2 - Cult of Cinders (GM Reference)


Age of Ashes

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another question - what colour dragon head do the chimeras have? red to follow the theme of dahak or something else to change it up?


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I went with red since most of my players have gone in heavily on fire resistance and I want to reward that sensibility. Seems sort of rude to pull the rug out from under them, but I could be convinced to do otherwise.


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Dahak's Shell Question **Spoilers (maybe)**

page 54, the description wrote:
As dragon pillars are destroyed, ...

Does this refer to the replica dragon pillars, or the previously (hopefully) destroyed, full size dragon pillars? Should destroying full size pillars affect the efficacy of this hazard?

On the next page (p.55), it seems to refer, under the Disable section, to the replica pillars, but, again, it doesn't say so explicitly.
Thirdly, the XP Award section must be referring to the replica pillars, right?

At this point I am assuming a fully armed and operational battle station, er, I mean Dahak's Shell, no matter how many full size pillars have already been destroyed.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Umm the pillars they are searching for. The "full size" ones I assume you mean the ones at the shell, and they wouldn't need to send people out to see what's going on since it's in their yard.

Pg 28 says as they find and destroy the pillars the shell weakens.


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Kennethray wrote:

Umm the pillars they are searching for. The "full size" ones I assume you mean the ones at the shell, and they wouldn't need to send people out to see what's going on since it's in their yard.

Pg 28 says as they find and destroy the pillars the shell weakens.

Thank you, Keerthray. I had glossed over that passage.

No. By the full size ones, I mean the ones at A5, A7, A8, etc.

What do you mean by "and they wouldn't need to send people out to see what's going on since it's in their yard?"

So, as the ones at A5, A7, etc. are damaged, the color should drain out of Dahak's Shell, then. Should the corresponding replicas become inactive, as well?


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

There are two sets of pillars, the ones around the enemy base that form the shell then there are the ones out in different hexs that expand the influence while also powering up the wall. They are all the same size as far as I know, so your use of the word replica was confusing, I thought you were calling the ones out in the hexa the replica since they were not the initial ones. Thefore if the party managed to figure out how to break the pillars that where within the shell that would be a few feet from the base and in obvious sight of the guards, and a small reptile. If you read that same page it says when a certain number of pillars are destroyed a scouting party is sent out to see what is going on. Its every few pillars.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

So we just finished book two and the last fight was a little underwhelming. One pc was trying to free the dragon, 2 pcs where trying to pick up blue half dragon and throw her into the gold. The sorcerer was trying to buff. Round 3 went, blue half dragon cast fear and makes the two around her frightened with the champion running for a round, then she began to try to get away, the sorcerer cast phantismal killer, nat 1 followed by a nat 1. Dead leader of the cult of the cinder claws with full health. The group loved it so it works out, especially since they took a beating by the statue, I'm just glad the halfdragon wasn't built up too much as a tough lady to beat.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Kennethray wrote:
So we just finished book two and the last fight was a little underwhelming. One pc was trying to free the dragon, 2 pcs where trying to pick up blue half dragon and throw her into the gold. The sorcerer was trying to buff. Round 3 went, blue half dragon cast fear and makes the two around her frightened with the champion running for a round, then she began to try to get away, the sorcerer cast phantismal killer, nat 1 followed by a nat 1. Dead leader of the cult of the cinder claws with full health. The group loved it so it works out, especially since they took a beating by the statue, I'm just glad the halfdragon wasn't built up too much as a tough lady to beat.

Such are the dice.


Did the first chapter of this adventure with my party last Saturday, they love it, ace it, and are pumped to go exploring the Jungle! Tks Paizzo for one great night of fun roleplaying!


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I finished this book over the past weekend and had a real blast. The final showdown against Belmazog was a knockdown, drag-out fight with my players barely scrapping through.

