DD - 2B question

[Jenceslav]

During our first playthrough of Dragon's Demand 2B scenario (A Piece of the Auction), the interaction between the location Plaza and Scenario rules became somewhat unclear:

Storybook wrote:

When you encounter a boon from a location, before acting, succeed at … If you acquire the boon, put it into a winnings pile

Plaza wrote:

When you would encounter a boon, draw a new one of the same type, encounter 1 and banish the other

If any boon is flipped over at the start of the exploration, another one is drawn from the box. But the scenario power states that the boon has to be encountered from a location. Does it mean that if the original boon is banished as we like the other one better, the scenario power does not trigger as the boon did not come from a location? That seems really harsh, if that is true. And what would become with such boon - would it go directly into character's hand if acquired and to the box if it wasn't acquired?

Can anyone shine a little bit of (wall of) light on this? Thank you

As a side note, we forgot to put the non-acquired boons to a hoard pile, which only a second reading through the text (now) revealed. Ugh, I have to read more carefully. Still, with Seelah and her Diplomacy + upgraded "Crusade" ability (reacharge top card if it's armor or blessing to aid local checks) along with Ezren's Magic-trait 1d4 shenanigans, we acquired so many boons it was OK. We even had to throw away a Keen Rapier as we had too many nice magic weapons for both of us, counting Wyrmsmite.

[jduteau]

IMO, The original boon and the one you drew should both be considered to be from the Plaza and thus the Scenario rules apply.

[Frencois]

Yes but you have to select the one you encounter BEFORE rolling to see if the difficulty will be higher (this is important since you have to decide what level of risk you take).

Spoiler:

We were very good at always selecting the easiest one to make sure to win the scenario... and when you have enough, go on selecting the hard ones to get valuable boons.

OK, having Hakon and Lem in the group helps A LOT.

[PinkRose]

When does Merisiel's Evade come into play?
Steps I'm taking.

Meri flips the Hour. Benefaction, no effecct.
Flips over top card. Mace.
Draws another weapon. Flaming Mace (Awesome)
Chooses to encounter the Flaming Mace, banishes the Mace.
Now, since she is encountering the Flaming Mace, she has to attempt the Diplomacy check. Fails with a 1. Increase check of Flaming Mace, 10+8=18 Strength or Melee check.
Meri NOW Evades.
Flaming Mace gets shuffled into location.
Hope that Valeros encounters the Flaming Mace.

Correct steps?

[Brother Tyler]

The option to evade must be taken before any roll to defeat/acquire. Once you make any checks to defeat/acquire, you suffer/enjoy the consequences of the check and may no longer evade.

In the location described above, you choose to either encounter the card (and thus draw a second card to pick which one you encounter), or you evade. So once you draw the second card, you're may no longer evade. (I'm not 100% certain on this one, but that's how I play it.)

[PinkRose]

I got excited. And tried to cheat.
Meri can't evade because Valeros and Lem are at the Plaza watching her. So this is all null.

However, if she was playing solo, I think you're right and wrong. Her power says, "When you encounter a card..." So she has to have a card to encounter first. And once you have the card, you have to draw a second and choose one. I haven't made any rolls yet.
If I have to evade before a check, I wonder if the scenario roll happens before I evade or not. (Not that it matters, she's going to fail)

[Sathar]

Ugh, it looks like this one might be thornier than it seems. Contrary to BT's point, in Core the Evasion Effects step is after the When You Encounter step, so RAW you would draw a boon from the location, draw a matching boon from the box, banish one/encounter the other, THEN evade (or not) THEN ("Before Acting") roll the Cha/Dip/Per check.

edit: I was going to clarify my point, but skizzerz maganged to ninja me with a better summary.

Spoiler:

It does appear that if you manage to evade your boon, you shuffle in the boon you actually encountered and not necessarily the one which you initially drew from the location. At first that feels like violating the rule that Summoned cards always go back to the box, however the plaza rule doesn't say "Summon a card and choose one" but rather "When you would...then do this" which is a fancy way of saying "Instead", such that the new card becomes in essence the card you drew for your encounter.

[skizzerz]

Check the encounter sequence. Nothing thorny about it—the rules are very clear as to when you apply each effect.

Encountering a Card
1. Apply any effects that happen when you encounter a card.
2. Apply any evasion effects.
3. Villain Step: Attempt to guard distant locations.
4. Apply any effects that happen before acting.
5. Attempt the check.
6. Attempt the next check, if needed.
7. Apply any effects that happen after acting.
8. Resolve the encounter.
9. Avenge the encounter.
10. Villain Step: If you defeat the villain, close the villain’s location. 11. Villain Step: Determine whether the villain escapes.
12. Villain Step: If the villain has nowhere to escape to, you win!

From the OP, the Storybook power is before acting (step 4). The Plaza power is when you encounter (step 1). Merisiel can evade during step 2.

[Yewstance]

So, could someone explain to me why a boon summoned by the Plaza's effect counts as "from the location"? Keep in mind that "Location" is just the new term to mean "Location Deck", since 'deck' is now exclusively used to refer to character decks.

