Ultra Instinct: Being a Saiyan in Second Edition


Homebrew and House Rules


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Introduction
That's right: now you too can collect all seven Draconic Spheres to call forth the powerful Wish-granting Apsu! In this post I'll briefly cover the basics on preparing yourself for this adventure. Perhaps once I actually have the full Second Edition rules in front of me (can't wait!), I'll be able to expand this into a full character build, but for now you'll have to make do with the essentials. Let's get started!

Ancestry
To begin with, I would like to remind you all that Elves are canonically beings from another planet (Castrovel) who arrived on Golarion using arcane technology far beyond the capabilities of the primitive human race. Thus, our only option to avoid becoming a comic relief character is to select the Elf ancestry. For heritage and ancestry feat, I have no particular suggestions as this point, though additional speed is always welcome. For ability scores, we're going to increase our Strength with the free bonus to obtain 12/12/8/12/10/10.

Background
Since we're looking to specifically increase both our Strength and Wisdom through our background, we are somewhat constrained in our choice. Fortunately martial disciple with its "[dedication] to intense training" will do just fine, and selecting Athletics allows us to hop around the battlefield before we unlock our means of flying. At this point, our ability scores are 14/12/8/12/12/10.

Class
For our class, we select Barbarian for obvious reasons: the Animal Instinct will enable us to unleash our inner ape by entering our Rage, which incidentally makes our fists hit like greatclubs. Ouch! Finally, Sudden Charge seems like a good first-level class feat to push our mobility even further. With this, our ability scores have become 16/12/8/12/12/10.

Finalizing Ability Scores
With our final four ability score boosts, we improve our Strength, Dexterity, Constitution and Wisdom. This makes us an Elf martial disciple Barbarian with Strength 18, Dexterity 14, Constitution 10, Intelligence 12, Wisdom 14, Charisma 10.

Progression
And this is to go beyond first level: with our carefully selected ability scores, we are perfectly equipped to multiclass into Druid and Monk.

  • -At level 2 we can take Druid Dedication (requires Wisdom 14), giving us cantrips which enable us to shoot beams of pure energy at our enemies.
  • -By taking Basic Druid Spellcasting and Order Spell at level 4 and 6, we set ourselves up for progressing our magical powers even further, with the desired end goal of unlocking the Fly spell.
  • -Most importantly, we have now opened up the possibility of taking Monk Dedication [requires Strength 14, Dexterity 14] at level 8, so that we can select Monk's Flurry at level 10 to punch our enemies even faster.
  • -At level 12, we can finally take Expert Druid Spellcasting, providing us with a fourth-level spell slot with which to cast Fly. At this point our core build is essentially complete and we are free to choose whatever feats we like.

This concludes my rough guide for bringing the action of everyone's favourite animated series into the second edition of everyone's favourite roleplaying game system. In all seriousness, I'm pretty excited for the Second Edition release, and I hope this post has inspired some of you to let your imagination run free and explore the possibilities which the new system has to offer. Happy gaming everyone!


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

You missed the free boost from your Background, your Wisdom should be 2 points higher.

...Also I am now trying to imagine what a Super Sovyrian looks like. That you for that. :P


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Considering Dragonball I would start with monk since the whole series is about martial arts and not about partial totem induced transformations

and considering son goku (and basically all sayans in his family) I would say take sorcerer dedication, they are not exactly wise but this also gets you blasting capabilities and charisma is (imo) waaayy more fitting then wisdom (also you have a better choice for other spells and don't >have< to stick to primal)

One could still go barbarian later on to increase combat prowess and get a nice little hp shield

And if you don't want to die as often as son goku & co I would build up con a bit more


MaxAstro wrote:
You missed the free boost from your Background, your Wisdom should be 2 points higher.

Are you sure? Starting Wisdom is 10, so with the free Background increase it goes to 12 (with Strength being the choose-from-two increase), and finally to 14 after being selected as one of the four ability score boosts.

MaxAstro wrote:
...Also I am now trying to imagine what a Super Sovyrian looks like. That you for that. :P

You're right, I should have included more Pathfinder-related puns. Oh El!


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Simmering wrote:
MaxAstro wrote:
You missed the free boost from your Background, your Wisdom should be 2 points higher.
Are you sure? Starting Wisdom is 10, so with the free Background increase it goes to 12 (with Strength being the choose-from-two increase), and finally to 14 after being selected as one of the four ability score boosts.

You are absolutely right - 12/10/10 and 12/12/10 just... blended together for me and I didn't notice the difference.


Are there any giant monkey monsters in the Bestiary you could wild shape into via your Druid dedication?


Ventnor wrote:
Are there any giant monkey monsters in the Bestiary you could wild shape into via your Druid dedication?

I couldn't find any in the Playtest Bestiary, though there may well be something like that in the final version. The level 8 Barbarian class feat Animal Rage does allow you to change into a Medium sized one, and I'm assuming the Enlarge spell would properly interact with this to make you Large, but of course that doesn't quite cut it yet. We'll see when the full rules drop!


I would argue that if you wanted to just be a Saiyan, barbarian fits better especially the great ape barbarian.

While Saiyans are strong fighters, and martial arts are a big component of DB. The raw strength, super saiyan forms, and literally transforming into a monkey is all part of the *saiyan* package. The build makes room for monk feats, but this services perfectly for a Saiyan, with the martial training coming later seems fine. Although I would admit Charisma does make a lot of sense. And a 10 con seems a bit squishy

Great work O.P


pixierose wrote:

I would argue that if you wanted to just be a Saiyan, barbarian fits better especially the great ape barbarian.

While Saiyans are strong fighters, and martial arts are a big component of DB. The raw strength, super saiyan forms, and literally transforming into a monkey is all part of the *saiyan* package. The build makes room for monk feats, but this services perfectly for a Saiyan, with the martial training coming later seems fine. Although I would admit Charisma does make a lot of sense. And a 10 con seems a bit squishy

Great work O.P

Thanks for the comment. I agree with you and Seisho that having your spells work off of Charisma rather than Wisdom would be more appropriate thematically, so maybe you could do the same via a Sorcerer bloodline which uses the Primal spell list. On the other hand, Wisdom offers more relevant (combat) bonuses than Charisma does. Since your Constitution is already quite low (which is mostly a consequence of choosing the Elf ancestry because it best fits the "race from outer space" mold), having a low Wisdom as well could reduce your survivability even further. Although keep in mind that HD are now maxed, which means a Barbarian will have the same hit points as a Fighter with a Constitution modifier of 2 higher.

So yeah, maybe if you want to go the "Gohan" instead of "Goku" route, you could play a Half-Elf with the same background and class build, but with 18/12/14/10/10/14 as starting ability scores (you don't need to start out with 14 Dexterity to multiclass into Monk since you can increase it from 12 to 14 at level 5 anyways). How's that sound to both of you?

(P.S. I posted this thread just before they introduced subforums, so they moved it into Homebrew, but I'm going to try and request moving it to Advice instead since this operates fully within the existing rules.)


I didn't think of the monkey form when writing my post tbh (or rather, I remembered it about an hour after posting) in that context this makes a lot of sense

I would guess both are valid way depending on whether you want the martial artist or the primal fighter (either way, the other is a good multiclass option for later on)

And the argument about the casting attribute seems to fit well too (if it would be called instinct instead of wisdom it would be on point)
The only sure thing is probably that a sayan won't use int for his 'magic'

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