My players burst through the doors (after realizing that the chimera couldn't follow them through, they elected to bull their way past them) and just started in swinging. Belmazog barely had time to register her shock as the barbarian rolled a crit and drew a triple damage from our Critical Hits deck, taking out a dragon priest in a single swing. Once Dahak's skull began shooting beams of fire, however, the panic set in. The sorcerer devoted two turns to successfully dispelling the hazard ("Best Signature Spell, hands down," in his words), while the alchemist critically failed a Will save versus fear and was sent screaming into a corner. As the fight progressed, the barbarian focused his rage at the chains holding Kyrion while the cleric went toe to toe with Belmazog with spells. This left the sorcerer with the other dragon priest.

Unfortunately, after catching two fireballs and a burning hands (at least two of which were critical fails), the barbarian fell to dying, but not before freeing Kyrion. While the sorcerer was laying prone with the dragon priest above him (albeit enfeebled 3 thanks to a crit fail), the barbarian bled out, and the cleric faced certain doom at Belmazog's hand... Kyrion unleashed his breath attack. It was enough to finish off the few remaining hit points of the surviving cultists AND send every player to dying.

Except the alchemist who was still cowering in the corner. Thankfully, he was quick to get potions into gullets before explaining why they were there.

My group had a great time finishing this book. The victory was capped off when the Leopard Tribe told Nketiah that it was time for her to spread her wings and join a new tribe: working with the PCs as their translator and nature specialist.


The Bida can grab people. But how do you guys calculate the DC to escape from it's grab when there is no Atheltics in the stat block to use? Assume it's Expert or Master in Athletics? Use the same DC as it's Constrict? :)


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Jorsalheim wrote:
The Bida can grab people. But how do you guys calculate the DC to escape from it's grab when there is no Atheltics in the stat block to use? Assume it's Expert or Master in Athletics? Use the same DC as it's Constrict? :)

From the Bestiary, page 5: "Skills The creature is trained or better in these skills. For untrained skills, use the corresponding ability modifer."

Athletics isn't listed in the bida's stat block, and its strength is +6. This means the bida's athletics DC is 16.


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Fumarole wrote:
Jorsalheim wrote:
The Bida can grab people. But how do you guys calculate the DC to escape from it's grab when there is no Atheltics in the stat block to use? Assume it's Expert or Master in Athletics? Use the same DC as it's Constrict? :)

From the Bestiary, page 5: "Skills The creature is trained or better in these skills. For untrained skills, use the corresponding ability modifer."

Athletics isn't listed in the bida's stat block, and its strength is +6. This means the bida's athletics DC is 16.

Thanks, sometimes the answers are there, right in the book. Just not the ones I was looking in :-)


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itaitai wrote:

My players are about to reach the Dahak hazard in the waystation tunnel and i would appreciate some advice regarding the knowledge checks.

When my players will encounter it, their first thought won't be that this is a hazard, they will think this is a type of monster needed to be defeated the old fashioned way.

I'm worried they will get obliterated by the insane AOE damage by not realizing it basically has a skill check off switch.

After the first religion knowledge check they know its a depiction of Dahak, but they still don't know it is a hazard.
Beside straight up telling them what they need to do, i don't see how they can handle this by themselves.

How do you let your players know what they are dealing with without just straight out telling them, and how do they find out how to turn it off?
I would have let them scratch their heads for a bit and do some knowledge checks in any other case, but after they will see me pick up 6d6, i don't think they will stick around for long to study it.

I'm about to start running book 1 but already a bit worried about this part too. I'd love to hear more examples of how people run this. Do I tell them it's a Hazard and not combat outright?

I'm thinking I'll give them a recall knowledge: religion check automatically, and on success let them know about the praying. It would feel weird to do the same with thievery though, but I doubt any of my players would think of trying to redirect the energies out of the blue.

So yes! Any stories of how this played out for other groups would be great.


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I had one player "scout" through the way station while the rest stayed in the keep. I had the rest of the players leave the room. When he got to the end of the tunnel Dahka formed and started to ise the breath weapon. The pc jumped through the gate into the mawangi expanse.

When the rest of the party went through some time later they were spread out when it formed. I told the table straight up that this was an hazard, similar to what quicksand or a haunting would be. This was because it was one of the first times they had one like this in game. After 2 or 3 more where I give this warning when we roll initiatives I will stop saying that. It should start to become obvious with the fact that hazards act before initiatives are rolled.