I would think that, by nature of it being summoned (or "New", whatever) it's from the vault, not a location. Would the new drawn boon even be shuffled back into the location if evaded? What rule says to treat it as if it's from the location?

I'm clearly missing something here - I understand the intent, but not the RAW.

[Vic Wertz]

Added to FAQ.

[Gwaihir Scout]

This change makes the auction rules for the scenario apply to boons that you encounter because you defeated a barrier (of which we had three in my game last weekend). Was that intentional, and does it matter if it wasn't?

[Vic Wertz]

We did recognize that this correction had that effect, and decided that it was nevertheless worthwhile.

[eddiephlash]

The change makes flavorful sense as well. It's a mad auction in the large plaza in the center of town. Of course there's tons of extra stuff everywhere, not just at the auction tables.

[wkover]

Sorry for the thread necro, but a quick 2B question:

If the party loses the scenario, do they still get to keep the cards in the winnings pile?

I'm assuming yes (?), but the reward specifically states that beating the scenario lets you keep the won cards. Perhaps implying that if you lose you don't get to keep them. (Because the auction house has burned down and your loot has been left behind?)

Side question: Are the cards in the winnings pile displayed? In a neutral zone? Somewhere else?

If you can't keep the won cards and keep losing, you'll never upgrade your deck and potentially be permanently stuck. Or you'll have to replay previous scenarios until you acquire boons that help you successfully complete 2B.

Thanks...

Note: I'm aware that the "After the Scenario" section of the rulebook specifies that all non-boons should be put back in the vault before rebuilding decks - thereby leaving the boons on the table. Strictly speaking, you could argue that both the winnings and hoard cards (all boons) would remain out of the vault, and characters who lost could rebuild from both piles. But I doubt that's the intention. :)

I'm just a bit unclear as to how the "after the scenario" rules interact with this particular scenario.

P.S. This question has come up specifically because I'm trying a single-character solo DD campaign with core Ezren (for fun), and he's now lost 2B eight consecutive times. The best he's gotten so far in terms of a winnings/hoard pile is 5-5 - which he's done twice. Getting a 6-4 balance is proving to be almost impossible, particularly if he can't upgrade his deck between scenarios...

[skizzerz]

wkover wrote:

Sorry for the thread necro, but a quick 2B question:

If the party loses the scenario, do they still get to keep the cards in the winnings pile?

I'm assuming yes (?), but the reward specifically states that beating the scenario lets you keep the won cards. Perhaps implying that if you lose you don't get to keep them. (Because the auction house has burned down and your loot has been left behind?)

Side question: Are the cards in the winnings pile displayed? In a neutral zone? Somewhere else?

If you can't keep the won cards and keep losing, you'll never upgrade your deck and potentially be permanently stuck. Or you'll have to replay previous scenarios until you acquire boons that help you successfully complete 2B.

Thanks...

Note: I'm aware that the "After the Scenario" section of the rulebook specifies that all non-boons should be put back in the vault before rebuilding decks - thereby leaving the boons on the table. Strictly speaking, you could argue that both the winnings and hoard cards (all boons) would remain out of the vault, and characters who lost could rebuild from both piles. But I doubt that's the intention. :)

I'm just a bit unclear as to how the "after the scenario" rules interact with this particular scenario.

P.S. This question has come up specifically because I'm trying a single-character solo DD campaign with core Ezren (for fun), and he's now lost 2B eight consecutive times. The best he's gotten so far in terms of a winnings/hoard pile is 5-5 - which he's done twice. Getting a 6-4 balance is proving to be almost impossible, particularly if he can't upgrade his deck between scenarios...

Boons in those piles are not eligible to rebuild your deck with.

Rulebook p17: "Start by combining your discards with your hand, your deck, your bury pile, and any cards you displayed" -- nowhere does it say the other non-displayed boons left on the table are eligible to rebuild with.

If you are playing via home game rules, I would personally say that you're able to rebuild with the winnings pile even though you lost.

If you are playing via PACS rules, note the following rule that guarantees you'll be eligible for at least one deck upgrade (although it may not be a particularly useful one):

Quote:

If the number of cards in the center of the play area is less than the total number of deck upgrades needed by the party, roll 1d6, consult the table below, and add a random card of that type. Continue rolling and adding until the number of cards is equal to the number of deck upgrades needed.

d6 Roll Card Type
1 Weapon
2 Spell
3 Armor
4 Item
5 Ally
6 Blessing

[wkover]

Thanks. Yes, playing a home game.

Ezren did eventually beat 2B solo on the 10th (!) try, allowing for upgrades from the winnings pile.

[skizzerz]

wkover wrote:

Thanks. Yes, playing a home game.

Ezren did eventually beat 2B solo on the 10th (!) try, allowing for upgrades from the winnings pile.

Congrats! When you repeatedly run into a roadblock like that in a home game, that’s when I’d look into bending some rules in order to make actual progress. There’s no shame in doing so, the rulebook even says Play It Your Way :)

[Matsu Kurisu]

Cool! Glad you made it through