Open and Flourish traits


Rules Discussion

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

Can anyone explain why the Barbarian feat Sudden Charge has BOTH Open and Flourish as traits?

I can't figure out what Flourish adds that isn't already covered by Open. Is this just general future-proofing or is there something I am missing?


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It adds precisely this: you can't follow Sudden Charge with another action that also has the Flourish trait.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Open means that it has to be your first action with Attack or Open traits.

Only one action with the Flourish trait can be taken per turn.

If the action only had the open trait, it could be followed up by an action that has the Flourish trait.


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Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

To add to what other people have said:

A lot of flourish feats for various classes essentially grant an extra action's worth of something out of a turn. An extra attack, or in this case, an extra move. Tagging them with the flourish traits is a way to keep people from collecting them and getting effectively 6 actions in a turn.

As to why sudden charge had to be Open...it just seems like a thematic choice. It's kind of a bummer, because it doesn't let you take a guy down with one action and then sudden charge to the next guy.


Yeah, it makes sense for it to have flourish, but open is really disappointing.

I thought we saw the feat for the fighter and it just had open?


citricking wrote:

Yeah, it makes sense for it to have flourish, but open is really disappointing.

I thought we saw the feat for the fighter and it just had open?

Good question for anyone who has the book: does the Fighter version of this Feat also have the Flourish trait?


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Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Bardic Dave wrote:
citricking wrote:

Yeah, it makes sense for it to have flourish, but open is really disappointing.

I thought we saw the feat for the fighter and it just had open?

Good question for anyone who has the book: does the Fighter version of this Feat also have the Flourish trait?

It has both Flourish and Open.


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RicoTheBold wrote:
As to why sudden charge had to be Open...it just seems like a thematic choice. It's kind of a bummer, because it doesn't let you take a guy down with one action and then sudden charge to the next guy.

I think that's intentional though. Being able to fell someone with an attack and then move 50ft and attack another foe makes expected outcomes in combat hard to track. Especially considering that you don't have to fell to the foe, you could just attack, sudden charge and rinse repeat every round. That's movement that a lot of classes without Sudden Charge can't even cover (Monsters might be able to, but still).

It also is thematically appropriate with the 3.5/Pathfinder Charge action, which was only allowed as a Full Round (so no additional attacks unless you had Pouce). Making it an Open has a lot of thematic and mechanical backing to support it.

RPG Superstar 2014 Top 32

Thanks for the replies! I hadn't considered doing different actions that also had Flourish. Lots to learn in this new edition.

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