The sorcerer was able to dispel it on the first round so there was only the first breath weapon and not knowledge checks made.


Kennethray wrote:


When the rest of the party went through some time later they were spread out when it formed. I told the table straight up that this was an hazard, similar to what quicksand or a haunting would be. This was because it was one of the first times they had one like this in game. After 2 or 3 more where I give this warning when we roll initiatives I will stop saying that. It should start to become obvious with the fact that hazards act before initiatives are rolled.

That is not quite right, in this case for instance it would do his Manifest:

Manifest [reaction] Trigger: A creature is within the way station.
Effect The vision of Dahak appears in a 15-foot space
adjacent to that creature and rolls initiative.

So, it will not start with the breathing weapon even before it would roll iniative.

In my case, the party entered with caution, they entered the first 10 feet (4 of them and also Renali).
Then the Vision manifested. I described as a Dragon made of fire, a vision of flame but so real it seems solid.
So first the Cleric tried to see if he knew something about it with a Knowledge Religion, and did found it about the Vision and how to deal with it concerning the Religion part, he then pray, badly...
Then the Vision used the Breath Weapon and the Cleric managed a critical miss...-
The Fighter hacked at the Visio trying to see if it was solid enough and did poorly on the atempts.
Rogue did some flanking and did badly in trying to hit it.
Renali so the gate opening and did a run for the exit.
The sorcerer did a Knowledge check, failed, and did some lightning.
The cleric did a 3 action Heal, then the Dragon did some more breath weapon and the cleric was down!
The figter hacked some blows on the vision.
The rogue hacked some more also.
Renali come running droped from the ceiling and dragged the cleric (he was 5 feet just after entering the portal) back to the safety of the citadel.
The sorcerer managed her check and discovered all about how to disable the Hazzard (since it´s a magical one i ruled if she did the knowledge she would know there are 3 ways to deal with it).
Then she tried a Dispel Magic and failed (she would need a natural 20 to manage it).
Return to the Vision and more burning of flesh, fighter failed all strikes, and Rogue went for his Thievery Check, he rolled, and a Natural 20 come rolling for him (one of several the party rolled that night on several skill checks).
Presto, no more hazzard!


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Demonknight wrote:
Kennethray wrote:


When the rest of the party went through some time later they were spread out when it formed. I told the table straight up that this was an hazard, similar to what quicksand or a haunting would be. This was because it was one of the first times they had one like this in game. After 2 or 3 more where I give this warning when we roll initiatives I will stop saying that. It should start to become obvious with the fact that hazards act before initiatives are rolled.

That is not quite right, in this case for instance it would do his Manifest:

Manifest [reaction] Trigger: A creature is within the way station.
Effect The vision of Dahak appears in a 15-foot space
adjacent to that creature and rolls initiative.

So, it will not start with the breathing weapon even before it would roll iniative.

In my case, the party entered with caution, they entered the first 10 feet (4 of them and also Renali).
Then the Vision manifested. I described as a Dragon made of fire, a vision of flame but so real it seems solid.
So first the Cleric tried to see if he knew something about it with a Knowledge Religion, and did found it about the Vision and how to deal with it concerning the Religion part, he then pray, badly...
Then the Vision used the Breath Weapon and the Cleric managed a critical miss...-
The Fighter hacked at the Visio trying to see if it was solid enough and did poorly on the atempts.
Rogue did some flanking and did badly in trying to hit it.
Renali so the gate opening and did a run for the exit.
The sorcerer did a Knowledge check, failed, and did some lightning.
The cleric did a 3 action Heal, then the Dragon did some more breath weapon and the cleric was down!
The figter hacked some blows on the vision.
The rogue hacked some more also.
Renali come running droped from the ceiling and dragged the cleric (he was 5 feet just after entering the portal) back to the safety of the citadel.
The sorcerer managed her check and discovered all about how to disable the...

My point was that hazards do a thing then initiative is rolled. It forming was its thing, not damaging like other hazards but not all hazards do, like quicksand. The process of how things happen then initiative should point it out as a hazard.


