So while researching through Planar Adventures and such I wondered what would happen to a person's soul if they had died, were standing inline waiting to be judged and then found a way to be teleported or travel back to the material plane without reuniting with their original body?
Determined travelers who overcome the Boneyard’s systems for preventing accidental egress can also traverse the length of the Spire itself, a massive rock face riddled with yawning archways that lead into spiraling tunnels and staircases.
So what exactly besides maybe the Psychopomps are the systems for preventing accidental egress? And is this a work around to having someone returned back to "life" without the traditional raise dead or resurrection? And what happens to the persons original body if this was to work?
In addition to the official sourcebooks, I'll also use the Pathfinder Comic Spiral of Bones, that tells a story revolving around these matters.
The souls in the River of Souls are described as confused and unable to really tell what is happening to them, so I guess they wouldn't use their own abilities to escape, though they can be stolen from the River, for example by some daemons and night hags.
Although their form is ethereal, once they reach Boneyard, they seem to be able to perceive and interact with things. They perceive themselves as they were in life, but it may be just an illusion; the comic suggests that the beings of Outer Planes that deal with the souls in Bonayard may perceive them differently. Either way, they are already in Pharasma's realm, she sets the rules, and she would certainly be able to limit their ability to escape via planar travel. For example, in this not-truly-corporeal form, they may be something akin to the summoned creatures and like them they cannot use any teleportation and plane travel abilities. Their only way out would be by another's power or using one of the permanent gates used by psychopomps to travel to the mortal world.
Spiral of Bones tells a story in which the latter happens, which makes the souls to immediately returns to its own body; it may be important however that the body was still intact and alive. If the body is already dead, the reunification may not be possible. I believe that because of the pull of the Negative Energy Plane, that is said to be the primary reason why souls travel through the planes, all such disembodied souls would eventualy turn into undead. That's exactly how it is said that spontaneous creation of undead happens.
I'm pretty sure there's a line in Planar Adventurers that souls who have not yet been judged aren't petitioners yet, and don't have a body that spells or physical things can interact with. Only special abilities on soul hunting monsters or probably psychopomps can do anything to them.
I'm pretty sure there's a line in Planar Adventurers that souls who have not yet been judged aren't petitioners yet, and don't have a body that spells or physical things can interact with. Only special abilities on soul hunting monsters or probably psychopomps can do anything to them.
I believe you are correct. However I was wondering what would happen if someone died, was shuffling forward in line with all the other souls as they made their way through the Boneyard and say a Gate opened up beside them (say a wizard was travelling there using a gate spell) and then one or more of those souls wandered through the gate back to the material plane before it closed.
Would they appear as spirits? Ghosts possibly (although from my reading that doesn't seem to fit) or is there another template or creature this would fall under?
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I'm pretty sure there's a line in Planar Adventurers that souls who have not yet been judged aren't petitioners yet, and don't have a body that spells or physical things can interact with. Only special abilities on soul hunting monsters or probably psychopomps can do anything to them.I believe you are correct. However I was wondering what would happen if someone died, was shuffling forward in line with all the other souls as they made their way through the Boneyard and say a Gate opened up beside them (say a wizard was travelling there using a gate spell) and then one or more of those souls wandered through the gate back to the material plane before it closed.
Would they appear as spirits? Ghosts possibly (although from my reading that doesn't seem to fit) or is there another template or creature this would fall under?
All sorts of strange things (and thus, interesting potential story or adventure plots) can happen when things start tinkering/meddling with the River of Souls. In a case like this, where someone opens a portal that diverts souls elsewhere... having them all turn into ghosts or wraiths or some brand new type of undead might happen. Or the souls might turn into haunts. Or they might just vanish in blasts of positive energy. Or they might be forced to reincarnate, either into newborn babies or into fully grown bodies, with their memories of their past lives fully intact.
That's just a few potential ideas. We specifically don't nail all these possibilities down in print BECAUSE we want to give you and us room to come up with new story ideas like these.
All sorts of strange things (and thus, interesting potential story or adventure plots) can happen when things start tinkering/meddling with the River of Souls. In a case like this, where someone opens a portal that diverts souls elsewhere... having them all turn into ghosts or wraiths or some brand new type of undead might happen. Or the souls might turn into haunts. Or they might just vanish in blasts of positive energy. Or they might be forced to reincarnate, either into newborn babies or into fully grown bodies, with their memories of their past lives fully intact.
That's just a few potential ideas. We specifically don't nail all these possibilities down in print BECAUSE we want to give you and us room to come up with new story ideas like these.
Thanks James! That is exactly what I wanted to hear, I just didn't want to break any established continuity. Looks like my next campaign is starting in the Boneyard after my PC's have already died... with a second lease on life so to speak.
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Thanks James! That is exactly what I wanted to hear, I just didn't want to break any established continuity. Looks like my next campaign is starting in the Boneyard after my PC's have already died... with a second lease on life so to speak.All sorts of strange things (and thus, interesting potential story or adventure plots) can happen when things start tinkering/meddling with the River of Souls. In a case like this, where someone opens a portal that diverts souls elsewhere... having them all turn into ghosts or wraiths or some brand new type of undead might happen. Or the souls might turn into haunts. Or they might just vanish in blasts of positive energy. Or they might be forced to reincarnate, either into newborn babies or into fully grown bodies, with their memories of their past lives fully intact.
That's just a few potential ideas. We specifically don't nail all these possibilities down in print BECAUSE we want to give you and us room to come up with new story ideas like these.
You might consider picking up the first volume of Tyrant's Grasp, then, for more inspiration or info, since this adventure kinda uses the exact same hook.
You might consider picking up the first volume of Tyrant's Grasp, then, for more inspiration or info, since this adventure kinda uses the exact same hook.
I also considered myself ninja'd on the idea and suggestion taken!!