't.

[Deadmanwalking]

While I agree with the above, there are also some practical reasons to have lots of undead running around rather than lots of animated objects.

Firstly, if you want intelligent servitors, you pretty much need undead. Secondly, in terms of mindless undead, the reasons to use them over animated objects are pretty simple in PF2, and based on a few simple principles:

1. Most creatures you create are not going to be Minions (you can't maintain more than a few minions at once).

2. You are usually not going to critically succeed at creating them.

So this results in the majority of creatures you create falling into a couple of patterns of behavior. Animated objects sit there and do nothing unless people actively touch or mess with them. Undead wander about murdering whoever they see (except for you).

So, do you want dungeon defenders that sit there and ignore everything unless they're actively attacked or touched themselves, or ones that try to murder all intruders? Usually, the latter is preferable.

And then there's repurposing. Bind Undead allows you to temporarily seize command of mindless undead and move them to a new location or otherwise cause them to behave a certain way. There's no similar way to change commands on an animated object. Non-minion objects just do what they do until something destroys them.

[Paradozen]

Also there are some financial side benefits to producing undead over animated objects if done en masse.

First, it is cheaper to get the options with opposable thumbs. Because you aren't going to reliably get minions all the time, going with the lowest level option for thumbs means getting the best chance of landing one with thumbs. Thumbs are valuable in a minion. How else are they supposed to steer the carriage? With their bristles?

Second, near as I can tell it is easier to heal undead than constructs, so if you plan on using them for combat purposes it is probably more economical to invest in healing for undead than replacements for every one. You can check up on the zombie troll guarding your lair every day to patch up any adventure-stains left on it, all you can do with the animated object is consider whether or not you need to make a new one. In the long run I'm sure the heal-friendly guard is better.

[Pompous Aristocrat]

Necromancy isn't just about utility. It's about sending a message. Sure I could just animate a plow and let it take care of my fields, but why do that when I could be using the corpses of my enemies? I swear, so many of you wizard-types lack any sense of theatre.

[Helmic]

Also, zombie shamblers are just a lot more lethal than animated brooms. They've got way more HP, they move significatly faster, I can't see their damage but they've got a lot more strength so presumably they hit harder, they have an additional ability that's very combat relevant. They're not what you'd use if all you wanted was to automate your chores.

Animated objects tend to be limited by what that object is. An animated broom isn't doing much other than sweeping and whatever its little handle and bristles can manipulate, so maybe it can do stuff like open doors or maybe bust open a window or barricade a gate. An animated pick might be more of a weapon, but it's still going to largely only be useful for mining.

[Appletree]

While some advantages of the undead have been mentioned, I do actually kind of like the idea of a makeshift army of pots and pans, brooms and chairs, knives, swords, shields and buckets. So I think I might nab it, thanks.

[JRutterbush]

Appletree wrote:

While some advantages of the undead have been mentioned, I do actually kind of like the idea of a makeshift army of pots and pans, brooms and chairs, knives, swords, shields and buckets. So I think I might nab it, thanks.

I'm definitely gonna run at least one adventure involving a kindly old grandma who conquered a city with an army of animated cutlery.

[Temperans]

But corpse smell so foul and object are mere tools. Now clockworks are special, all the usefulness of an object and non of the rotten smell of corpses. Think of the efficiency gained from not covering your nose and being able to grab things.

I can't wait hard enough for them to be released. Always liked those like marvelous mechanical wonders.

[Frogliacci]

I actually feel like animated objects are woefully underused as a low level mook monster for PCs to slaughter through en masse. Zombies and skeletons are clichéd, bandits, goblins and orcs pose that ethical quandary of massacring sentients, and animals just aren't fantastical enough to be fun.

Animated objects are infinitely diverse and perfect for XP fodder mooks in a dungeon. The dungeon featured themselves trying to kill you is just one of those classic old school things that doesn't get old and adds tons of whimsical flavor to a game.

[QuidEst]

There may be religious or cultural reasons- Urgathoans and in Geb. There may be access or training reasons- being able to get necromantic rituals through a cult or having training. There may be other motivations- practicing for a bigger project like becoming a lich. There may be functional concerns- undead are easier to repair than constructs, and have more weaknesses if something goes wrong and they need to be stopped/controlled. There be matters of ease- I’ve seen a lot more shortcuts for making undead than making constructs.

Nex and Geb represent the two schools of thought on this.