Kennethray wrote:
My point was that hazards do a thing then initiative is rolled. It forming was its thing, not damaging like other hazards but not all hazards do, like quicksand. The process of how things happen then initiative should point it out as a hazard

My mistake, i interpreted that as the hazard started making a breath weapon as soon as it appeared.


I have a few questions about the tainted gold.

First 10 mins and a DC 25 craft check removes the arsenic but what happens to the poison? Do we now have pure gold and an amount of arsenic? If so how much? The Arsenic could be just as valuable as the gold you are removing it from.

OR

Is it a "Magical" Contominant that can only be removed/destroyed not collected?


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I would rule it as destroyed unless removing it was a critical success, but don't have any particular rule to back that up.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

I ran it as if they just neutralized the arsenic, but that was just my call. The party kept the bar still contaminated for some vague future use. One proposal was to have a fake treasure in the keep so if any tried to rob them, it would kill them.


Timeshadow wrote:

I have a few questions about the tainted gold.

First 10 mins and a DC 25 craft check removes the arsenic but what happens to the poison? Do we now have pure gold and an amount of arsenic? If so how much? The Arsenic could be just as valuable as the gold you are removing it from.

OR

Is it a "Magical" Contominant that can only be removed/destroyed not collected?

I would say the arsenic is neutralized in the process of cleaning the bars, unless the player specifically asks if he can gather the arsenic.

Then i would increase the DC and maybe even the fortitude roll required to avoid being poisoned.


Hey - my players have have come up with a way to pretty much completely negate the dragon pillar encounters. they use invisibility, then mage hand a bedroll or equivalent light item on top of the pillars eyes, making it essentially blind. the DP entry specifically says it sees through its eyes, so presumably attacks using them for sight. Does anyone have a way that this shouldn't work? Or some other way to get around this? they discovered this on DP 2/8! so I'd rather not have 6 encounters made much easier due to something this simple. I realise that player creativity should be rewarded, but negation of 6 sever enc seems way too much!


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dharkus wrote:
Hey - my players have have come up with a way to pretty much completely negate the dragon pillar encounters. they use invisibility, then mage hand a bedroll or equivalent light item on top of the pillars eyes, making it essentially blind. the DP entry specifically says it sees through its eyes, so presumably attacks using them for sight. Does anyone have a way that this shouldn't work? Or some other way to get around this? they discovered this on DP 2/8! so I'd rather not have 6 encounters made much easier due to something this simple. I realise that player creativity should be rewarded, but negation of 6 sever enc seems way too much!

As a GM you have to give the players credit when they come up with something clever. My players figured out that a successful 3rd level Dispel Magic will disable the pillar (level 4 counteract). It worked the first time; the caster does have to get in range to do it. Let's see if they can do it to the rest of them.

Remember, they still have to fight the protecting monsters. Those seem to be the real challenge of the pillar encounters. (Also, finding the locations of the pillars, in the first place.)


Singularity wrote:
dharkus wrote:
Hey - my players have have come up with a way to pretty much completely negate the dragon pillar encounters. they use invisibility, then mage hand a bedroll or equivalent light item on top of the pillars eyes, making it essentially blind. the DP entry specifically says it sees through its eyes, so presumably attacks using them for sight. Does anyone have a way that this shouldn't work? Or some other way to get around this? they discovered this on DP 2/8! so I'd rather not have 6 encounters made much easier due to something this simple. I realise that player creativity should be rewarded, but negation of 6 sever enc seems way too much!

As a GM you have to give the players credit when they come up with something clever. My players figured out that a successful 3rd level Dispel Magic will disable the pillar (level 4 counteract). It worked the first time; the caster does have to get in range to do it. Let's see if they can do it to the rest of them.

Remember, they still have to fight the protecting monsters. Those seem to be the real challenge of the pillar encounters. (Also, finding the locations of the pillars, in the first place.)

Those creatures protecting the pillars might also present complications with this specific method of disarming the pillars. The one with the dominated Grippli, for instance, could order them to remove the bedroll.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

In one encounter my party had used a boat as a sort of turtle shell to get close then ram it over and over. They had came up with the idea to do pretty much the same idea as the bedroll with mage hand but with a blanket. I deemed it a hostile action since the intent was to blind it so it could be destroyed. So it would be initiative then if they succeed with some easy roll, success. Since it was not an automatic success and there was a slight chance of failure they didn't go for it. Though to be honest I was thinking the same that they just found a way to completely bypass an entire chapter. If it wasn't the second pillar, maybe the last or second to last I may have even made it easier. Also dont forget that it is constantly raining if they havenot destroyed that one pillar, bedrolls get real heavy when they start holding water.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Remember, Invisibility doesn't equal automatic success on stealth checks anymore. To Avoid being Noticed by the Dragon Pillar you still need to beat its perception DC, and the perception DCs of whatever else is guarding it. Also, if there are other creatures around they should be able to remove a blanket or bedroll with an interact action. If there aren't, the pillar likely won't be much of a solo challenge anyway.


yep, this was the black/blue one (i mixed up the colours when reading so it petrified but had the half dragon) and they'd taken out the half dragon already, so could just hit it freely - might take a few mins even but they could dmg it so it got destroyed without any effort as can't attack back if it can't see


MDKaiser wrote:
I can't seem to find the answer to this: Why do the holy protectors of Huntergate not demand the portal key back the second the PCs arrive in the Mwangi Expanse? This has been their sacred mission for thousands of years and now they let a bunch of bumbling fools run around the jungle with the thing that (in their opinion) might very well free the Great Darkness...

In my campaign they absolutely did and brought them to town as "guests" with the tips of their spears. After the PC:s did a spectacular PR and impressed them with their skills they offered the PC:s to become the new Gatekeepers if they help them with the Cult of Cinder (especially as their original keeper failed them.


Our group just finished Hellknight Hill yesterday and began Cult of Cinders. All they've done is start repairs on the castle, repair the gate, and scouted it with a familiar (I went ahead and had the familiar trigger the Dahak remnant thing even though I wasn't sure if the familiar should, but didn't want to spend time digging around the rules, and it seemed an intelligent use of a familiar).

Next week, we should actually get to the social events with the Ekujae, and I'm having an issue with making the motivations in the Matchmaking section make any sense.

The Ekujae are described as being borderline xenophobic, especially with non-Elves. A few weeks earlier, a group of Cinderclaws attacked and killed several of the elves to activate and use the gate wherein the Ekujae's ancient nemesis is trapped, and today, the party just pooped out of that same gate. The party has the opportunity to speak with Nketiah for maybe 30 minutes of in-universe time before she decides to approach these complete strangers and recruit them to engage in a high-school level plot to encourage a romantic tryst involving her father? Why the heck would she have anywhere near enough trust in these people to involve them in her intimate family matters?

I honestly cannot think of any way that this makes any sense. I also cannot find any way to make it make sense. I'm probably going to go ahead and present it as written, but knowing my party, none of them are going to be interested in getting involved because they're either afraid of messing things up or they think it's a stupid idea in the first place (which I also kind of agree with). The average age of my play group is in the 30's, and this story line seems more appropriate to people who watch the Disney Channel.


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First off, you have the timing of the scene wrong. It happens during the feast, which happens the night the party arrives, leaving them most of a day to wander Akrivel with Nketiah as a translator. Nketiah and the party will be quite well acquainted at that point, and she'll know whether or not she can trust them. Incidentally, that scene also makes clear that if Nketiah doesn't trust the party, she won't ask them for help with Jahsi.

So at the end of the day, if you think that Nketiah categorically would not trust the PCs with this task, then you can just skip the scene. However, I think that's an inaccurate read of Nketiah's character.

The Ekujae are distrustful of outsiders, but also respect other cultures enough to give half-elves a lauded place in their society as a 'link between worlds'. The first Ekujae who encounters the PCs is Jahsi, who is explicitly much more welcoming of outsiders than the rest of his people. He's also a keledi, which means that his word is well respected within the Leopard Clan. While the group of Ekujae who meet the PCs see them as outsiders having just come out of a portal they were sworn to defend, the rest see them as guests endorsed by a hero of unfaltering purity. In Nketiah's case, endorsed by her father, whom she respects.

Akosa's comment sums it up best, I think: "Jahsi brought you here and Nketiah says you’re a guest, so you could come straight from Hell and I’d still have to feed you." Jahsi and Nketiah's endorsement go a long way with the Ekujae, and both Jahsi and Nketiah are more accepting of outsiders than a 'typical' Ekujae.

The fact that these people also intend to ask the party to go explore a 10 mile radius of hostile jungle to find a cultist encampment may also help. I'm not sure playing match maker is a bigger ask of an outsider than risking their life to save the clan.

As for your Disney Channel comments, I just ran that scene for a group of adults who loved it. They also went to YouTube to find "Kiss the Girl" from The Little Mermaid and said "I play this, but its 'Kiss the Guy' instead", so you're not entirely wrong. The scene is some light hearted whimsy to break up an otherwise doom and gloom portion of the adventure path. If you don't think your party will like it, then don't worry about them saying no to it. There's still the pepper eating contest after all.


I'm still not buying it. It's just way too much of a stretch to me for someone to go from never having seen someone before in their lives to engaging them in arranging a romantic tryst with a family member in less than 24 hours.

And, the timing isn't all that wrong. The party will spend a significant amount of the time between arriving at the town and the feast out on the hunt. The time around the dance contest, talking to the lion, etc. is a couple of hours, at most. And the time during which the party is directly engaging Nketiah in conversation is a fraction of that.

The entire scenario is so achingly cringey to me. I might be projecting a bit, but if I were a player in this AP, I'd totally check out of the game until it was over. Romance between PC's or between PC and NPC can be cringey enough, but facilitating a romance between NPC's....ugh.


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To me, it's exactly as much of a stretch as going from never having seen someone before in their lives to asking them to risk life and limb for you in less than 24 hours.

Nketiah will be (presumably) translating for the party in that time, which means they will be directly communicating with her. Even if she's not translating, she should be accompanying them to make sure they don't cause any trouble. She will be party to all of their interactions with the Ekujae, which will allow her to judge their character.

But at the end of the day, you don't seem to like the premise of the scenario in the first place, regardless of whether or not it's """believable""". That's OK! You don't have to run it if romantic tampering isn't something that interests your table. It's in the book for tables like mine, who adored it. It's not important enough to the adventure path as a whole that you should feel obligated not to cut it.


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Short and sweet, if you think your players won't enjoy it, don't do it.

Personally, my group had a blast doing it and it became a nice touchstone fore the Ekujae interactions. Romance shouldn't be cringey, but rather a beautiful expression of one's feelings. Fits right in a TRPG in my opinion.


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Yeah, my party also engaged in all possible Ekujae interactions and they loved the reputation and XP system in it as well. The romance scene was great, even though I changed NPCs a bit. There was some dramatic moments which my party loved and it was like "love amid the war" situation, these moments they tell even after 3 years will pass, not another 3 dragon totems they have defeated.


My party is going towards the Fortress of Sorrow with a few dragon totems still. I'm a little confused about how Dahak's Shell works. The Shell doesn't have a routine listed. Does that mean it can shoot 3 beams a turn? It would seem kind of weird if up to 8 totems would still only shoot once a turn.


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Hmm. Reading the rules regarding hazards, it doesn't seem like there's a standard number of actions a hazard gets per round if it doesn't have a routine. "The number of actions a hazard can take each round, as well as what they can be used for, depend on the hazard." is the best insight I've got.

Reading the entry for "eye beam" more closely, it doesn't look like that particular action has a means of selecting the color of the beam, even though the reaction version does. I would interpret this to mean that each active color is supposed to get a beam each turn.

That said, the most dangerous part of having too many colors active is the Shell Defense property. That will hit anyone who tries to pass through the shell with every active color at once, which is almost certainly death if it's all 8. Playing it safe and only letting the shell get 3 max, or even only 1 per round is probably fine.

I think the goal of the Shell as a hazard is to encourage the PCs to deal with all of the pillars before they enter the fortress. As long as it is menacing enough to make the party think twice about an early assault on the fortress, I'd say it's doing its job.


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I think this hazard only has a reaction (prismatic beam ranged attack), otherwise it would have a routine listed. Take a look at other hazards in the CRB for comparison.


I’m sorry - I’m not entirely sure how to run the Vision of Dahak hazard. Granted, I never really got the hang of running Haunts in 1E, and it appears the tradition continues.

It has a stealth of +16 (Expert) - does that mean characters that are Expert in perception get a perception check before it manifests? If so, what does a success actually provide the player? Or is the stealth bonus purely for its initiative (in which case what does the (Expert) signify)?

Do the appropriate characters simply “know” that a Religion check can be used to disable it (or a thievery check or a dispel magic)? Or is there some appropriate recall knowledge check that has to be done first to give them this info?


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Yes, in general players get a secret perception check to detect a hazard before it does anything. Since the Vision of Dahak has a minimum proficiency required, they must be experts in perception and be actively Searching (DC 26).

CRB page 520 wrote:
During exploration, determine whether the party detects a hazard when the PCs first enter the general area in which it appears. If the hazard doesn’t list a minimum proficiency rank, roll a secret Perception check against the hazard’s Stealth DC for each PC. For hazards with a minimum proficiency rank, roll only if someone is actively searching (using the Search activity while exploring or the Seek action in an encounter), and only if they have the listed proficiency rank or higher.


What benefit would they get on a success? A feeling that something is about to happen, and they can try to stop it before it manifests with prayers/disable/dispel magic? Or does it manifest anyway and they just kind of have the drop on it?


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They can attempt to disable it before it does anything. In this particular case I'd rule the vision doesn't manifest until someone tries to exit (per one of the triggers listed in the adventure on page 9), so if they detect it ahead of time it can be disabled with a prayer or dispel magic.

CRB page 521 wrote:
A character must first detect a hazard (or have it pointed out to them) to try to deactivate it. They can attempt to deactivate a hazard whether or not it has already been triggered, though some hazards no longer pose a danger once their reactions have occurred, especially if there is no way for them to be reset.


Thank you very much!


Page 70 of the AP says that Fatigue sets in after 4 hours of activity due to the heat. If that's the case, when should the players reach the encounters and how can they do any exploration actions if the Fatigued condition says you can't choose an Exploration activity.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Hi all! Friday night my group did "Session 0 of Book 2" -- two months of downtime to repair the castle, earn income, befriend some NPCs, gather info, and buy/sell/craft stuff. They were interestingly into all of the basic castle repairs and there were some nice story moments even in a downtime-only session.

In reading over Book 2 again in detail, it is true that neither the Asanbosam (p.80) nor Living Sap (p.89) show up in the adventure as written? I can't tell if I'm just glossing over something obvious. Are they there simply for possible random jungle encounters?


MagicJMS wrote:

Hi all! Friday night my group did "Session 0 of Book 2" -- two months of downtime to repair the castle, earn income, befriend some NPCs, gather info, and buy/sell/craft stuff. They were interestingly into all of the basic castle repairs and there were some nice story moments even in a downtime-only session.

In reading over Book 2 again in detail, it is true that neither the Asanbosam (p.80) nor Living Sap (p.89) show up in the adventure as written? I can't tell if I'm just glossing over something obvious. Are they there simply for possible random jungle encounters?

Yep, exactly. I think every book includes a creature or two that never appears in it. Both for crafting additional encounters and to add to the bestiary of the game in general. For example, Hellknight Hill doesn't actually feature any of the Anadi included in the back, as the only Anadi in the adventure is Renali and she gets her own stat block.


Fumarole wrote:

Yes, in general players get a secret perception check to detect a hazard before it does anything. Since the Vision of Dahak has a minimum proficiency required, they must be experts in perception and be actively Searching (DC 26).

CRB page 520 wrote:
During exploration, determine whether the party detects a hazard when the PCs first enter the general area in which it appears. If the hazard doesn’t list a minimum proficiency rank, roll a secret Perception check against the hazard’s Stealth DC for each PC. For hazards with a minimum proficiency rank, roll only if someone is actively searching (using the Search activity while exploring or the Seek action in an encounter), and only if they have the listed proficiency rank or higher.

Outstanding resource: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ7cXtW-dt4


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Corsair179 wrote:
Outstanding resource: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ7cXtW-dt4

Linkified.


Sporkedup wrote:
MagicJMS wrote:

Hi all! Friday night my group did "Session 0 of Book 2" -- two months of downtime to repair the castle, earn income, befriend some NPCs, gather info, and buy/sell/craft stuff. They were interestingly into all of the basic castle repairs and there were some nice story moments even in a downtime-only session.

In reading over Book 2 again in detail, it is true that neither the Asanbosam (p.80) nor Living Sap (p.89) show up in the adventure as written? I can't tell if I'm just glossing over something obvious. Are they there simply for possible random jungle encounters?

Yep, exactly. I think every book includes a creature or two that never appears in it. Both for crafting additional encounters and to add to the bestiary of the game in general. For example, Hellknight Hill doesn't actually feature any of the Anadi included in the back, as the only Anadi in the adventure is Renali and she gets her own stat block.

My people also took the time to do all the basic repairs to the citadel. I'm also thinking about using some asanbosam in a random encounter because my one PC (the gnome fighter) really wants to climb a tree. They also kind of let the blue pillar get away. They let Gerhard take it. It blew my mind! The one PC wanted to destroy the non functional white pillar but didn't care enough about this one for some reason. How should I handle that? They also went to the village of the elephant people and are exploring EVERY hex south of the river first. So they're going to encounter Dahak's shell without destroying any pillars, but hopefully once they see it they'll figure out what they need to do. I think I'll just have Gerhard's boat near his second encounter so they can redeem themselves.


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Sir NotAppearingInThisFilm wrote:

I’m sorry - I’m not entirely sure how to run the Vision of Dahak hazard. Granted, I never really got the hang of running Haunts in 1E, and it appears the tradition continues.

It has a stealth of +16 (Expert) - does that mean characters that are Expert in perception get a perception check before it manifests? If so, what does a success actually provide the player? Or is the stealth bonus purely for its initiative (in which case what does the (Expert) signify)?

Do the appropriate characters simply “know” that a Religion check can be used to disable it (or a thievery check or a dispel magic)? Or is there some appropriate recall knowledge check that has to be done first to give them this info?

To clarify a few things here. The players will only get a chance to notice the hazard before it goes off if they don't all step through at once, because once they are all in the tunnel the haunt triggers. But if one or two people go in there using Search and succeed, they should be able to realize there is something unholy and dangerous there. They should be able to take their time observing and disabling it until they critically fail the disable check, all the PCs enter the way station, or someone tries to exit the Mwangi side.

At this point, the rules get a little hazy. How does a PC learn the tricks to disable it? How do you identify that it is a hazard and not a creature if it does trigger? Well, usually identifying something is based on its level adjusted for rarity, in this case for a DC 29. Religion is the obvious choice here to do so, but you might allow Arcana because dragons or even Occultism because spirits. Heck, even Nature makes sense when it comes to redirecting the flow of fiery energy using theivery. At which point we might as well say that this just uses an Identify Magic activity, at least out of combat. (And really, this was kind of the obvious answer all along.)

But then we get to what happens if it triggers. So first off, the book tells us that a DC 20 Religion check for Recall Knowledge recognizes this as Dahak. One could make a good case that the DC would be lowered once you're seeing this thing in action, and allow a reattempt for someone who failed to Identify Magic. At bare minimum, I'd say recognizing that this is Dahak would be worth telling the player that evoking his father Apsu's protection might be helpful, even if they don't realize it is a hazard.

Now we have the final hurdle: disabling it. We know how many actions it takes to dispel magic and to disable a device with the Thievery skill, though how positioning factors in is unclear. As is exactly what the Disable Device check looks like in fiction. Personally I think it should be done using the Hunter Gate key in a manner similar to fixing the gate,and I'd probably allow crafting to be used too.

What we don't know is how many actions a Religion check to disable takes, or any other skill. A good default house rule is 2 actions and just treat it as a Disable Device activity using a different skill. But you might also expect a prayer to the gods to require your full concentration, AKA all 3 actions. Or at least assign a penalty if someone uses less actions.

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